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John Grajek II Unregistered guest | I have a relativly good system Denon AVR 3803, Paradigm Studio Fronts, and AR surrounds. I have a good system and I am still learning so much about HT. I get on forums every chance that I get to learn more. I was wondering if anyone had a good explaination of the SPL meter and how it is used. I plan on buying one and i have read numerous threads in which people swear by them to calibrate their HT. If anyone has any advice to a web page that explains it or if they want to take the time to type it down (make sure that it is some what simple) I would really appreciate. Thanks a million. |
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Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 121 Registered: Feb-04 | John: Both the Avia and the Sound & Vision home theater setup DVDs encourage the use of an SPL (sound pressure level) meter to measure the various test tones on those discs. Chief among these audio tests are: channel identification (you don't need a meter for that!), channel balance, speaker phase, and, probably most important, several subwoofer tests to help get smoothest transition between it and the other speakers around the room. You could "wing it" without the meter, but you would be surprised how often the meter regesters differently than your ears. Both of these discs recommend the Radio Shack meter model 33-2050 (about $30). Unfortunately, I've been informed that model is now discontinued in favor of their $50 digital model. I think this unit may be acceptable, however, because it has a "bar" display at the bottom of its LCD window display. I have not used it, nor have I verified the discontinuance of the analog model. |
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Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 122 Registered: Feb-04 | John: There is a new model, now $40. Go to www.radioshack.com and search for 33-4050. |
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New member Username: BrazilianSao Paulo, SP Brasil Post Number: 6 Registered: May-04 | Put it in your listening position pointing, ears position, up 45 degrees. Set it to 70dB and increase the volume till it reaches 75 dB. Calibrate all channels to reach the same 75 dB. Regarding the subwoofer, use your ears to reach the same level of your speakers. Good luck ! |
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Silver Member Username: Elitefan1Post Number: 414 Registered: Dec-03 | On an analog meter you set it to 70db, slow setting and hold as said above and adjust your channels so that all read out to zero [dead center] on the meter. I have never used a digital meter but this is the proper procedure for the Radio Shack analog which I highly recommend and would do even if your receiver has a built in eq system. |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | Save your money to buy CD's or DVD's (or in deference to John A, DVD-A's) unless your speakers are drastically different in their basic sound. And if they are, spend your money there instead so everything matches as sounds "move" about the room. Most anyone can hit the test button and adjust levels to their liking. And unless you are into a major THX system or just very, very obsessed you'll do OK. Most level settings are relative to your sources. That's the reason the remote has buttons that allow changing levels on center, surrounds and sub to suit the wide variety of levels present on the sources you will play. If you are going to spend 30 - 50 bucks for something you'll use just once, then put in a drawer and start pushing the buttons to make changes in what you spent money to set ... in the words of the greatest philosopher of our time ... DOH!!! Try by ear first, if you realy need a meter go to the store where you bought this stuff (you did buy this stuff, didn't you?) and ask if they have a meter you can borrow. SPL meters are for Bolsheviks!!! |
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Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 125 Registered: Feb-04 | We may stray from time to time, But we Bolshiviks find the Party line to be useful, Most of the time. |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | John S. - Ah, yes. The party line. Look where that has led us. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1073 Registered: Dec-03 | John S wrote: "but you would be surprised how often the meter regesters differently than your ears. " When it does, it is always the meter that is wrong. It might be calibrated incorrectly. Ears are auto-calibrating, provided they are connected to the hardware and software with which they came. The Bolsheviks never understood that. |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | The Bolsheviks only understood one thing. Power and lack of the same. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1099 Registered: Dec-03 | I agree, Jan. However, they had their SPL meter, too, just to help them gain it, and others lose it. It is called ideology. |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | Ah, yes. Ideology! Look where that has led us! |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | John A. - Don't know if I can continue this any longer. I feel big brother lurking at my door! |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1144 Registered: Dec-03 | Jan, Re. ideology; my point, precisely. Re. Big Brother. I fear he is just beginning to understand digital technology. Scary. Then there is the lure if the 58" plasma telescreen. But you are right, we can't be too careful. I think you and I can both guess whose loudspeakers are in Room 101.... |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | Room...1...0...1...i feel...i'm being...led there... |
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Soundperson Unregistered guest | Room 101? Elaborate please. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1174 Registered: Dec-03 | Soundperson, Sorry. I guess Jan and I are just each trying to understand where the other is coming from. "Room 101" appears in a novel called "1984" by George Orwell. "1984" was first published in 1949. It is about an imaginary, future, totalitarian society. "Big Brother" was the all-powerful dictator most people had come to love, and trust. The devices the various Ministies of the state had, to control people, were ingenious, and amazingly accurate, if you look at the way the world has gone since. "Room 101" was a kind of psychological threat, the ultimate deterrent for the persistently subversive, who had not learned to say, truthfully "I love Big Brother". In Room 101, whoever you are, you will be confronted with whatever it is you most hate and fear. There have been several film versions of "1984", some with altered endings, none coming anywhere near the book, in my opinion. I doubt if it is on Disney's shortlist. |
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New member Username: ScotnerPost Number: 1 Registered: Jun-04 | The Radio Shack 33-2050 analog SPL meter has been reduced to $14.97. Probably hard to find, but last week, one of my local stores still had one display and one NIB. (Now only the display left, of course.) |
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Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 128 Registered: Feb-04 | Scott: It's doubtful many Radio Shacks still have the old model in stock, but $15 is worthwhile price. I would be careful not to show it in public however, lest some unregestered guest brand you a communist. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1357 Registered: Dec-03 | In my area (no Radio Shack) the analogue SPL meters are much more expensive than the digital. I would buy one of those, at that price, like a shot. It would be easy to hide, when not in use.... (smiley). |
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Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 131 Registered: Feb-04 | John A.: My original post should have read "you'd be surprised how often the meter regesters differently than your ears especially on lower freqencies." This, in my opinion, is the greatest value of the SPL meter, especially as it relates to the important crossover between small satelite speakers and a subwoofer in a surround system. Anybody can listen by ear and adjust to any white noise generator in their receiver and make appropriate volume adjustments around the channels. But a smooth transition between the mains and the sub is both difficult and critical, and this is where an external audio measurement device along with a reference disc is beneficial. This bass management question is complicated by the fact that the setup procedure on the average digital surround receiver asks whether the speakers are "large" or "small" (whatever that means), and what freqency the mains and the sub crossover frequency (usually 80-100-120 Hz) should be. Who can blame the average user for being confused? A setup disc and an 'extra ear' can at least give a home theater enthusiast a reference point in audio accuracy. From there, depending on specific discs, ajustments in volume levels may be necessary, but at least the reference levels are established. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1367 Registered: Dec-03 | John, Yes, I agree with that. And I have been tempted to get an SPL meter, just out of interest. But I don't think anyone should feel it is essential. In the end, what matters is what you hear. Where what you measure surprises you, it is kind of interesting to find out why. I have a stereo test disc, and have a 5.1 test disc on order. These are useful to isolate channels, frequencies, etc., which you can never do with real program material. Also, you get a subjective feel for what things like frequencies, in Hz, and SPL increases, in dB, really mean. One of the recurring problem on this forum, though, is people not trusting their own judgement about what they hear. I suspect Jan takes that line, too. The joke about "Bolshevism" (at least for me) was a reference to people (or measuring devices) telling people what they really hear, or ought to believe they hear. It was a bit obscure, now I read it back, and I apologise for any misunderstanding. |
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Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 140 Registered: Feb-04 | John A.: At $15, an SPL meter might offer more amusement than any one of half my CD collection, which are never played anymore. I do agree that the ultimate SPL meter should be one's ears. But judging from what I've heard with friends and relatives HT/TV/Stereo settings, some peoples' eyes and ears need some calibration. Maybe it's just me, but haven't you seen and heard some terrible A/V in other homes? And it wasn't because the equipment was so awful, but rather because the owners had no clue about accuracy and balance. For me, it's all I can do to keep my hands off the remotes. I'd bet half the first time HT setups everywhere have the bass jacked up way too high (hey--got to get money's worth out of that new sub), and the rear channels set too high for the same reason. Maybe this is almost good enough for a new thread: "The big game at a friend's house: Nightmare on Elm St." |
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Gold Member Username: John_aPost Number: 1566 Registered: Dec-03 | JOHN S, Agreed. Apologies for forgetting this thread. My Rantz's DVD-Audio & SACD > Optimizing with a Sound Level Meter reminded me. I link this thread there, too. |