Multiple 5.1 to same AVR & Amp
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New member Username: WhtabtbbPost Number: 1 Registered: Sep-08 | Recently constructed a 16' x 24' open air porch over our patio. The layout would be perfect for an outdoor theater/viewing area to watch football, movies, howardtv. etc. Most likely will use a 50" lcd with a mounting bracket that has a quick release so I can remove the lcd nightly or when bad weather will be occuring. Adjacent to my patio, is my great room. (16' x 21'). In my great room, i have my surround 5.1 sound system which utilizes a panasonic 58" plasma, denon avr-3806, niles si-2125 amplifier and b&w speakers with subwoofer. My plan for the patio/open air porch is to use recessed speakers in the ceiling for the rear channels and subwoofer and to have lcd mounted on rear of house with front left, center and right to be installed around lcd. QUESTION? Since my patio is adjacent to my great room and i can access equipment being used in my great room very easily from my patio, can i run my outdoor 5.1 surround system to the same terminals on my denon? What would be the alternative if that cannot be done? I do not want to have to buy another avr and amplifier? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Also, I know ominmount makes a quick release lcd mount known as "lift n' lock", what other lcd mounts, priced reasonably, have quick release brackets? Thanks! |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 358 Registered: Jan-08 | You cannot connect more than one speaker to the same speaker output terminal but there is a solution. The device you need to do this is called an Impedance Matching Speaker Selector. The device makes it possible to expand the number of speakers you can connect to one speaker output terminal. Just Google the keywords "Impedance Matching Speaker Selector" -they are not hard to find and come in a wide variety of applications. |
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New member Username: WhtabtbbPost Number: 2 Registered: Sep-08 | Will I be able to achieve 5.1 surround on my patio by utilizing an Impedance Matching Speaker Selector? Or, would I need to purchase a separate 5.1 surround avr? Thanks for all of your assistance. |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 359 Registered: Jan-08 | The Impedance Matching Speaker Selector is a device that you would integrate into your current AVR to allow you to expand the number of speakers you can use. The whole point to the device would be to create another zone using the AVR you have. If you were to buy another AVR you would not need an Impedance Matching Speaker Selector. Like I said just google the keywords Impedance Matching Speaker Selector. |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 360 Registered: Jan-08 | Anyone out there? Will Bob be able to splt the subwoofer pre-out to drive two subs from his AVR? The Impedance Matching speaker selector will work fine for the fronts, center, and surrounds but as far as I know they are not setup for someting like the sub pre-out. To my knowledge it is ok to split the sub pre-out? Anyone have anything to add? |
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Silver Member Username: JrbayLivonia [Detroit area], Michigan USA Post Number: 378 Registered: Feb-08 | Ideally Bob, I would recommend a separate system enclosed in some sort of weatherproof enclosure. Several reasons for this and one huge reason why not: Pro's: It would be much easier to roll down a cover than move a 50" panel. audio could be autonomous so that separate programs could be watched in the great room and the patio. Con: There is only 1 and that is a higher cost!!! |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 363 Registered: Jan-08 | Bob, I talked to Jim as well as doing some research. You can split the subwoofer pre-out meaning put a y connecter on the subwoofer pre-out and run a subwoofer in each of the 2 zones. Do not do this with the speakers though. For the speakers you would need to use the Impedance matching speaker selector and create 2 zones. I strongly agree with what Jim has said but if you are totally opposed to the investment in another AVR then the solution I propose will work. Just remember that there are going to be financial investments either way but the lesser expensive will be the way I propose. |
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Silver Member Username: MccambleyBREEZY POINT, NY USA Post Number: 521 Registered: Jun-05 | If you want to run a second complete 5.1 outdoors you could connect a less expensive AVR receiver (onkyo 506) to you zone 2 out put on your main receiver. You can now run 5 speakers and a sub system out side while still using all of your source devices hooked up to the main receiver. I don't understand how a "Impedance Matching Speaker Selector" will work for 5.1 surround I thought they were only good to feed a stereo sound to anther location. |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 364 Registered: Jan-08 | I guess he would have to use an array of 5 inexpensive -2 zone speaker selectors (one for each channel...) Bad idea?? |
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Silver Member Username: JrbayLivonia [Detroit area], Michigan USA Post Number: 381 Registered: Feb-08 | Actually 3 (or 2 stereo and 1 mono) switches could be used. I couldn't find a 5 channel switch anywhere. A possible business opportunity??? |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 365 Registered: Jan-08 | Makes sense to me Jim... It would seem that with the advent of 5.1 and the phasing out of stereo that the industry would be capitilizing on 5.1 and not limiting it to a format (stereo) that is becoming less commonly used. If I had the startup capital I would design and manufacture a speaker selector that creates two 5.1 zones...  Bottom line is that creating 2 -5.1 zones using whats out there is possible but not as clean a setup as I would like to see. Just trying to give Bob a viable option that does not involve another AVR. That is what his question was. He did not post here asking if he needed another AVR -he asked for a way to use the one he has. With a little improvisation the speaker selector idea does have potential and would help him to avoid purchasing another AVR. |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 2343 Registered: Feb-04 | It seems to me the problem of a simple multiple channel speaker selector is the lack of zone volume control. Depending of the differences of the speaker efficiencies involved, it could be that Bob might have too much volume in the great room and not enough on the patio. Or the reverse could be true. Without separate volume controls for each zone, there's no way to adjust for that. He could use speaker selectors with separate volume controls, such as five of these. But that would be cumbersome and cost far more than an entry-level AVR. |
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Silver Member Username: JrbayLivonia [Detroit area], Michigan USA Post Number: 382 Registered: Feb-08 | Ah Ha! It would appear that we would all be in agreement in that a separate AVR is the way to go for this application. Jeff, when you manufacture your 5.1 speaker selector don't forget to use John's advise and make sure it has volume control (a rare thing even with stereo selector switches).  |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 366 Registered: Jan-08 | I guess that depends on whether he would even be using both zones at the same time. It would seem logical to me that he would not. If it were some kind of gathering to enjoy some specific content like a football game why would it be necessary to present the same content in two places. A little redudant and seems like overkill to me. Just the fact that he seeks to make the content available on the patio to me suggests that that is where everyone would be. The volume issue may not even be a consideration. I guess the only way for him to know would be to try it. Geez I wish all of this were a more exact science Bob, Would you want to use both zones at the same time? |
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New member Username: WhtabtbbPost Number: 3 Registered: Sep-08 | First, I want to thank everyone for their input. I have two children, and of course they do not want to watch what I want to watch. Therefore, I would use both zones at the same time, I may be watching a football game on the patio and while the kids watch a movie in the family room. Is there an avr that has dual 5.1 inputs and outputs? I believe I saw some place the Denon AVR-5308CI has that capability - but that is 5k. All of my equipment would be kept indoors. Thanks! |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 367 Registered: Jan-08 | Well, you could try the speaker selectors and see if the volume in each zone is an issue at all. I was a little curious how you plan to have something different playing in one zone or the other? To do this you would have to have another avr. When you add speakers the same content would be played in both zones. You would have to have either an additional avr or an avr the will output different content to different zones but to my knowledge this is not usually 5.1 but stereo. Sorry did the best I could. The fact is if I were trying to do what you are I would just use 2 totally independant zones. You really are not going to be able to accomplish this the way you seek. You would need separate avr's -separate cable or sattelite box's depending on what you are using. For you to watch one channel while your kids watch another you would not be able to use the same tuner... unless you are using the tuner in the TV... |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 2344 Registered: Feb-04 | Bob, I think you may be confusing the Zone 2 feature (this receiver actually has a Zone 3 as well) with the capability of producing more than one complete 5.1 surround sound from different material. This is not the case. All you can do with the extra "zones" is either send a stereo signal from a different source to another amplifier, or utilize the unused back surround amps (number 6 and 7 of a 7.1 system) to power speakers in another room. In either case, you are limited to stereo only. So, if you want surround sound out on the patio, you'll have to use another AVR. This receiver certainly doesn't have to be the same expense level as your very fine 3806. Jeff raises a good point here. Have you figured out how you are going to handle the video out to the patio display? I am curious about a couple things. What are you using the Niles amp for? Stereo only music listening? Also, I find it interesting that you're using the name of one of my favorite character actors. |
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Silver Member Username: CclashhPost Number: 368 Registered: Jan-08 | Thanks John!, I had no idea what Bob was proposing. It never occured to me that he would expect to be able to do this. The way I was interpreting this is that he wanted to use his existing equipment to serve the patio as well as the great room with the same content. I was taking it for granted that he would know that both zones would have to have the same content. If I had any clue that he thought that somehow he could have varying content in each zone I would not have proposed the solution that I did and would have told him that it was simply not possible without separate components including another AVR. Thanks for clearing up the additional Zone capabilities as being stereo. I was pretty sure but did not know for sure so I did not want to say that 5.1 did not exist. By the way where the heck have you been? This is absolutely no fun without you guys!!! I have really missed seeing you around!! |
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Gold Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 2345 Registered: Feb-04 | Been busy Jeff, as always. Plus, I hate to admit it, I'm hooked on Tiger Woods for PC.  |
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