Facts About DishPro Equipment and FTA Receivers
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2716 Registered: Oct-05 | FTA v. DN Receiver Power Output. FTA Most FTA Receivers put out 13v for Vertical Polarization and 18v for Horizontal Polarization at 600mA Max DN Receivers These receivers put out 13v for Vertical Polarization and 18v for Horizontal Polarization at 750mA. DishPro Plus v. DishPro LNB's DishProPlus LNB requires 700mA to power up ONLY when using the third LNB input. In other words a three LNB Setup. What this means is that if you are running a DishProPlus LNB for FTA as long as you don't use the third LNB input then your FTA Receiver will power this setup without a problem because it would work as a DishPro Twin/Quad LNB and only require 500mA to power up which is easily supplied by your FTA Receiver. When hooking up a DP34 Switch to a DishPro Twin LNB the power requirement jumps to 550mA which is still easily supplied by your current FTA Receiver. Where people run into problems is when hooking up a third LNB to the DP34 as the power requirement then goes up to 600mA which is the max output of a FTA Receiver. Having said that, the purpose of running a DP34 switch is to be able to run multiple FTA Receivers on a Three LNB System which is why people seem to think they need a Power Insert. This, however, is a misconception because more than one FTA Receiver will be used and even if only two FTA Receivers are used they WILL provide more then enough power to run the setup. Last but not least is the misconception of having to leave the receiver on! Not sure where this came from, but if you think about what I'm about to say for a little while, it will make sense. Why is it that we disconnect all receivers in a setup from the Wall Outlets when messing around with cables and switches? To avoid damaging your switches (you know the DISEcQ's that everyone seems to be blowing). This is because even when turned off, the receiver, be it FTA or SUB, will continue to provide power to the LNB's. Hence the reason you do not need to keep the receiver turned ON! LNB Power Requirements & Polarization DishPro Plus is an LNB used by Echostar systems. It is used on the Dish 500 and some of the Super Dishs. It has 2 outputs, and 1 input, using stacked polarity technology, (Converts the H polarity to V, interlacing it with the existing V polarity signals) resulting in only V polarity allowing longer cable runs (over 200 feet) by using only 13 volt LNB power and uses either Circular polarization or Linear polarization. It can be used with DPP and DP series switches (loses DPP functions when used with a DP34 however), as well as the new Dishpro Plus Separators |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2718 Registered: Oct-05 | Dish Pro Twin or Quad & Dish Pro Plus Twin I am going to attempt to clarify what appears to be a big confusion for some and the topic of misquoting for others. First things first -- Dish Pro Equipment is very FTA Friendly and probably the easiest to set up. It is the setup and understanding of this equipment that give some people headaches. There is a big difference between Dish Pro LNB's and Dish Pro Plus. Similarities: - They both have a built in switch which allows for direct connection to the receiver. - They can be used to bring in the signal of any combination of two satellites provided they are less then 10 degrees apart. - They work with most if not all FTA Receiver on the market today. - They can be mounted on a Dish500 dish. - DISEqC Software requirements are the same for both LNBs. Differences: - Power requirement for the Dish Pro Plus is slightly higher then the regular Dish Pro which may create the necessity to either keep a DN Receiver connected to port #1 of the LNB or to use a Power Insert. This will only be an issue if you are running a third LNB. Your FTA receiver will not supply sufficient power for all three LNB's. - Dish Pro Plus has a built in 3 way switch and one input which allows you to receive signal from two different satellites with the main LNB and add a third satellite by installing a variety of LNB/Dish combination. - Dish Pro Plus LNB signal can be split when using DN Dual Tuners and a DN Signal Splitter. This will only work with DN Dual Tuners - You CANNOT split the signal with a regular Dish Pro Twin or Quad LNB. Dish Pro 34 Switches and Dish Pro Plus 44 READ CAREFULLY -- While you can use a Dish Pro Switch with Dish Pro Plus LNB's, you CANNOT use a Dish Pro Plus switch with a Dish Pro LNB - Dish Pro 34 switches are very easy to use and install. - The Dish Pro 34 switch does NOT require an addition power source. You can use this switch with any of your FTA Receivers and NOT need to keep your regular DN receiver! Only use this switch to run a 3 satellite 4 receiver system with a Dish Pro Twin LNB. If you are going to run a 2 satellite system and 4 receivers then just use a Dish Pro Quad. - The Dish Pro Plus 44 switch DOES require a power insert which is provided with the switch. I would NOT recommend using this switch as you really don't gain anything with it unless you are running a DN installation with TWO Dual Tuners and at least one FTA STB. Bottom Line -- You can use Dish Pro Plus equipment and if you want the setups I will be more then glad to help you with it, but it is not worth the headache! Even if you have a dual tuner which requires the Dish Pro Plus capabilities, you can always run two lines into that tuner from a regular Dish Pro LNB. Not to mention you can combine the Dish Pro 34 switch with up to 4 switches and get up to 12 receivers! |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 71 Registered: May-07 | Good info here PRFRMNJ! I think you're hitting the nail pretty squarely, but I'll mention a few things. "DishProPlus LNB requires 700mA to power up ONLY when using the third LNB input. In other words a three LNB Setup. What this means is that if you are running a DishProPlus LNB for FTA as long as you don't use the third LNB input then your FTA Receiver will power this setup without a problem because it would work as a DishPro Twin/Quad LNB and only require 500mA to power up which is easily supplied by your FTA Receiver." Well: "only require 500mA". You're talking the MAX end of power output for most receivers, some are less. Plus DDP does draw additional power compared to DP technology, so it's going to be somewhat higher anyway. That being said, I've dealt with many folks who can run DPP without additional powering. Some receivers will run ceratin setups better than others, and even the same models will differ in results. Speaking generally, however, I tend to see most problems occurring with Viewsat setups (but maybe this is because there's just so many Viewsats out there, lol). Without the 3rd LNB running on DPP we still see power problems that are cleared up by running another receiver to the other port of the twin, so there's definitely an issue. The same thing I would say for using DP34 switch. Some will work fine, some have problems (again lots of Viewsats), and the problems can be fixed with a power inserter or DN receiver. "Last but not least is the misconception of having to leave the receiver on! Not sure where this came from, but if you think about what I'm about to say for a little while, it will make sense. Why is it that we disconnect all receivers in a setup from the Wall Outlets when messing around with cables and switches? To avoid damaging your switches (you know the DISEcQ's that everyone seems to be blowing). This is because even when turned off, the receiver, be it FTA or SUB, will continue to provide power to the LNB's. Hence the reason you do not need to keep the receiver turned ON!" You're not going to blow any circuitry leaving power to the system while it is connected. Damage occurs while connecting/disconnecting the live power circuit. But electronics will wear out, LNBs will get weaker, so there's certainly nothing wrong with turning off equipment when not in use: using DP system, when a receiver is on, all the LNBs are receiving power (which is in itself part of the problem I am discussing). |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2722 Registered: Oct-05 | @Therepo - Just for the record a Fortec Star Lifetime Ultra puts out 600mA... This is just the Fortecs which are old receiveer. Which I the basis for this post. All new receivers are un the 700mA.... But this is good. We need to get as much informatin out to users so they can make a sound decision rather then going with half the facts. The information posted above is based on test, technical specifications for the equipment mentioned and actual measurements of power consumption. |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2723 Registered: Oct-05 | And we must not forget that most standard dual output LNB's run at 13v (Vertical) & 18v (Horizontal) @ 200mA. Add another two LNB's to the mix and you are at the max (600mA) of most FTA Receivers yet they run without a hitch when connected to a DISEcQ or SW21 (if supported). | |
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Bronze Member Username: 1tina_chickPost Number: 71 Registered: Mar-06 | Thanks Boys - This place ROCKS !  |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2724 Registered: Oct-05 | I think I can speak for both, myself and Therepo when I say: "Thank You" |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 72 Registered: May-07 | I wouldn't think FLU is 600mA, and all new receivers are not 700mA. Have a look at some of the specs. For instance: Pansat 2700, 2800, 3500, 6000, 9000HD - 500mA MAX Fortec- Lifetime Classic NA 500mA MAX Mercury II - 500mA MAX Viewsat ultra - 500mA MAX |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2726 Registered: Oct-05 | IF / Tuner Input Frequency 950 MHz to 2150 MHz Input Signal Level -25 to -65dBm Input Impedance 75 ohm nominal Input Connector F-type, IEC 109-24, Female FEC Decoder Convolution Code Rate l/2, 2/3, 3/4, 5/6 and 7/8 with Constraint Length K=7 Demodulation QPSK Symbol rate 2-45 Ms/s SCPC/MCPC IF Frequency / Bandwidth 480MHz / 30MHz Type LNB Power & Polarization V13 / H18, 600mA MAX. over current protection DiSEqC Control Ver. 1.0 / 1.2 Compatible DiSEqC USALS compatible |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2727 Registered: Oct-05 | This is the Mercury II IF / Tuner Input Frequency 950 MHz to 2150 MHz Input Signal Level -30 to -65dBm Input Impedance 75 ohm nominal Input Connector F-type, IEC 169-24, Female FEC Decoder Convolution Code Rate l/2, 2/3, 3/4, 5/6 and 7/8 with Constraint Length K=7 Demodulation QPSK Symbol rate 1-45 Ms/s SCPC/MCPC IF Frequency Zero IF LNB Power & Polarization V13 / H18, 500mA MAX. overload protection DiSEqC Control DiSEqC. 1.0, 1.1 / DiSEqC 1.2 Compatible Positioner USALS compatible |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2728 Registered: Oct-05 | Pansat 2500/2700/2800 IF / Tuner Input Frequency 950 MHz to 2150 MHz Input Signal Level -25 to -65dBm Input Impedance 75 ohm nominal Input Connector F-type, IEC 109-24, Female FEC Decoder Convolution Code Rate l/2, 2/3, 3/4, 5/6 and 7/8 with Constraint Length K=7 Demodulation QPSK Symbol rate 2-45 Ms/s SCPC/MCPC IF Frequency / Bandwidth 480MHz / 30MHz Type LNB Power & Polarization V13 / H18, 600mA MAX. over current protection DiSEqC Control Ver. 1.0 / 1.2 Compatible DiSEqC USALS compatible |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 76 Registered: May-07 | Ok, I'm eating my hat on that, PRFRMNJ. | |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 77 Registered: May-07 | However, where are you getting this from? | |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2729 Registered: Oct-05 | Okay - This is why I said in the original post Most FTA Receivers... |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2730 Registered: Oct-05 | Straight from the Manufacturer specifications... Actually I have all the books here. And their sites as well. |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2731 Registered: Oct-05 | I do agree that there will be some receivers that will not be able to run the high demands on their own, but people who setup the more complex systems are running more then one receiver... I do agree with you that people need to understand what they are doing before they start running cables and switches. If they don't know what they are doing they will burn out the receivers which is why we post educational information. |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 78 Registered: May-07 | Well did you get the specs you posted for 2700 come from their site? Yours says 600, but right here, it is 500: you can look at all the other pans there. They are all 500mA MAX. Certainly not all new ones are 700. |
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Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2732 Registered: Oct-05 | No the 2700 and 2800 I got from the book itself. But this is good info. Interesting to see that the Specs in the book vary from what they have on their site... I'll scan the page on the book and send it to you tomorrow... | |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 79 Registered: May-07 | "I do agree that there will be some receivers that will not be able to run the high demands on their own, but people who setup the more complex systems are running more then one receiver... " Yes, exactly. Two receivers can run share the power load successfully where one fta alone can *sometimes* have problems. |
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Bronze Member Username: TherepoFtaview.com Post Number: 80 Registered: May-07 | "No the 2700 and 2800 I got from the book itself. But this is good info. Interesting to see that the Specs in the book vary from what they have on their site... I'll scan the page on the book and send it to you tomorrow..." That is interesting. PRFRMNJ, feel free to drop by the site where I mod at (it's to the left under my username, my "subtle" advertisement, haha), and contribute to the Wiki project we've started for FTA terminology and usage. If your philosophy is "We need to get as much informatin out to users so they can make a sound decision rather then going with half the facts", it would appeal to you. |
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Gold Member Username: SatscannerBeaversbush, Sportsmans P... Great White ... Post Number: 2065 Registered: Nov-06 | I've been doing research on power supply's very resently and with all the info I've seen, and the amount of reported dead power supply's ,I think those specs on LNB power are over egagerated.Even if those limits of 500ma or 600ma are surge ,continuous draw of 75% of those limits will result in a very short lived powersupply/receiver.We know this just how our fta unit's operate switches as compared to echostar ird's,and we ask more from our fta receivers. | |
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Gold Member Username: SatscannerBeaversbush, Sportsmans P... Great White ... Post Number: 2066 Registered: Nov-06 | I'm also in the process of repairing and modding a 2700 power supply and the circuit I'm doing is the LNB circit. I plan to add the heaviest duty components avaiable that are compatable and the most extreme npn power switching transistor with the voltage parimiters I can find is 600ma surge .Of course there are other specs ,such switch time ,operating temp ect.Also inspecting the power transformmer ,it has no identifying info ,but supect it around 350ma capacity at most.It is a very small light duty multi voltage multi tap transformmer.The only way to test it's capacity output will kill it. | |
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Gold Member Username: SatscannerBeaversbush, Sportsmans P... Great White ... Post Number: 2069 Registered: Nov-06 |  Here's the 2700a powersupply |
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Gold Member Username: SatscannerBeaversbush, Sportsmans P... Great White ... Post Number: 2070 Registered: Nov-06 |
Here's the schematic |
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Gold Member Username: SatscannerBeaversbush, Sportsmans P... Great White ... Post Number: 2071 Registered: Nov-06 |  Here's some replacement lnb circut power switching transiters. |
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