Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 93 Registered: Feb-07 | i had my dish pointed once b4 but i was always getting in and out signal. Come to find out my settingd were wrong. Changed settings and got 110 with 90% quality then went to nothing and cant get a signal back on anything? Any suggestions? Why would it be there at 90% one sec and then be gone the next....didnt touch anything. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 839 Registered: Oct-06 | Do you have latest bin? Also wiring One of the most important factors in any type of installations is WIRING. I advice anyone Armature or Professional to use Good wiring. RG-6 Quad Shield is the way to go: - There are so many different Coax cables Rg-58,59 etc. - There is also RG-6 double shield as well as quad shield. - Quad shield is only 5 or 10 cents more per foot. IT IS WHAT I RECOMMEND. - Will other cables work? yes they will. - Best proven product in the market today. RG-6 (Quad shield). Very little or no DB loss. Great for up to 150 feet before your DISEqC Switch - Same issue with compression connectors, snap and seal. Great weather resistant. Less problems - Ground your metal coupler or DISEqC switches etc. - Your connection will last you 50 years good for all weather condirions. |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 94 Registered: Feb-07 | the wiring i am using is wiring that was here when the former tenants had DTV. I borrowed a signal meter from a friend.....picked up a signal but it is not 110 or 119.......i am getting 4,1.2,9, and 13......how close to 119 and 110 am I? |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 95 Registered: Feb-07 | i havent touched anything and now i am getting a signal on 110. but when i change sats in the sutup menu and go back the signal is gone....then i di ==o it again and it is back. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 842 Registered: Oct-06 | I bet you it is either DTV phase II or Phase III Phase II you can only get either 110 or 119. you can get 2 sats that are 18 degrees apart. but you can add 1 extra LNB in the middle and get 110/119 Phase III will pick few TPs of middle LNB and full TPS with either Sat depending on where you point. I would strap a second LNB in the middle with either dish and run 2 input to a DISEqC switch and get 110/119 I hope this will help I'm in the middle of a new test that will solve this problem and bring up to 4 Sats with that dish. Check this thread LK has a good article I learned from. https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/home-video/335883.html |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 96 Registered: Feb-07 | i am using a Dish Net system.......the cables are the only thing that is DTV......I did a factory reset and went to the setup page and both echo 7 and 8 said they had a quality of 99%. so i scanned both sats. But when the channels came up all of them say that they are from sat 110(there are over 300 channels....bunch of duplicates) ....even though some of the channels that came up are only on 119....what would make that happen? |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 844 Registered: Oct-06 | List your hardware: How many LNBs and type? Receiver brand? DISEqC switches? Bin PGM U are using? Antenna setup? Now it does sound like a setup issue Must assign: LNB-1 to 119 to port#1 of DISEqC LNB-2 to 110 to port#2 of DISEqC Must match LNB type & frequency in antenna setup Scan one Sat at a time |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 97 Registered: Feb-07 | dish 500 antenna with 2 single LNBs...Fortec Star Lifetime Ultra.....2 x 1 DISEqC.....290T auto bin. i have the port settings right on the switch and in the antenna setup i just put standard LNB. I scanned both sats at once with a sat scan. anything else you need to know? |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8465 Registered: Jan-06 | I guarantee the dish is NOT aligned correctly..the receiver is NOT configured correctly...and there is much pilot error from lack of reading.. |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 98 Registered: Feb-07 | the allignment is correct according to PRFRMNJ...thats where i got it from. and how do you know the reciever is not configured correctly. I had it working once b4 but the signal was very bouncy so when i got the numbers from PRFRMNJ i adjusted and the problem is still that i cant get all the channels that i want even though bith sats say that they have a quality of 99%. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 845 Registered: Oct-06 | Well If eveything aligned and configured correctly then it should work. If the signal is bouncy great chance your coil inside DISEqC is bad. Time to change it. Process of elemination. Without first hand tests or accurate description hard to find or pin point problem. Here is what I will do to find out if it is DISEqC or not. - Use a coupler instead of switch go stright from LNB to receiver - Step and repeat each Sat seperately - Depending what you encounter could be: Alignement, Setup, LNB, DISEqC or just bad luck Good luck is what You'll need |
Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2507 Registered: Oct-05 | New - The numbers I gave you is a starting point. That only tells you in the direction you need to be pointed. But the only way to lock in your signal is to either use a sat finding device or your receiver to see signal strenght and quality. I find DN receivers are really good for this because they identify the sat you are hitting and then from there is a walk in the park. |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 99 Registered: Feb-07 | i have a DN reciever and i was gonna do that but i dont have a card to insert and it wont let me get past the system info page |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 851 Registered: Oct-06 | Call 800-333-DISH Tell them I'm a dish ready You'll get the first month Free I'm just kidding buddy LK was right it is an alignment issue |
Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2511 Registered: Oct-05 | DN stop using cards on most of their receivers! What kind of receiver is it. You should be able to get into the menu even without a card. |
Bronze Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 100 Registered: Feb-07 | dont know exactly what kind it is....says echostar on the card door...and the model number on the back says 2800 if that helps any. |
Gold Member Username: PrfrmnjPost Number: 2512 Registered: Oct-05 | New - Your only other choice is to use your FTA Receiver. Keep in mind your first TP on 119 will not have signal as it's a direct beam TP, so you'll need to make sure you're on the following to get the signal. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 101 Registered: Feb-07 | ok.....i hooked up the LNBs separetly and got the signal......hooked the switch up and signal went down......so i got a dual head LNB and put it on...signal says that they are good but i scanned a TP that i was having problems with b4 and still having problems with it and others too. I was scanning TP 5 on 119 but the channels i got were from TP 5 on 110. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 102 Registered: Feb-07 | i also have another switch......its an Eagle Aspen DTV 3x4 Switch. Of the 2 for SAT they are 18V and 13V.....can i hook my other LNBs up to either or both of them or is the voltage wrong on one of them or will it noe even work? Another question i have is whether the bin is causing the problem with me getting the channels from the other bird? |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 104 Registered: Feb-07 | i found in my garage that the previous owneers left is a DTV dish with a Trible head LNB. What could i hit with that......dont want anything international. Anything that would compare to DN 119 and 110? |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8467 Registered: Jan-06 | Too many questions and NO READING! |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 858 Registered: Oct-06 | Dude - Step I I gave you the answers to your questions If you get each Sat eperately see if you can get the channels and do over by reset to factory default. This is how you'll learn. - Step II Must make sure yo get all channels before yo try this step Must assign: LNB-1 to 119 to port#1 of DISEqC in antenna setup LNB-2 to 110 to port#2 of DISEqC in antenna setup Must match LNB type & frequency in antenna setup Scan one Sat at a time. If you ask any more questions list details Don't give life stories You are not clear when you say: " hooked up the LNBs separetly and got the signal" Getting the signal don't mean you'll get the channels you could be still struggling with signal It could be your DISEqC is shut due to leaving power on while swithing cables and no proper grounding. Get the channels first from each LNB first and revise your setup What do U got to loose? |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 105 Registered: Feb-07 | i think that there is something else wrong...could be alignment, but i dont know. I am only using 1 LNB now and when i position it to get 119 the receiver shows that i have a signal on both 110 and 119, its not possible to get a signal on both birds with 1 LNB. |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8487 Registered: Jan-06 | LMAO..subscribe since u don't read!! |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 861 Registered: Oct-06 | That is normal to have signal on all Sats with 1-LNB As you scan it will load the channels based on alignment 2 LNBs with the setup I gave you above should work Assuming alignment and DISEqC switchs are fine IT IS SETUP ISSUE along with maybe few others I don't think you understand assigning LNB to DISEqC switch in antenna setup this is where you are having a problem. YOU HAVE TO DO SETUP IN STEPS. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 106 Registered: Feb-07 | i have dont that......119=1 and 110=2......im gonna see if my buddy will let me use his DN receiver so it will show me the bird that i am hitting. I realized now that it is mostly an alignment issue.....i finally got 119 to come in but now 110 pulling the channels from 119. I know im closw but i just cant seem to get it right on without taking them both out of alignment. Hopefully he will let me use it and i can get this set right and after that im not touching it again. Thanks for all your help. |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8488 Registered: Jan-06 | all "signal" tells U is that the LNB is receiving power!...U could get 10 satellites aimed at the kitchen floor with 1 LNB and get "signal".. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 107 Registered: Feb-07 | so even if i use the DN receiver and it says that i have a good signal on both 119 and 110 it doesnt mesn anything? |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 864 Registered: Oct-06 | Leave DN receiver alone it has nothing to do for what U need. DISEqC port-1 is in antenna setup 119 Lnb................On Lnb type.........standard Freq..............11250 22khz............Off ? Diseqc...........port-1? Legacy sw......off Motor.....Off Do Chan Sat Scan 110 Lnb................On Lnb type.........standard Freq..............11250 22khz............Off ? Diseqc...........port-2? Legacy sw......off Motor.....Off Do Chan Sat Scan What does it say on switch? SW-21, Sw-22, Diplexer, splitter, DISEqC etc.? Get a 4 input DISEqC switch will you!!! |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 108 Registered: Feb-07 | King......this is the info i have on my antenna setup screen. for 119 LNB type= Standard LNB Local Freq = 11250 22kHz = off DiSEqC = 1 skew = -45 TP = (1)12223 V 20.000 Positioner Setting = Disabled Satellite Scan = ALL |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 865 Registered: Oct-06 | Fine 119 is OK What about 110? Are you getting channels (not signal) channels when you go straight from LNB to receiver? Did you see these questions? What does it say on switch? SW-21, Sw-22, Diplexer, splitter, DISEqC etc.? Get a 4 input DISEqC switch will you!!! READ MY QUESTIONS BEFORE YOU ASK AGAIN!!! |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 109 Registered: Feb-07 | b4 i read what you wrote earlier i hooked up the DN reciever and have signal on both birds.....hooked up the FTA and it shows i dont have a signal.......and i dont get all the channels from both 119 and 110......some of the TPs wont come up in the scan either. The switch i have is a SW-21. I also have another switch, it is an Aspen DTV 3x4 mini max multiswitch. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 866 Registered: Oct-06 | Aspen DTV uses 0/22khz and only gets 4 TPs at the most. If you use SW-21 it also has to be included in setup. I think you you found out the problem GET A 4-INPUT DISEqC switch $6 off e-bay Next time you run LNB stright to receiver one Sat at a time like I said before doezons of people would of pointed out the problem if you give detail info and answer their questions. Again Before you buy the switch just run straight LNB to Receiver and see if you get all the channels. It could still be an LNB problem. This is how you can find out. Do it. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 110 Registered: Feb-07 | ok.....i also have a dual head legacy LNB that i just tried and it is doing the same thing. And Also when i went and got the receiver from my friend he took the dual DP LNB off his receiver for me to test to make sure the legacy wasnt bad and it does the same thing too. What i thought is that if i hooked them up to the DN receiver and it showed i had a 90% signal 0n both 119 and 110 that when i hooked it up to the FTA it should give me the same and i should be able to get all the channels. Is this not the case? And i did use 2 LNBs separately to make sure i got the signals and after i did that i tried to get the channels on 119 but it would bring up channels from 110 then i tried the 110 side and it also brought up 110 channels. It was like both LNBs were hitting 110....tried to adjust and still didnt help. All 3 setups that i used are doing the same thing. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 867 Registered: Oct-06 | Are you telling me you get 110 from 2 seperate LNBs when you go straight. IF THIS IS THE CASE MOVE DISH 5-8 DEGREES CLOCKWISE Or are you confused which LNB is which? Get a 4-input DISEqC switch it is only $6-$7 of e-bay. Do yourself a favor: don't touch that DN receiver or DP twin LNB. You got bounch of different combinations you won't solve anything. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 111 Registered: Feb-07 | ok......so the i should just use the 2 single LNBs and go move the skew about 5 to 8 degrees clockwise. OK.....will go try that. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 112 Registered: Feb-07 | the adapter fot the 2 single LNBs tell me which one is which and 7 is 119 and 8 is 110. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 113 Registered: Feb-07 | real quick question....when i do it separately do i need to unselect the sat im not scanning? I already scanned 119.....some of the TP didnt come in...gonna have to do a little more adjusting. Getting ready yo scan 110 w/o 119 being hooked up........since 119 isnt hooked up do i still put it as diseqc 2 or do i even put a disecq on it since there isnt a switch hooke up right now? |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 114 Registered: Feb-07 | sorry....got another question.....should i turn TP Autoupdate off? |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 115 Registered: Feb-07 | ok......did the scan separately...got the channels for each bird, hooked the switch back up and it works.....still have to turn off an on for some channels to come in but oh well. Still couldnt get the other TPs to come in after adjusting....but i didnt adjust too much....figured i should only have to adjust only a few degrees to get them. It sux tho cause the TPs that wont come in have like USA network, TNT, SCIFI, etc. Might go mark the dish at the settings they are right now and do some more adjusting. King....thank you for your help and thank you for sticking with me even though i can almost bet you were cussing me out and thinking what a dumba** i am. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 869 Registered: Oct-06 | I never insult anyone You had a combination of different problems When I told you move your dish 8 degrees clockwise I wasn't talking about skew. Skew has minor effect comparing to correct alignment angle I strongly suggest to reset to factory default This has no effect on Bin PGM Do the set-up over GET A REAL DISEqC switch cuz one of your switches was blocking some transponders. My congrats to your success |
Silver Member Username: Ke5aqnIF I DONT KNOW THE ANSWER, I WILL FIND... Post Number: 876 Registered: Sep-06 | New to FTA, Here is my thoughts.....I started my "testing" with a dish 500 as well as you. After fighting the signal then no signal channels working one time then not the next for almost a month I looked for a easer way.....I found a 31" dish and a SINGLE lnb, bought a motor for 60 bucks, spent 1 hour installing the motor, pointing and all that entails and now I get ALL the sat's easly....So lets review....I feel your problem is the Dish 500 it is NOT very FTA friendly. You are having trouble receiving 2 sat's. 2 sat's is only PART of DN so you missing all the great programing on BEV. If you get a motorized system up and going ( fairly easy and cheap ) you will gain....2 more DN sat's, and the 2 BEV sat's about 600 more channels!......so in short I would get a motorized dish spend a afternoon setting it up and start enjoying WATCHING TV and not FIGHTING TV........but, thats just my thoughts |
Silver Member Username: Ke5aqnIF I DONT KNOW THE ANSWER, I WILL FIND... Post Number: 877 Registered: Sep-06 | New to FTA, I forgot your "should I turn off auto transponder update off?" question sorry. Yes and I will explain.....While you are using the dish 500 with its prolems your receiver will get false "reading" from transponders......an example you select USA network channel....receiver will go to the correct sat and transponder....if the dish 500 show's the wrong transponder the receiver will decide the transponder with USA and other channles needs to be updated sence it does not see the USA channel.....so it updates the transponder (rescans the transponder) but what happened is it was looking at the wrong transponder so it will DELETE all the channels on that transponder and add ones from the WRONG transponder.....so now you could have duplicated channels, channels deleted that are still their, all kinds of trouble. I left auto update on at first and within a short time I had the same channles listed 10 times, bunches of channels missing, a big mess.....so turn it off I still leave it off I try to rescan all the birds once a week myself |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 870 Registered: Oct-06 | FTA Tester He is having totally different problems - He is using a switch that blocks certain TPs - His dish wasn't aligned correctly - Along with few other setup issues just got him no where |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 116 Registered: Feb-07 | King.....when i moved the skew it came in ok. The deal with the TPs that wont come in is that they came in b4. So you are saying that i need to get a 4 input switch cause the one i have is blocking some TPs even though they came in before? And about moving the dish.....when you said i should move it 5 to 8 degrees clockwise you meant that i should move the azimuth to the right? |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 873 Registered: Oct-06 | Yes I meant Azmith clockwise 4-input DISEqC is your solution The reason why got different TPs because you moved orientation picking different TPs that is normal. Question for you Are you getting blockage from the Aspen or SW-21? The only thing that will make sense to me DON'T USE THE ASPEN You never answered my questions clearly - Did you try 119 straight in without swtich (y/n) - Normally you should test each Sat without any switch. I must of asked you at least 3 times yo didn't answer. this is what delays your repair. Did you try 119 straight with no switch? (y/n) If you did so, still some missing TPs then it is something else due to lack of answers yo providing. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 117 Registered: Feb-07 | yes.....i scanned 119 striaght, no switch. I scanned both 119 and 110 straight, the channels i have now are from scanning straight. Here is what i did.....i scanned 119 straight...then went outside and scanned 110 straight...after that i went back outside and hookd the switch back up and watched tv. For the TPs that arent coming in i hooked 119 back up straight and then went to TP scan and put it on TP 2, which didnt have a signal, I adjusted for about 10 mins to see if i could get it in but no luck.....same with TP 12.....it was all done straight. So im wondering if i adjust the Azimuth 5 - 8 degrees clockwise if it will come in....tried the azimuth b4 but didnt work....maybe i just didnt go far enough. the switch i am using is the SW-21...you told me not to use the Aspen. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 875 Registered: Oct-06 | You still not giving me the answers I'm looking for: I'm going to make it simple for you. - If you scan 119 alone straight in and getting all channels (then your pointing is 100% fine) - If you scan 119 alone straight in and NOT getting all channels (then there is something else) step and repeat - If you scan 110 alone straight in and getting all channels (then your pointing is 100% fine) - If you scan 110 alone straight in and NOT getting all channels (then there is something else) - If you scan 110/119 straight in and getting all channels and happy & would like to get both together YOU HAVE TO REDO SET-UP AGAIN including the type of switch U are using. - The type of switch should use prefered to be DISEqC - If your receiver can accept SW-21 (then you must enable SW-21 during your full antenna setup including re-scanning all Sat channels) - Setup can vary on how to enable SW-21 in your receiver. I'm not familiar with your Fortec as far as how to enable it. Usually it will say Legacy Switch Sw-21 dish-1 or dish-2. If you don't have this option chances that you can't use it. To make it easy Get a DISEqC switch Since you never gave me straight answer whether you get all channels or not by going straight in I have no idea if my advice is even relevant. |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8512 Registered: Jan-06 | LMAO...I gave up a long time ago..hello wall...LMAO |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 885 Registered: Oct-06 | I know boss But he will get it eventually You got one part right, he doesn't read even simple questions. |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8513 Registered: Jan-06 | even if he ever bothers to READ, then he must comprehend...and then he must ALWAYS read daily/weekly to stay current with the changes..that will NEVER happen...he should just subscribe! I applaud your persistence but I've seen too many like him before, I already know the outcome.. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 118 Registered: Feb-07 | i said in the last post that TP 2 and TP 12 didnt come in on 119.....i only know of them two because those 2 have channels on them that i watch........i dont have a setting to enable the SW-21 switch, it just asks me what port-1,2,3,4......those 2 TPs came in before. Like i said before, i didnt move the azimuth when you said to turn it clockwise i turned the skew. Didnt have a chance 2 today but maybe if i go turn the azimuth 5 to 8 degrees it might come in. And i plan on getting a 4 input switch when i get back from vacation in a week. I guess i must not be wording it right but YES i have scanned each sat straight(with no switch) and no i didnt get all the channels i wanted on 119 and after checking all TPs these are the ones that wont come in....TP 2 with USA Network, TP 8 with TNT, TP 4 with Disney, TP 6 with MTV, TP 12 with FX, TP 14 with encore and stars, TP 16 with Spike wont come in. As for 110 i got all of the channels. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 889 Registered: Oct-06 | Try this: Do Power scan or Blind scan and then chan sat scan Many will be duplicates but it should get all missing channels If this doesn't work it has to be your LNB But hopefully will work |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 119 Registered: Feb-07 | if it doesnt work then does it mean the LNB is bad or mis aligned? Gonna do the blind scan right now....should i factory reset? |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 120 Registered: Feb-07 | did the sscans.....didnt work.....went out to adjust and i put it on TP scan ad put the TP on 2......no signal.......the level is at 73% but the quality is nothing.....b4 when i looked at it the quality was at 72-75%...does the quality not really matter? |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 121 Registered: Feb-07 | i dont know what it is......i think you might be right about the switch.....its like it wont switch when i go to the TP that i want....but i dont know cause i cant even get it when i have 119 straight........i also have a legacy dual head.......would it matter if i put that up there or should i not even mess with that? I can get 2 DTV LNBs tomorrow.....guess i can try them to see if they work. Seen on another site that someone used two DTV LNBs to pick DN 119 and 110.....guess that would be my only other option until i get me another switch. |
Silver Member Username: Le74nguyenPerris, Ca Usa Post Number: 118 Registered: Dec-05 | sorry- I want to ask Newtofta about how to install motor SG2100? because I did bought motor and tried to install with my dish 33" but it's not work- I don't how.. now I need help. thanks} |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 122 Registered: Feb-07 | linda......i wish i could help you but i have never installed a motor. I would start a new thread about it and i am sure someone will be able to help you. Sorry i couldnt help but i am still new to all this. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 893 Registered: Oct-06 | New to FTA (do't forget your DISEqC switch) Best solution to your situation is to scan those specific TPs. Just create a new thread and ask or go to an FTA site that show you how to. I do think there are a lot of people here can assist you better than me, ask for PRFRMNJ or Kavin Reno. Just give them simple straight forward questions and pay attention to their response. THERE IS SOMETHING ELSE GOING ON. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 123 Registered: Feb-07 | i know how to scan the specific TPs.....Just cant get them to come in. I dont think im gonna mess with it till i get back from Florida next week. I think im gonna throw the DTV heads on there to see what they will do while i am waiting on the switch. No matter what happens i am gonna get a new switch. Hopefully the other LNBs i put in there will work. Thank you for all your helpand patience. Will try to answer questions better next time. |
Silver Member Username: NewtoftaPost Number: 124 Registered: Feb-07 | King......this should be my last question for a while.......is there any certian type/kind of 4 input diseqc switch i should look for? See a bunch of different kinds on ebay. |
Silver Member Username: BirdwatcherPost Number: 523 Registered: Jul-06 | lick finger, and point. Aim at opposite direction of wind. |
Silver Member Username: TapemanNew York, NY Post Number: 900 Registered: Oct-06 | DMS is a good one e-bay You can ask as much as you want as long as you follow instructions |
Gold Member Username: LklivesPost Number: 8524 Registered: Jan-06 | Chieta and Spaun are the best.. |