Denon HTIB / Samsung HDTV: connection questions
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 1 Registered: Dec-05 | I have a Samsung P5685W DLP HDTV and a Denon S-301 HTIB. While the Denon manual appears to be quite comprehensive, it is also quite confusing. The instructions are so poorly written that I have been unable to figure how to achieve maximum quality audio and video. Since this is my first home theater set-up, I need all the help I can get! At least I have the system up and running at the basic level, but I figure I should be able to get even better results. Should I purchase an HDMI cable? I presume that would be the best way to go, although I'm not sure. I'm simply interested in doing whatever is necessary to get the best possible sound and picture from my system. Also, how do I get TV/HDTV audio to play through my Denon home theater system? CD's and DVD's play just fine thru the S-301, but so far I've had to rely on the TV speakers for TV programming. I figure there should be a simple way to set this up. I would greatly appreciate hearing from anyone who may be able to help me. Thank you very much. |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 554 Registered: Feb-04 | William, An HDMI hookup may very well provide a significant improvement in picture quality, and if I were you I would give it a try. It may also be a very small improvement, but it should still be worth it. The audio signal from the TV signal has to be fed into the Denon receiver, either from a digital (or analog) output from your cable/satellite box, or from an audio output from the TV itself. |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 2 Registered: Dec-05 | John, Thank you very much for your help. I'll see if Wal-Mart has an HDMI cable tonight. If not, it'll be Best Buy tomorrow. I'll also try hooking up the audio later tonight. I'm wondering if one method of audio hook-up might provide better results than another -- or would it make any difference? Thanks again, Bill |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 555 Registered: Feb-04 | William, You've still not specified how you're gatteing the TV signal---antenna, cable or satellite. That answer would determine the best audio hookup. Don't spend too much on an HDMI cable before you check out monoprice.com |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 3 Registered: Dec-05 | John, Oops! I failed to mention that I have Comcast digital cable, which I assume means the best method for hook-up would be thru my cable box. Thank you very much for the monoprice link; those prices are unbelievable! William |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 4 Registered: Dec-05 | John, My brother just brought over two cables: (1) a Monster Cable Ultra 800 HDMI; and (2) a Monster Cable Ultra 600 Fiber Optic. I've used the HDMI cable to connect the TV to the Denon home theater receiver, which I presume is correct. I haven't yet used the fiber optic cable. Should I run it from the Comcast cable tuner (Digital Optical SPDF) to the Optical Digital In jack of the Denon receiver? It appears that I first have to peel back the coverings from these jacks. I just want to make sure that I'm making the proper connections. Thanks, William |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 556 Registered: Feb-04 | "I've used the HDMI cable to connect the TV to the Denon home theater receiver, which I presume is correct." Yes. "I haven't yet used the fiber optic cable. Should I run it from the Comcast cable tuner (Digital Optical SPDF) to the Optical Digital In jack of the Denon receiver? It appears that I first have to peel back the coverings from these jacks. I just want to make sure that I'm making the proper connections." Sounds like you are about to join the world of digital video and audio. |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 557 Registered: Feb-04 | By the way, "S/PDIF" (Sony/Philips Digital InterFace) is the one RCA-type jack usually marked "digital audio out", and the optical audio out is known as "Toslink". Both do the same job of carrying the digital audio stream, the one on wire and the other on optical fiber. Either can be used, but not both at the same time. Good Luck. |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 5 Registered: Dec-05 | John, Well, the HDMI setup works very well; I can definitely notice an improvement in the picture, even though I thought it was very good before. Regarding the fiber optic cable, I did hook it up (from the cable TV tuner to the "In" jack of the Denon), but I still don't have cable/HD sound coming through my surround speakers. (The connection doesn't really feel all that snug, but I believe both ends are in all the way.) Do I use ONLY the fiber optic cable to get audio, or do I need to make another audio connection in conjunction with the fiber optic? For example, do I still need to make a Left & Right speaker connection to the Denon? Or could it be that I simply need to make a settings change? Or perhaps move a switch to a different position? I don't believe there's any real problem here, other than my lack of knowledge as to what needs to be done. I feel sure the solution must be simple; it's just that I don't know what it is. Thanks again for your help. Sincerely, Bill |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 6 Registered: Dec-05 | It's been over a week and I still haven't been able to get my Comcast HD signal to play through my surround system. I've read through both the Denon manual and the Motorola (Comcast) manual and haven't found an answer. The Denon manual was of no help at all. I tried to follow Motorola's instructions to connect my cable receiver (DCT6400 Series HD Dual-Tuner DVR) to my A/V receiver, but to no avail. I believe the cables are properly connected, but there's obviously something else I need to do -- and it's probably something very simple. I've called both Denon Main Office and Denon Repair and got busy signals both times. I called Best Buy an hour ago and was put on hold until I finally hung up. I would greatly appreciate hearing from someone who might be able to help me. Thank you very much. |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 7 Registered: Dec-05 | Well, I just went to Audioholics.com and printed a diagram telling, step-by-step, how to "Connect a Digital Cable TV Box or Satellite Receiver." I'll try to follow the instructions and see if that works. |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 576 Registered: Feb-04 | William, Sorry to see you're still having trouble with audio from the cable box. Some things: 1) Are we sure the optical output on the cable box is active? Is there a red beam of light visible on that output when there's no optical cable hooked up to it? 2) Is that optical cable hooked from the cable box into the Aux 3 input on the Denon? This is the only optical input available. Obviously, the cable should not be hooked into the optical output, which is right next door to the Aux 3 optical input on the Denon. 3) Your audio input mode should be set to "Auto". This insures the Denon will detect any digital signal on an input first, and failing that, will look for an analog signal second. The Audioholics diagram recommends using both a digital hookup as well as using regular R/L analog wires in case some of the cable channels audio are not digital and some are. (This was the case on an old cable system I used to have, where channels 2 to 100 were analog and channel 101 and above were Dolby Digital.) There is a set of R/L input jacks marked "Aux 3" to the left of the digital inputs. To make sure your Denon's audio detect is set to "Auto", go to System Setup Audio, then scroll down to "Input Mode" and enter the "Auto" option. 4) To state the obvious, you must then select Aux 3 by hitting the Aux button on the remote (near the top) until you see Aux 3 on the Denon's display. Select a premium HD or movie channel on the cable box and turn up the Denon volume control. If you don't have sound after all this, I don't know what else to suggest! Good luck. I admire your patience.  BTW, many cable set top boxes have an independent volume control on the front of the box. If you see a volume +/- control there, make sure it is set to the max level. |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 8 Registered: Dec-05 | Even though I'm happy to report that I'm finally getting the TV audio to play through my new surround system, I still have a couple of questions for this forum regarding the connections I've made. Perhaps I've even made some unnecessary connections. I have a yellow Video cable connecting the cable TV box to the A/V receiver, then another yellow Video cable running from the A/V receiver to the television. I also have the HDMI and Fiber Optic cables connected, so maybe I'm already getting the best audio and video possible. My cable TV receiver doesn't have an HDMI jack, so the HDMI cable is connected from the A/V receiver to the television. Perhaps I would get better results if my cable TV box had HDMI input/output capability so all three components could be inter-connected. I have Y/Pb/Pr Video cables running from the cable TV receiver to the television. The Component Video Out Y/Pb/Pr Out jacks on the back of my A/V receiver are NOT being used. Does it make any difference HOW -- or even IF -- I have these particular cables connected? The most confusing thing at the moment is figuring out how to use the new DENON A/V remote in conjunction with the Motorola/Comcast remote and the Samsung TV remote. I hope I'll be able to program the DENON remote to pretty much control everything. |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 9 Registered: Dec-05 | John, Thank you very much for your reply! I didn't read it until after my recent post. There IS a red light showing inside the optical output, which I presume means the output is active. The optical cable IS hooked to the Aux 3 optical input on the Denon It took a little while to figure out how to do it, but I just checked my audio input mode; it is already set to AUTO, which I figure is the default setting. I also made the R/L analog connection, which I figure may not be necessary. In fact, from reading my most recent post you may be able to determine if I've made any improper or unnecessary connections. However, since I'm now getting sound -- and it sounds quite good to me -- I figure there's a good chance the set-up is as it should be. Of course, I'm open to any suggestions which may improve what I already have. I do have one complaint remaining, and this one pertains only to DVD video. Roughly every 30 minutes or so my screen will suddenly turn black, but only for about four or five seconds when it then returns to normal. This sounds very similar to the following problem described by a customer reviewer at CNET. Here is a portion of his review: Cons: Frequent loss of picture. It's going back because of this. Full user opinion I am having a problem with my Denon which I bought last week. on average, every 30 minutes or so, the picture cuts to black for 5-10 seconds. The sound remains, but suddenly there is just nothing on my tv screen. I'm taking this back to where I bought it because of the glitch. Hoping it was just a faulty model. (End of review.) Do you have any idea what might be causing this problem, and, if so, how I might be able to correct it? Could it be something as simple as a loose connection? I really like the Denon S-301 and would prefer not to return it to Best Buy, but if this picture dropout problem persists I may have no choice. If I do end up returning it, I would then definitely upgrade to a true -- and more expensive -- surround system. Price is one of the main reasons I'd like to keep the Denon, but I'd be willing to spend the extra bucks if that's what it would take for me to be satisfied. Thank you very much for your help, John! Sincerely, William |
|
Bronze Member Username: PraetorianPost Number: 11 Registered: Dec-05 | Oh my... that's a lot of redundant cabling... HDMI = high def multimedia interface, which in short means both audio and video from one wire, as opposed to seperate videos (be they component, RCA, or s...) alongside seperate audio (ie the red/white RCA, digital optical). The "best" hook-up from this would be from your cable box to your receiver, but you said it des not have one, so unless your denon upconverts there is little to no use for this and it is so far being wasted. Perhaps you have an upconvert DVD? Perhaps your cable box has a DVI output? This would get you the same digital video quality as an HDMI without the sound feed accompanying it, but fear not! You have your optical audio for that anyway... So my suggestion: DVI (or failing that, component video) from your cable box to your receiver, component to your TV, although you can safely skip the receiver for video and have it go straight to your TV, since your using all the remotes anyway. That would save you the cost of another cable since you seem insistent on using monster ultra = way too much. Even Monster standard is somewhat over priced but will give you everything your TV can show you anyway. Then, the optical digital from your cable box directly to your receiver, which feeds to your surround speaker set up. As John previously stated, ensure the input is set to auto, which "looks" for digital first, then, analog in priority. This is ALL the cables you need to make your Box to TV set up work correctly and het surround sound where avail (assuming ofcourse you have a 5.1 set up hooked to your receiver...). Summary: 1. Save your HDMI for your upconvert DVD player or the like. 2. Video feed from box directly to TV, via DVI or component. 3. Audio from box directly to receiver. Receiver to Speakers. |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 577 Registered: Feb-04 | Good to hear you have the cable audio going now. You should be hearing full 5.1 on some channels, and there should be some indication of that on the Denon's front panel read-out. Any DVD video interruption during play-back is clearly unacceptable, and I can see no reason why this should happen. I'm assuming you have the unit set for progressive scan. This shouldn't be the problem as there should be no dropouts with interlace scan either. As a last resort, I would try the component output on the Denon into the second component input on the Samsung. There have been some complaints with performance/compatibility problems associated with certain equipment and HDMI. This would seem to be a step backward in potential picture quality, but that step should not be a big one. This may not solve your blackout problem, but I'd bet even odds that it does. |
|
Bronze Member Username: PraetorianPost Number: 12 Registered: Dec-05 | Or, hook the DVD video directly to your TV. The audio can still come through the reciver at the same time, so there is no loss in perfomance at all. I have never seen a receiver have any impact on pic quality, so other than reducing your remote controls (which you can do with most programable's anyway) what's the point? This WILL solve the blackout problem (unless it's a bum DVD player). |
|
Silver Member Username: John_sColumbus, Ohio US Post Number: 579 Registered: Feb-04 | Michael, Since William's Denon "receiver" is actually a all-in-one player/amp/receiver as part of a very good HTIB, the video has always been going into the TV directly from the player. First through the HDMI, and now I'm suggesting he try the component out instead.  |
|
New member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 10 Registered: Dec-05 | Thank you both for your suggestions, and thank you, John, for pointing out that I have an all-in-one "virtual surround" unit. I was going to mention that first thing this morning, but you beat me to it. I tried the "component out" from the Denon to the Samsung, but in order to do this I had to remove the cables from the cable TV receiver and insert them into the Denon's component out. The result was a smaller picture of lower quality and no onscreen text. When doing this is it all right to bypass the cable TV receiver, or do I need component connections to the TV from both receivers? I still get the blackouts, so I'm thinking the best thing to do is to box up both the unit and the Monster cables and return them to Best Buy for a refund. I purchased them two weeks ago, so I don't foresee any problem returning the items. I hope I can get a full refund and then perhaps go to the same locally-owned audio/video store I bought my TV from last Christmas and buy a full 5.1 surround system from there. The store has a good reputation and I'll be more than happy to have them install everything. Regarding a new home theater system, do you have any recommendations? I don't plan to go for virtual surround this time. Should I go for HTIB or would I be better off mixing and matching components? One of the main reasons I chose the three-speaker setup was because my fairly large living room is open on one side to the kitchen and dining rooms. In other words, like one very large room. I figured I'd have a hard time figuring out where to place the extra speakers. I guess they could even be ceiling-mounted, if necessary. Thanks again to both of you for your help thus far. William |
|
Bronze Member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 11 Registered: Dec-05 | I just talked to the owner of the local audio/video store and he told me he could sell me a 5.1 Denon system for around $1,500, plus installation. I didn't get the model number. He also has Yamaha, among other brands. |
|
Bronze Member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 12 Registered: Dec-05 | Well, I'm pleased to report that I returned the Denon virtual surround system and the two Monster Cables to Best Buy for a full refund. I still have no idea why the video blackouts occurred -- a faulty DVD player, perhaps. Anyhow, now I can start all over again -- this time with less expensive cables! Tomorrow, weather permitting, I plan to go to the A/V store where I purchased my TV last Christmas (2004). Their featured brands are: Denon • Yamaha • Macintosh • B&W • Definitive Technology Sonus Faber • Mitsubishi • Pioneer • Hitachi • Klipsch. As I noted previously, the owner suggested a system which would include a Denon receiver (AVR-1706, I believe) and Definitive Technology speakers. I already have a DVD player (Samsung HD-841, less than $200) which I bought along with my Samsung HDTV a year ago. It has an optical jack and a DVI Out jack. Would it make sense for me to upgrade to an HDMI-capable DVD player? Perhaps that would depend in part on which surround receiver I get. I believe I mentioned earlier that my Comcast box does not have an HDMI jack, but it does have a DVI-D Out jack. I recently read somewhere that many audio experts claim that HDMI is overrated, so maybe I would be wise to save my money and stay with my DVI DVD player. As always, I remain open to any potentially helpful tips and suggestions, so any and all advice is greatly appreciated. After my visit to the store I'll post again to let you know what I've decided. (It appears that strong storms may keep me home tomorrow.) Once again, I want to thank you both very much for helping guide me through my first home-theater experience. Sincerely, Bill |
|
Bronze Member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 13 Registered: Dec-05 | One more thing to consider is the purchase of a universal remote. I feel sure that using one would be a big improvement over my current situation, although my remotes seem to have a degree of universality, albeit limited. Still, I don't believe any of them would adequately control five or more components, which I figure is what I would need. I see a lot of universal remotes out there at $100-plus, but I also see a highly-rated SONY for $35, which sounds tempting. Do you have any recommendations? Thanks, Bill |
|
Bronze Member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 15 Registered: Dec-05 | Today I purchased a Marantz SR5500 A/V receiver ($550) and a Definitive Technology ProCinema 60 speaker system ($650). That's what was recommended by the salesperson. I also bought six Ethereal cables ($289 -- ouch!!!), and a pair of speaker stands ($100) which I may or may not use. Perhaps it would be better to mount the two surround speakers. Anyhow, I'm wondering if I got an okay deal. (I'm sticking with my year-old Samsung DVD player which has a DVI jack. I was told I could buy an HDMI converter for it if that's what I want.) The installers should be here in a day or two, so that will be an extra expense ($75 per hour, per installer). I'm also concerned about the size of my room. I have a 14' x 23' living room with one side open to the kitchen/dining area. Will the speaker system be adequate, both for the receiver and for the size of the room? I read a Def Tech 60 review which stated that it was a good system for an apartment or for a small room. I would greatly appreciate hearing from anyone with helpful comments or suggesions. Thank you. |
|
Bronze Member Username: PraetorianPost Number: 31 Registered: Dec-05 | The time to be asking if these are good purchases is BEFORE the cheque clears my friend! But it's all-good, I am very glad you did not buy the HDMI cable before we got to post again! The ONE AND ONLY DIFF in "quality" between HDMI and DVI is that the HDMI cable tx's both the audio and the video in one cable. Since you already have DVI, and optical audio, the HDMI is redundant, unless you have another use for both those cables. Your receiver is a pretty decent starter receiver, and you can upgrade to 7.1 any time you want. Some movies already come in 6.1, so you can start piecing together another speaker set now if you really wanted too. You did OK on the price you paid as well. There should be no buyer's remorse there! As for your speaker set, well, again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I have never been a huge fan of "sets" like that. Realistically, it is just fine for your room, and yes, you will hear it anywhere you go in the kitchen! Satellites acting as mains cannot compare to floorstanders, as well, the subs that come with sets rarely provide much more than just plain "boom". Do not fret though! You will definitely enjoy the true surround effect of 5.1, and should you decide to go 6 or 7.1, you can shift your current mains over to other satellite positions, and buy a pair of floorstanders, or should your upgrade need a rear centre, use your current front centre as the rear centre, and buy a name brand centre channel, the boost in quality will be very clear! When you have the money to waste, I would definitely invest in a powered sub woofer to replace this one (maybe a good BDay or anniversary present if you drop enough hints). I hesitate to present the idea to you in this way, because you might feel like you are missing something now, your not, your current set is enough to really enjoy a high def, 5.1 movie experience. Cables? BAH! You hit a sore spot with me there. While 3 c notes is hardly the price of "exotic" cables, you could have bought all the speaker wire you need for less than a buck a ft, and the banana plugs for your 5 channels for 20 -30$. There is nothing WRONG with the ones you have now, just over priced for what your getting. I am a Canuck, so sometimes I get lost when you guys use AWG, but 12 AWG should be good enough, your not sending the signal too far, and your speakers have a nominal resistance of 8 ohms I believe, so nothing out of the ordinary there. All in all, I believe you will really enjoy watching movies and getting a lot more "in" to the experience. Have fun! |
|
Bronze Member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 16 Registered: Dec-05 | Michael, Thanks for all the info! I now feel better overall about my new system. And so far I've been enjoying what I've been hearing. I know -- I know. It's a bit late to be asking about the stuff I bought, but I really wasn't too concerned about my purchases since I trust the dealer and his employees. They're quite reputable. Thanks for clearing things up for me regarding HDMI and DVI by letting me know that an HDMI cable would've been redundant. It's obvious that I need to do a lot of reading in order to increase my knowledge of electronics! The one major question I had remaining was with regard to upgrading -- and you answered that for me as well. As I sit here I could (almost) kick myself for not having bought floorstanders. At least I'm glad to know that my present system is versatile enough to allow me to shift my two mains to other positions and then get a pair of towers. And that's probably what I'll end up doing. I'd be embarrassed to go back to the store this soon and tell them I already want to trade in my new speaker system for something bigger and better. So maybe I'll just keep what I have and at some time in the near future add a couple of big ones -- although I don't know exactly where I'd put them. But, as they say, where there's a will there's a way. I see that there are a lot of slim towers available; still, I wonder if they deliver the same deep bass response as the wider ones. Also, since I never bothered to price the larger speakers I don't know how much I'd have to shell out for a very good set. Could I get a decent enough pair for, say, $500? (I just saw a pair of Def Tech floorstanders for $2,000, which is too much for me -- probably more speaker than I need, anyway.) Regarding subwoofers, I do have a Bostwick Pro HD which is not being used, but I had been using it in my previous mini-van. Which leads me to a dumb question. Is it somehow possible to adapt a car speaker for use with a home stereo system? If so, would it be worth the time and trouble? In any event, I believe I would like to add a powered subwoofer. I've been reading rave reviews of the Logitech Harmony universal remote for $250, but today I went to Circuit City and bought the $35 SONY RM-VL710, which is WIRED magazine's "editors' pick." I'll spend the next day or so programming it. If it doesn't suit me I may return it for a more elaborate model. Incidentally, isn't Logitech a Canadian company? While I'm at it, I might as well mention headphones. I'm wondering if there's anything out there for the money better than the highly-regarded -- and heavily-advertised -- Bose QC2 noise-cancelling set. Oh, well, I guess that's enough for now. If I can think of anything else I'll be sure to post it here. Thank you again very much for your help. I would greatly appreciate any other suggestions and advice you -- and/or anyone else -- may have. |
|
Bronze Member Username: KozakidUSA Post Number: 20 Registered: Dec-05 | By the way, I bought the $35 SONY RM-VL710 remote, and so far I am very pleased with its operation. I'm still learning how to program and use it. |
|
Bronze Member Username: PraetorianPost Number: 44 Registered: Dec-05 | Car Sub: https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/home-audio/2493.html Seems like a hell of a ot of hassle to me, but I am not electrically inclined. You can no doubt get a very good pair of floorstanders for 500$. Especially in the US. Just DO NOT buy them ou of the back of a van... Streem FS-808 comes to mind, don't pay more than 450-500 for those (ignore MSRP). You could even get them on ebay. SS-MF750H can be found for 200$. Might not be a bad choice for your current set up. I do not reccomend any brand per se (other than I have a pair ff those Sony's acting as rears) and I have Polks as mains and centre, but you just need to choose what you think sounds good. Audition a few at your price range. Research the brands and specs on the web, make sure the asking price is not inflated. |
Main Forums
Today's Posts- Home Audio Forum
- Home Video Forum
- Home Theater Forum
- Car Audio Forum
- Accessories Forum
- All Forum Topics