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New member Username: DoubtPost Number: 3 Registered: Nov-12 | Reading forums, it seems like an audio video receiver has its limit at some point, but it is not clear for me. Could anyone give me an example pair of front speakers to me? I would like to know how far this yamaha 3010 ($1,500 on amazon) is capable of (assume speaker price no concern). So, what is the best pair of speakers for yamaha 3010? - fat ps3 as a source - audioquest vodka hdmi Any comment welcomes, thank you! |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 17544 Registered: May-04 | . Music is temporal and dynamic. Speaker loads are reactive and dynamic. An amplifier must respond to both of these conditions, neither of which have any relation to a single sinewave input to the amp while it is working into a load resistor on a test bench. Your perception of an event is strictly your own and cannot be predicted by another person, especially on a first time post to a forum. In other words, no one can predict what you will "like" and what you will find to be offensive. There are no strict limits to any component under those circumstances, only situations for which a single component is not well suited. HT receivers are, for the most part, the weak link in any chain of components. They are most often designed and built with a greater emphasis on feature oriented performance than on strict audio performance. Power supplies are the heart of any audio amplifier as a gain stage is nothing more than a modulated power supply. If the HT receiver has been built with a compromise between features, power supply and cost, it's reasonably safe to assume the power supply is the first thing compromised. Some manufacturers are better at making these comprommises than are others. However, in the mass market of HT receivers, the compromise is almost always in audio performance when compared to the real event. To be fair, most HT systems are not set up well for high quality audio performance so there is a consideration to the real world which must be made for any product. Any audio manufacturer understands how to make numbers which appear beneficial to their product. It's essentially up to the buyer to wade through the numbers trying to make sense of what they actually indicate - which in many instances is actually nothing at all in the real world since most numbers do not reflect a real world condition when they are taken. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weighting The best advice I would have for you is to read the forum archives and you will find your answer. Be aware though, IMO, judging any audio component simply by comparing numbers is a fool's errand. The purpose of an audio component is to reproduce music. Saying any set of numbers indicates a higher fideltiy to that purpose is no more useful than saying most cars have four wheels. More directly to your question, I would simply suggest you avoid any speaker which has been measured and judged to be a highly reactive load. The closer the speaker's load values are to that ideal resistive load on the test bench, the more likely the amp will perform satisfactorily. Establish your budget for speakers using the idea that speakers should not represent any specific per centage of your total system cost. The idea of spending the bulk of your budget on speakers is now very old fashioned thinking in audio. Once you've determined a price range and narrowed your choices to a few prospective models, do a search for reviews with measurements for each of those speakers. If you cannot find measurements, contact the manufacturer and ask for further details on the load values of their speaker. If the manufacturer prefers not to be completely honest with a potential client, I would take that as an indication of how they will treat you after the sale. https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/home-audio/628565.html . |
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New member Username: DoubtPost Number: 4 Registered: Nov-12 | I appreciate the really long post there! I would like to change a question a bit. How about according to your own preference, which one do you guys think is the best for yamaha 3010? Also, besides reading forums, is there any book related to how to make a speaker or how speakers work in depth or something like that? Thank you! |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 17545 Registered: May-04 | . There are dozens of book on how speakers operate and how they are designed into systems. As far as building your own speaker this is the classic starting point; http://www.mfr-eng.com/ldc.htm Retailers such as Parts Express, Madisound and Planet10 will have articles and links which should take you further into the many aspects of how speakers operate. On a far more technically adept scale this;http://www.linkwitzlab.com/ is a good read. One problem with your request is you still find the more objectivist numbers oriented engineers holding somewhat different views regarding what is actually important to good loudspeaker performance vs the subjectivist view point which concentrates on the music reproduction vs the static test wave performance. For example, Elliott is an Electrical Engineer who can give you excellent facts when he is discussing the science of audio. I tend to find Elloitt to be quite consistent with most other numbers oriented writers however in that he stays very close to the performacne of a componenent in the test lab and doesn't always equate these results to the purpose of an audio component, reproducing interesting music. http://sound.westhost.com/ . |
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New member Username: DoubtPost Number: 5 Registered: Nov-12 | Thanks, Jan! I understand that sound is subjective. But i think it's great to explore the full potential of yamaha 3010 from other people views too, not just myself. It is fine that the best speakers are not the same for everyone. They are all great guides to me. My goal of this post is to learn something, rather than buy something. I respect all thoughts, but not that i will buy the system based on other thoughts alone. I have some preference too. But like i say, it's always great to hear more! ^^ i might be missing something out. May be i don't know how to communicate in a webboard. This is my very first times posting on a webboard. May be i should be more specific. I'm trying to build a 2.0 channel music/movie/game system here. I first look at an integrated amplifier, but seems like it can't decode dolby truehd & dts hd ma. So i look back at avr because pre pro seems to be too expensive. Yamaha 3010 seems to be the one i'm most interested in right now, because it's the cheapest flagship ($1,400 on amazon)(h/k & cambridge audio flagships are cheaper but i don't know; don't feel good about them). So buidling my first system based on this one seems fun, but i can't judge its limit cause 1010 is the highest model in my area. So, again, in your opinion, what front pair of speakers would be best for this yamaha 3010 (assume price no concern)? And i think i will buy super slim ps3 this black friday. It would by my source. This is gonna be in a living room, no dedicated room. |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 17546 Registered: May-04 | . https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/home-audio/710267.html I'm afraid I'm about to disappoint you again. Just naming a speaker is not very productive IMO. You should already have some priorities in mind but I don't have your priorities in my mind. You know how loud you intend to play your music. You know where in the room the speakers might fit and where they might perform best. You should know something about the room the speakers will go into and whether it will work better with one speaker over another. You simply know too many things I don't know about your specific situation which would easily impact any recommendation. I've given you some information to read and take in. You should, first, be looking for an easy to drive speaker that will not tax the Yamaha. That means relatively high impedance (with relatively benign phase angle) and a relatively high sensitivity. There are too many speakers to select from which meet those rather simple specs. The character of those numerous high impedance, high sensitivity speakers swings from rough and brash to laid back and sweet. YOU must decide which character type will best suit your desires taking into account a good speaker will mirror the character of the amplifier driving it and any speaker will take on the sonic fingerprint of the room. Speakers with a forward nature put into a room with too many hard, reflective surfaces will tend to sound too forward and too "hard". Add an amp that is somewhat cool or "bright" and you'll likely be disappointed. IMO the Yamaha is not a warm, laid back sounding amp and you should be careful with speakers that have too much emphasis in the upper ranges. With that in mind, try starting with Stereophile; http://www.stereophile.com/equipment-reviews. Their equipment reviews include testing for certain values and JA will comment on the difficulty of the speaker as a load on a real world amplifier. If the comments suggest the speaker will require careful system matching or a hefty amplifier to work well, pass on that speaker. If the speaker is characterized as being a easy load, give that speaker some consideration. Be aware that all subjective reviewers have their own priorities and just because a reviewer says a speaker performed in a certain manner doesn't mean those are values which will be important to you. Or that your amp and room will represent the same personality of their amp and room. This is one good way to begin selecting prospective purchases. You should know what you are looking for in terms of the electrical values of the speaker. Only you can determine which speakers might "sound good" to your ears. If a speaker is not covered by Stereophile, that doesn't mean it's not a prospective buy. There are simply too many speaker companies to deal with and many of the on line speakers you can find are excellent values since there is no middle man profit. I'm sorry to say you'll have to do your own research as I simply don't do recommendations of specific products unless the needs outlined preclude certain values as in the thread I've included here. I'll be glad to comment on any speaker's electrical compatibility with your receiver if you'll include measurements pertinent to that speaker. That, IMO, is the best thing I can do on a forum and not just lead you to a specific speaker and say, "Buy that." . |