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New member Username: GaletNetherlands Post Number: 1 Registered: Aug-07 | I have an LG HDD/DVD Recorder (model RH178H) and a Sony KDL-40D3000 LCD TV. When connected via a SCART cable, everything works correctly. When I remove the SCART cable and attach an HDMI cable between the two devices, it's as if there was no connection at all. I've followed these steps on the Sony TV (while it was connected via the HDMI cable): MENU button > Settings > Set-up > HDMI Set-Up. Here I choose HDMI Control = ON and pick Device List Update. I then get the following message: Do you want to update the HDMI device list? Please power on the devices and activate each HDMI control setting before updating. I don't know what "HDMI control settings" I am supposed to activate, but I power up the DVD recorder and wait a minute before pressing OK on the Sony TV to start the recognition process. After a brief pause, the following message appears: - HDMI Device List - No devices detected. Please check the connections or settings of the device. I wasn't able to find any useful information in the user manual for the Sony or the LG. Does anyone have any suggestions?} |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 1744 Registered: Feb-04 | Ben, this simple setup should be working. However I have two points: 1) Do you have the TV switched to the TV's HDMI input that the LG's HDMI connector is connected to during the set up procedure? 2) Try switching the LG's sampling frequency to 48 kHz. This is a shot in the dark as I believe the TV should be more than capable of accepting a 96 kHz signal. 3) Can this recorder actually record an HDTV signal? If not, there's not really an absolutely compelling reason to use HDMI connection. Scart will do fine for regular DVDs I think. |
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New member Username: GaletNetherlands Post Number: 2 Registered: Aug-07 | Hello John, Thank you for your assistance. As I still have not been able to get this working, I will respond to your suggestions in sequence. 1) The Sony television has three HDMI inputs, and I have tried connecting the cable to each of them before performing the "recognition" process. Unfortunately it's not possible to select any of these inputs until they have been "recognized". If I press the MENU button and choose External Input, I get a list that begins with HDMI Device Selection, followed by AV1 though AV7 and, lastly, PC. The first choice is grayed out and thus cannot be selected. 2) I read about switching the LG's sampling frequency in the user's manual, but the information printed there indicated that this only affects the sound, not the picture. Nonetheless, I have just tested the effect of this setting. It seems to make no difference. 3)According to the user manual, the LG RH178H can output at the following resolutions: 720(1440)x576i, 720x576p, 1280x720p, or 1920x1080i. The Sony TV user's manual lists the following resolutions for the HDMI inputs: 1080/24p, 1080p, 1080i, 720p, 576p, 576i, 480p, 480i. The DVD player apparently performs "up conversion" (this is printed on a sticker attached to the housing) to generate a 1080i signal. I assume that this would produce a better image than is possible with the SCART cable. My thoughts at this point are: a) Perhaps the DVD player uses a non-standard HDMI connection. I have read that the standard was/is not strictly defined. The only information I can find about this in the LG manual is that it has a "Type A" HDMI output. b) Perhaps the HDMI cable is no good. I consider this unlikely because it is brand new and I unpacked it from undamaged hard plastic packaging. The connectors are stamped with the HDMI logo. c) Perhaps the firmware in the Sony television is waiting for a handshake from the LG that the LG does not produce. I'm considering taking the LG to the store where I bought it to ask them to hook it to a Sony television via the HDMI cable. (I bought the television from an Internet discounter, so they don't have a showroom.) Any more thoughts you (or anyone else) may have about this problem will be appreciated. |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 1747 Registered: Feb-04 | Ben, there are three types of HDMI connectors. They are all completely different from each other, so there's no possibility of misconnection. There are different versions of HDMI, however they are all supposed to be backward compatible to the previous version. So neither the physical connector nor the specific versions involved should not be your problem in this application. My other thought was that maybe the LG needed some sort of user HDMI activation, but there's no mention of that in the manual. So we must assume that is not the problem. The HDMI cable could be defective, but I agree that is very unlikely. I am not sure what the resolution limits of SCART is. I think that, with the right equipment SCART will support up to 576p, but nothing above that. The only reason I suggested you using SCART instead of HDMI is that most modern fixed-pixel HD ready displays like your Sony upconvert all signals up to 1080i (or even p) anyway. The question then is whether the scaler is better in the LG or the Sony. Given Sony's reputation in video my money is on the TV. That said, the HDMI should definitely work. I do think we should not automatically assign blame to the LG. The TV is not above suspicion here. If you can hook up the LG to another TV, it would be useful. It doesn't have to be a Sony TV either. (It's probably better if it isn't a Sony.) If the LG's HDMI signal is recognized by any TV, then the blame would most certainly be the Sony. As a last resort, you could contact both Sony and LG about this problem. |
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New member Username: GaletNetherlands Post Number: 3 Registered: Aug-07 | Hi John, Thanks for sticking with me on this tough problem. I especially appreciated the link to the information about the various HDMI cable types. I still haven't found a solution, but I'm planning to take the LG player to the store where I bought it tomorrow. They have been helpful in the past, so it shouldn't be any problem plugging the player into several different TVs. I'll let you know the outcome. |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 1752 Registered: Feb-04 | Yes Ben, I am eagerly waiting the outcome. It is most interesting to me. |
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New member Username: GaletNetherlands Post Number: 4 Registered: Aug-07 | Hello John, I've just been to the dealer where I bought the LG player. We connected it via the HDMI cable to an LG TV and a Sony. It worked perfectly in both cases. For the Sony, the salesperson cycled through all the inputs until he found the right one. You'll remember that on my Sony KDL-40D3000, the input menu contains the following choices: HDMI Device Selection, AV1, AV2, AV3, AV4, AV5, AV6, AV7, PC. This time, instead of assuming I should look under "HDMI Device Selection" for a HDMI device, I just tried all the inputs, one at a time (it takes 10-15 seconds for each one to come up on the screen). I found it on AV4. Apparently the HDMI Device Selection has to do with the "HDMI device list" (see first message in this thread). I guess this is related to the feature for simultaneous control of devices attached via HDMI (that a home theater system switches on with the TV, for example). Apparently either the LG doesn't support this feature or the Sony simply doesn't recognize the LG. That's no big deal. I'm just glad I've got a picture via HDMI. I feel a bit stupid about the whole thing, but I have to say that at least part of the blame has to go to the confusing on-screen menu and the sadly uninformative user's manual. I hope this thread will help anyone else who may encounter the same problem. Once again, John, thanks for helping me resolve this problem! |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 1758 Registered: Feb-04 | Allright Ben! I knew there had to be a simple solution to this problem. You hit the nail on the head with "...I have to say that at least part of the blame has to go to the confusing on-screen menu and the sadly uninformative user's manual." Over the years, it has been my experience that Sony's products exhibit first-rate quality and quality control in mass production. On the other hand, their inadequate owner's manuals and frustrating non-ergonomic user interfaces have become a company trademark for me. For example, I have one of their simple clock-radios that has been relegated to a guest bedroom because I can't fugure out how to operate the damn thing. Let me see if I understand here. Does this mean that the other two HDMI inputs will be found on AV5 and AV6? |
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New member Username: GaletNetherlands Post Number: 5 Registered: Aug-07 | Hi John, That pretty much sums up my impression of Sony, too. Here in the Netherlands we can opt for digital cable service at no extra charge. Sony advertises that this set includes a built-in DVB-C tuner so no set-top box is required. I'm glad I searched the online forums in advance so I knew what I'd be facing, because Sony provides zero information on this issue. The truth of the matter is that the digital signal from the cable company is encoded. The Sony TV is equipped with a Common Interface (CI) slot into which you must insert a decoder/adapter card called a Conditional Access Module (CAM). There is only one on the market that can decode the Irdeto 2 coding used here (it's the AlphaCrypt Classic CAM). Because the firmware in this card also includes the decoding algorithms for 5 or 6 other coding schemes (used in other European countries?) and each has its own licensing fee, the card is very expensive (the best price I could find was 109 euros plus tax). Then you have to insert the card from the cable company into the CAM. Our cable company calls this a "smart card", and charges 15 euros for it (you don't actually buy it, it remains the property of the cable company). The only problem is that you have to get the smart card through a dealer, and almost every dealer sells them as part of a package that includes a digital tuner! The cable company will only ship a dealer a pack of about 100 cards at a time, and since there is little demand, there are few dealers stocking the cards. You gotta love it! You asked about the other inputs on the Sony TV. It's got a whole slew of 'em. Taking a closer look, they're all labeled with a number. I guess that should have been another clue, too. From left to right across the back, you've got: 4 HDMI 5 HDMI w/ 2 RCA audio inputs PC IN 1 SCART 2 SCART (with the text SMART LINK printed above) 3 separate RGB and audio inputs DIGITAL OUT (optical) L and R out and on the side are a few more: 7 HDMI 6 various inputs for a camcorder headphone jack Thanks again, John. If there turn out to be any more surprises once I get my "smart card", I'll let you know. |