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New member Username: CpdaveyNorman, OK United States Post Number: 1 Registered: Jan-11 | Hi, I would appreciate some advice on where to go next. My current setup comprises an Onkyo TX-SV525 5.1 channel receiver (60W/channel), an Onkyo DX-1800 CD player, and KEF Q1 bookshelf speakers (8 ohm, 100 W). Both Onkyo components are 10+ years old. I use this equipment in my 12x12 home office, mainly to listen to classical (esp. chamber music and vocal repertoire) with some occasional alternative and jazz. Especially with chamber music I often feel like individual instruments are much less well-defined on my current system than they ought to be. I'd like the sound to be more precise. Most of my listening is at moderate volumes, but I do like to listen to the occasional Mahler symphony at very high volume! With $1500--$2000, what is my best option? I've had some experience with Rotel and thought they did a good job with classical music, but I'm also intrigued by the Emotiva combo packs ($1500 would get me two 200 W mono-block amps, a stereo preamp, and CD player). I'd like equipment that will still be suitable if I ever trade in the Q1s for something more high-end. And, of course, I want something that will play well with the Q1s until then. Unfortunately, the closest non-Best Buy audio retailer is 40 miles away, so listening to a lot of different set-ups to find the one that sounds best isn't really an option for me. Cheers! |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 15860 Registered: May-04 | . So how are you going to buy anything? Just take a recommendation and find it on line? You want Mahler at loud volumes but the Q1's are not great speakers to be playing Mahler at loud volumes. . |
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New member Username: CpdaveyNorman, OK United States Post Number: 2 Registered: Jan-11 | Well, I did say the occasional loud Mahler and that I was looking for advice on options that would allow me to grow into something more appropriate at a later date. My plan was to follow up on any recommendations when I do eventually visit the nearest audio store. But because of its distance I thought going in with some recommendations and ideas would be better than simply making a long drive with no clear ideas. |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 15864 Registered: May-04 | . 200 watts of Emotiva is a bit of overkill for a 12X12 office, don'ja think? If you want the occasional "loud Mahler", you'll do better to look for speakers with higher sensitivity/efficiency specs. Buying wattage is not a productive way to get volume as you have to constantly double the power output to gain 3dB of clean headroom for peaks, the average levels stay the same as with your old amp. In other words, it's only on the peaks in the music that additional wattage becomes relevant. If you're not clipping the amplifier, then the additional wattage is not gaining you anything. Now, whether the amplifier is a better amplifier is another question. But you can find a ten watt amplifier that is subjectively "better" than your Onkyo HT receiver. What you consider "better" I have no way of telling on a forum. If you buy a speaker with a three dB higher sensitivity spec (,http://www.enjoythemusic.com/audioterminology.htm#S you have accomplished the same thing as buying an amplifier with double the power. Either way you've gained three dB of additional headroom for peak levels. Whatever amp you pair with the higher efficiency/sensitivity speakers will work less hard at any volume and stay cleaner on peaks and with complex music. Those are generalizations and I'm sure you can find a high sensitivity speaker that still sounds like pounded dog crap but buying speakers with high sensitivity will get you were you want to go better than buying raw wattage. I don't remember the spec on the Q1's but they are probably an "average" sensitivity speaker at around 85-87dB. As far as suggesting a new amplifier, I have no clue since I have no idea what's available to you in Norman, OK. If you read the archived threads here, you'll see the favored budget brands are NAD, Rotel, Cambridge, HK, Rega, etc. Most real audio shops will carry at least one of those brands. Onkyo and Marantz build good quality integrated amplifiers (no tuner/radio, just an "amp") as do all of the above mentioned companies. Integrateds tend towards a higher sound quality as they tend to appeal to the slightly more serious listener who wants something not usually found in the big box stores. I would suggest you give your business to a store that allows in person auditions before you buy and which can provide some good advice in your situation. Local brick and mortar dealers need to be patronized or else they will all disappear for good. If you spend time with a dealer and take their advice and use their demo facilties, don't head to the internet to try to undercut them in price. They need to make some profit before they all disappear forever and most dealers will work with you on price on most gear. But you can also go through a few of the on line retailers such as Audio Advisor and Music Direct to find a wider assortment of products. Those two have a reputation for good products, good advice and good service. You could also try the classic used products from Audio Classics, a McIntosh receiver or integrated amp would IMO be ideal for an office system; http://www.audioclassics.com/detail.php3?detail=MAC4100&nav=cat or http://www.audioclassics.com/detail.php3?detail=MA6200&nav=cat I would not buy anything used through eBay or anything like eBay, you are asking to get screwed. Buy a component like that from a reputable retailer and you'll have something you can use for years and still sell back at pretty much the price you paid. The Mac will also allow you to upgrade to just about any reasonable speaker. Unless you are hyper-critical in your listening habits a Mac is a Mac even in their vintage gear and whichever one you buy you will have the Mac sound. For "loud" listening one of the more recent units with Power Guard would be desirable. I would avoid tubes unless you already have a good deal of experience with tubes as they do require some maintenance that might be less than easily accomplished in Norman, OK. You don't want to be shipping a fifty pound amplifier back and forth to NY just because a tube went noisey. You can also go the T amp route through Parts Express; http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-383 Super cheap, super basic and sound quality way above its price range. Here's a review I did of the little 5 watter a few years back; https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/products/reviews/209464.html I still have those two amps along with my Mac intergated and some Mac tubes. I wouldn't put the T amp above the Mac sound - and the Mac integrated is just more flexible in use - but it does offer some very good sound for low dollars. T amps need about 40-50 hours of running time before they start to sound their best then you can leave them on all the time if you prefer as they draw minimal current. They are very "green" amps in comparison to most two hundred watters out there. Keep in mind how you set the system up will provide a substantial portion of the sound quality you hear. If you've just plonked the KEF's down where they fit, that's never in my experience where they will sound their best. Read some of the archived threads and get a feel for how to get the best from whatever you buy. If you go through a dealer in Norman, they should also be able to provide advice on set up and some after the sale assistance in getting the best from their gear. Set up is at least 50% of what you hear and speaker position/placement is about 90% of what you get from any pair of speakers. Invest a few bucks in good cables while you're at it. . |