...and in with the new! Well, after living with and enjoying them for 4 or 5 years, it seems the Mani-2 Sigs are going up for sale.
This is the 'Before' shot:
And this is the 'After' shot:
For those not in the know, the latter are a pair of Naim SL-2 speakers. My hand was forced actually. Naim are discontinuing the SL-2 and replacing it with a much larger (and cheaper!) model called the Ovator S-600. I couldn't physically accommodate the S-600s and I've always hankered after SL-2s. So, I made an executive decision and ordered the last pair in cherry without hearing them in my room first which, for a £6750 speaker is a bit of a risk, even in the trade.
At first I was a touch worried that they might not work in the room, but after a few days of play, they're beginning to fill out and do what I'd hoped. So the Mani-2 Sigs will be put up for sale soon I think (little tear escapes, because I do really love the Mani-2s).
A little from Naim's website on the SL2. Very interesting Frank:
The SL2 is a compact package of speed, precision and musical coherence
It represents an extension of the Naim loudspeaker design philosophies that were pioneered fourteen years ago with the release of the original Naim SBL, wherein separate boxes are used for the bass unit and its loading chamber.
The two cabinets are separated by a PAR (precision acoustic resistance), a Naim innovation that ensures consistent and accurate loading of the bass drive unit, irrespective of loudness, providing an ideal acoustic performance not possible in conventionally configured loudspeakers. The larger cabinet acoustically loads the bass-mid driver giving the precision and control of a small loudspeaker combined with the power, bandwidth and dynamic range of a much larger box.
Cabinet colorations and resonances are further controlled and reduced by the application of Naim's thermally stable aluminium mass dampers to the internal walls. The decoupled cast aluminium plinth provides essential stability and controls the critical interface between loudspeaker and floor. A combination of curved and non-parallel surfaces reduces internal standing waves and creates a visually stunning loudspeaker, available in a range of modern, real wood veneers.
The Naim designed and manufactured bass-mid drive unit features a computer modelled aluminium chassis and split-mass aluminium phase plug, improving heat dissipation and providing exceptional power handling over a wide frequency range. The wide-dispersion Scan-Speak tweeter was chosen for its ultimate sound quality after exhaustive comparisons. Another Naim innovation for the SL2 is the arm, attached at the mechanically stable aluminium plinth and totally separate from the rest of the loudspeaker, that holds the tweeter. This provides the ideal mechanical situation for the tweeter, making it completely free of interference from the mid and bass frequencies, allowing for the ultimate high frequency performance.
The passive crossover is decoupled from the rear panel of the speaker by anti-vibration mounts, protecting it from microphonic disturbances. Being sited externally also allows for easy removal and use of the SL2 in fully active systems.
The SL2 is designed to be consistent, easy to set up and ensure high levels of performance in every situation. The virtual absence of cabinet resonance and mechanical interference provides a startling yet totally natural musical clarity.
click image to enlarge
Specifications Frequency response (in room) 30Hz - 20kHz 3dB
Sensitivity 88dB/1W/1m
Impedance 6 Ohms (minimum)
Power handling 150W (music programme)
Dimensions H x W x D 1027mm x 282mm x 310mm
Finish options include American Cherry Maple Black Ash
If Naim has a weakness it's in speakers. Or so I've read. Never heard any Naim speakers myself. But at that price, and with Naim's reputation (especially when paired with other Naim gear) I can't imagine they are slouches at all.
I heard one Naim system myself, nait 5i and cd5i, paired with speakers from Neat. Very nice, but it was hard to compare from one store to another. I'd love to give some Naim gear an in home trial, or an in store trial head to head against more conventional gear (Naim's PR&T vs. conventional hifi).
Thanks so much for the compliments. To answer a few questions...
Yes, it's a marble fireplace which works and is very lovely on cold winter nights, although to be honest it could be in better shape. We believe it's original, as is the leaded window. The house was built in 1929 or 1935 depending on which records you look at. The secondary glazing on the window is disgusting, but too expensive to replace (well, that would put paid to any HiFi development plans). The room is 13'6" by 11'. You're looking at the 11' wall. Originally we used it as the dining room and the smaller rear 11'6x11' room as the lounge. The colour suited a dining room better than a lounge in my view (lounges should have more restful colours I think), but the colour does really suit the room and I am Mr. Lazy when it comes to DIY - and we'd have to empty the room to re-do it. The colour had originally been chosen as a joint decision, it took 3 coats and was a nightmare to put on because of the type of paint (a 'period' type paint which stinks), but it went very nicely with the mahogany furniture. If we ever manage to build the extension (anyone got £50k or so?), this room will revert to being the dining room.
It's true I don't normally post pictures. I just felt that SL-2s being so unusual, it might prove to be an interesting shot.
FYI, the speakers were 13 inches from the back wall and just a bit too light in the bass, but only just. I moved them into the position as shown in the shot (10" from the wall) and the bass is just nicely balanced. One of the benefits of the SL-2 is that it is designed to go near the back wall. My room has an enormous 40hz and 80hz resonance which the Mani-2s used to excite all too easily. I didn't mind it so much since I only got the 40hz hit in the seated position, but my wife gets both 40 and 80hz hits, and she's not a big fan of bass anyway.
I purposely hadn't updated my profile because I wasn't sure the Naims would stay after the first week! Naim speakers are a bit like marmite - you love them or hate them. Most people hate them. I had heard our SL-2s do amazing things in the shop, and for the last couple of years I'd wanted to give them a try, but they were awfully expensive (much more than the Mani-2s even at trade) and I've only had the Mani-2s since 2005 and I had taken years to find the Mani-2s (I change systems rarely). I also didn't think Naim would stop SL-2 production quite as quickly as they did! then when they did stop production, there was a massive run on the last pairs, mainly by dealers who, like me, had always hankered after a pair but never got around to buying a set, so there's a bunch of dealers who are happy new owners of SL-2s for personal purposes!
What do they do? Well, they have a bit better resolution than the Mani-2s (which was a surprise), they are much faster and far more demanding of a quality signal, but they're a whole lot easier to drive. They have no warmth to speak of (which is why so many people hate them), and they can be extremely explicit so you need a well sorted system for them to work to their potential. We've enjoyed a few 'Wow' moments already. Dark Side Of The Moon was particularly telling and made more sense than usual - as well as sounding completely fresh. Belle And Sebastian was typically moving and yet more relaxed, George Shearing was better described and far more emotionally satisfying. Dave Brubeck's Concord On a Summer Night actually made sense for the first time ever, Vangelis' The City had real intensity. That said, there were some things which didn't quite gel, but I really think that's because they're still running in.
In passive form (as I'm running them), they take 6 months to run in, in part due to the crossovers and in part to the drive units. In active form (a dream) they take about 3 months. Every day has been an adventure so far. They change daily, usually for the better. I put the XLO burn-in track on the CD player as much as I can. So far they have shown great potential, but I can tell they're still sounding tight and not quite as cohesive as a well run in pair of Naim speakers (Naim speakers excell in this regard usually). Eventually, my Naim rep will be paying a visit to see if he can wring more out of them. I think we'll be drinking a fair bit that evening... At least I know I've set up the speakers correctly. they're bouncing beautifully and independently of the tweeter unit, which is as it should be.
I'm sad they have stopped making them, but they were never big sellers and Naim want to sell speakers. I can only think that the new direction they've taken is specifically to address this. I just hope they don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. At least the same chap who designed the SL-2s and SBLs is designing the Ovators. Roy is a genuinely brilliant mind when it comes to speakers in my view.
I have to say this was the first Saturday ever where I felt that I was going to get less music at teh shop than at home. The SL-2s are so...open and communicative and the shop not having Naim speakers (apart from the n-Sats) didn't hold that much appeal! I still enjoyed myself of course. My CD player is now realistically the weak point in my system and so the improvement is much more obvious with the record deck. I can see myself going much higher on the digital side in the next few years, and perhaps on the amp end, provided I get the chance/money/etc.
As amazing as the SL-2s s can sound, they sound far better with active XOs in my experience. I wasn't the one demoing them; I sat in on another regular customer's demo.
The newest Linn LP12 with all the upgrades (totalling about $30k) certanly helped things.
Yes, I've heard that they are a completely different animal when driven actively, and yet I've never heard them driven actively! Naim made a major change to their active crossovers a few years ago. Until then I'd never been convinced by Naim active systems, but a couple of years back I heard a top end active system (with far larger Naim DBLs) and having just heard the system in passive form I realised that at last Naim had made an active crossover I liked. If I ever have the cash I'll consider it, but I need the better digital front end first, as well as possibly a better preamp. It's just all so expensive! And I should really be looking at a newer car instead.
Amazing how we tend to justify purchases over time even if first impressions were overwhelmingly negative. Says something about how much weight should be given certain equipment evaluations.
Indeed, the idea of mucking around with lorries on the road is rather daunting - at least the end would be quick!
Nuck, rather surprisingly, the SL-2s are fleshing out very nicely already. If they continue to get better I'll be well pleased. That said, I know enough, the Manis are up for sale. As for Brits drinking warm beer - yuck, not for me. More a wine man...
Stu, actually considering the Bentley brand name and the cost of the Naim for Bentley system, I think it's cheap! I mean, $10,000 of anybody's money is a LOT to pay for an in-car entertainment system, especially one with a Sony head on it, but in Naim and Bentley terms that's peanuts, especially if it's good (and I hear it's very very good).
As for the Continental GT - too big, too thirsty, too...ostentatious!
$10k for anything in a Bentley is peanuts for those guys!
Living where I do (NYC suburbs), I see every high priced car on an almost daily basis - Ferrarri, Maseratti, Bentley, Aston Martin, and so on (although I rarely see Lambos for some odd reason). Where I grew up, we'd hardly ever see them. I know a bunch of people back home who've probably never seen 3/4 of them in person. Seeing them everyday, they lose something to me. I guess they're just not that big a deal.
I don't know why, but the Contental GT gets my attention every time, and in a good way. I think it has the best balance of classy and sporty looks. If I were to buy a car worth more than twice the cost of the average home, I'd go with it.
Stay away from VW! As a son of a mechanic, a nephew of 2 mechanics that also own a used car lot, I've inquired about just about every car on the market. It may very well be the worst car on the road.
My uncles stopped selling VWs and Audis. Way too many came back. All sorts of problems, big and small. They sell very well and can be bought for a good wholesale price and bring a respectable profit. But they caused them way too many headaches to keep selling them.
Funny thing is VW's diesel engines were far more reliable than their other engines. No idea about the current generation. Here's a great VW story from my uncle...
He has a customer who bought a brand new Jetta. He went through 3 transmissions that were fortunately covered under warantee.
They have a plastic water pump propeller. What happens when you spin a cheap plastic part at 3500 RPM (well under redline)? Exactly what you think happens - it shatters.
The same guy's water pump shattered 37 miles after the warantee ended. The dealer refused to cover it. He brought it to my uncle who spent 6 hours fishing out plastic shrapnel from the engine. He put a new one in that was OEM. Literally 8 blocks down the road, it shattered again. My uncle didn't charge the guy labor the second time around (which he wasn't obligated to do) under one condition - he sells the car.
And that cheap plastic water pump ain't exactly cheap. My father and uncles have fixed dozens of them.
That's just crazy Stu. Plastic moving parts... not good.
I've never been remotely interesting in owning VW, especially after a coworker of mine brought one back at end of lease and was reamed for all sorts of minor things like "excessive wear" on the windshield wipers. Anyone care to guess the markup on authentic VW wipers?
Mind you, GM does the same sort of things to it's customers these days too. Don't even get me started.
If you want a well made car that can be had for a pretty good price slightly used, look into SAAB. Most people don't think about them for some reason. I was going to buy one, but we're trying to start a family and decided an SUV was probably the way to go.
Don't confuse newer SAABs with the 900 and 9000. Those were great to drive, but they weren't the most reliable car out there by any means. The new ones ar great, but they're way too over priced IMO. And I can't get passed that brushed aluminum (or is it chrome?) outlining the headlights. They're asking nearly BMW money for them. 2 or 3 year old 9-3s or 9-5s can go for a great price. Excellent performance, safety, and long term reliability. Its a shame they don't have a bigger presence in the States. I guess they mainly sell in the Northeast and So Cal.
Sorry to steer the thread away Frank. How are those SL-2s breakin' in?
I have a '97 Grand Prix that gives me no problems, other than what I consider normal wear and tear for a 12 year old car. The thing still feels as smooth, nice riding, and powerful as the day we bought it. I've had my eye on the Ford Fusion as a replacement (and God, the 2010 looks gorgeous) but thankfully I don't have the car upgrade bug like I do the audio upgrade bug. I'm happy to keep driving my Grand Prix, and actually it's kind of like my baby. I take great care of it, doing all the necessary maintenance, rust proofing, etc.
So, along with myself and some other people I know who have done well with GM, I don't have a negative opinion of their reliability. Frankly, I think things reached a point not long ago when people simply assumed just because a car was Honda or Toyota it was bulletproof, and because a car was American it was complete garbage. Well, it's not quite that black and white.
The Japanese companies have had their problems too (Honda transmissions, Toyota engine sludge, the Tundra had a bunch of issues), and now the American companies, especially Ford, are starting to get some credit for building good cars. Actually Ford seems to be on quite the roll, great reliability, a product renaissance, notably the Fusion hybrid with significantly better fuel economy than Camry hybrid. They are making significant market share gains. And it's not over yet, the European Fiesta and Focus will be coming over soon, much better small cars than Ford currently has here in North America.
I admit, my bias is obviously towards American cars.
lol You can thank Fords new found success to the Japanese companies like Honda/Toyota and Nissan. They are basically coming to their senses and following their marketing strategy and design that made those three brands take over the market. Finally an intelligent American car company. The last decade they have been the moron's of the car industry. 20 million brands, un-reliable, poor company structure. GM pays people 50 dollars an hour to be an un-educated idiot that sits on a line to sort screws. And they wonder why they are/were on the brink of going bankrupt. Good cars or bad cars, GM is a piss poor company IMO. They deserve to go out of business. Morons. But lets hope this new plan they have works, for our economies sake.
SAAB was sold to a Swedish car company almost immediately after the collapse. As stupid as it sounds, GM could have been the best thing to happen to SAAB. After GM bought them, their ergonomics greatly improved. What was a fun to drive, comfortable, yet quirky car became a fun, comfortable, and very practical car. They retained their individuality, but lost their over the top quirkiness that turned off a lot of potential owners.
If you haven't driven a SAAB, and are considering buying a car, you really should.
"GM pays people 50 dollars an hour to be an un-educated idiot that sits on a line to sort screws."
They all do. And its not their fault, its their union's fault. Don't get me wrong, I'm a union supporter, and most of what we have as employees is because of them. Some unions have way too much power. The UAW is a big part of what bankrupted Detroit. Obviously what they build has at least just as large a part.
The engine sludge problem isn't strictly Toyota, nor VW (read up on their problem with it), its every car. I've read somewhere that the biggest culprit on it is reformulated gas (containing ethanol?). It leaves deposits and alter's oil's molecular make up. Some cars have bigger problems with it than others - cars with smaller oil pans and turbo engines seem to suffer more.
Right Stu, the unions played a large role. There seems to be this sense of entitlement that pervades some unions. We've got a city workers strike in Toronto, as such there is no garbage pickup. The city opened some temporary dump sites and these jerks in the union block people from dumping their garbage. The worst thing? The cops don't arrest them, they just watch.
Anyways, the auto companies can't be held blameless, as they agreed to these deals. But if they didn't they'd have been in a tough place (though not as tough as they find themselves now of course).
As for the whole too many brands thing, of course it's nuts! But it wasn't long ago when GM had half the market. Their number of brands and vast dealership network was fine in that environment - the company was flourishing. They should have recognized the imminent threat to them, but I'm convinced that shutting down brands and dealerships (who have franchise rights) is more costly than most people realize. GM was built in another reality. Maybe if we had harsh restrictions on other car companies selling in our market, like the Japanese do, GM would still be going strong (please don't take that as an argument for protectionism). As such, bankruptcy was probably a forgone conclusion quite a number of years ago for GM so that they could downsize drastically.
And yes, I recognize the Japanese build good cars and now Ford (not just Ford, GM too) are following that model. But American companies (GM most notably) have produced good cars over these last ten years, they just seem to go unrecognized by all but the auto press (for those who read/watch them). GM had a bunch of solid cars, Chrysler had maybe a couple, and Ford had one or two. There was a period where Ford seemed to ignore cars entirely in favor of truck and SUVs. Also a short-sighted management decision, can't hold them blameless in that. Frankly, the fact that mgmt still earn fat bonuses when a company is losing money is just as bad as union sense of entitlement. It shouldn't be allowed.
This has veered a little off topic so that's really all I plan to say.
Nuck, ditto, no interest yet, and I don't expect a sale in a short time either.
As for the car situation, we took a drive in father-in-law's new Focus and must admit that it was VERY nice indeed. How they can get that quality at such a cheap price is beyond me (well, at the moment while the world's in a crunch, there are amazing deals on). That said, last year's Vauxhall (Opel) Astra, was similarly great to drive and arguably a touch more refined.
As for Saab, well in recent years they were all based on Vauxhall chassis weren't they (along with volvo)?
At least I know I've set up the speakers correctly. they're bouncing beautifully and independently of the tweeter unit, which is as it should be. 
