A big diff with the Mac ma6900 and the Classe pre/power. Fist impressions were simple. The Classe outweighs the Mac by a good bit. After a few hours away to let the Mac get adjusted, here is what I think. Hands down, the Classe pre/power is sounding better than the Mac. More presence, more air, more power in the delivery, more of everything. But still...the 6900 has a lot to offer. The power is simple and bulletproof. The amp is dead quiet, right in line with the Classe setup, with not a tick of sound near wide open and no input, and the floor remains a bottomless pit with music playing, just black quiet. The EQ on the 6900 has been flat so far, and I saw no need to make adjustments, even given the temptation and the room limitations that still exist.
Diana Krall...the Look of Love is currently playing. Her Sss's have no sibilance, as much as I wish for just the finishing bit that I get from the Classe, but no harm done here. A bit of John Mellencamp's Uh Huh shows the drive and stage that the Mac can do, and do very well. The stage is set wide and focused, if not so very deep, very satisfying in breadth of verse. Leading edge vocals are very distinct, every past cigarette is measured in the vocal clarity indeed. But no more thn the Classe setup, again. I have to listen more, and acclimitize myself with the new amp to be sure, but truly, I think I have traded convenience for the better setup. Should anyone have questions about a Classe setup, I will be happy to oblige, having had a few now. When spending money in this price range, never ever count out a Classe setup.
using the 8 ohm at the moment, tried the 4 at first, not a ton of difference, as the amp is a very powerful one. In judging from the Mac meters (which are, without need to mention, very cool) and the typical musical response, the Classe is about double the dynamic power at nearly every point, just more dynamic.response and attack.
However, here is the hard part.
The Mac has so much more grip on the drivers that I am shocked. I would have thought that I was giving up grip for melody and rhythm, but that is not the case at all. The drivers simply do not move a lot to do their thing. This may seem simplistic, but that is the result, and manually adjusting the volume brings me in close adhereance to the speaker, so I do watch. The bass drivers are much more controllen in their motoring. In bass response, the beauty of the amp is simple to use. I turn down the bass at the knee of 30Hz. I know, I know, I always wonder why tonals are needed, and kinda steer people away from them in general, so I have a slice of humble pie coming.The amp is just perfectly suited to max spl from the speakers at -3db at 30Hz, at room SPL of maybe 108db and steady 50 on the meters. The power guard has not lit at all.
Tomorrow I will have the Psb's out to prove the Classe set for a buyer, so i will try the Mac on them as well.
The included remote serves its purpose as a labour saving device, however is possibly the most embarrasing piece of equipment in recent Mac memory. It is a flat slab of sufficient girth to require 2 female hands to secure and operate and is uninspiring to both view and operate. it will apparantly control a lot of Mac stuff that I will have to save up for, while sporting an uncomfortable grip for any left hander without lead-pianist digital dexterity to operate. The unit is weighted to avoid being swept up with the other surfboard looking remotes of lesser ilk, but wihout the billet-cold feel of a Classe remote. In this Class, I would expect a volume fob as well as the full remote, but thats just me maybe.
The Mac also adds a great deal of 'curb appeal'. When the windows are open and the tunes are on, the music is clearly head and shoulders aove anybdy elses, by a huge marin. The music sounds almost as good outside as in, and people do take notice.
I suspect you got more than convenience with the MA-6900. I am not even entering into a disagreement or argument about the Classe being the better set up. It is what you had and loved for quite some time.
Classe that I heard (w/ B&W floorstanders) had a sterility to it that I just did not find musical. For me it lacked that swing. IMO MAC has that swing in the right set up.
There are always tradeoffs. I thought I was only auditioning my 240s before I flipped them. They were so fluid that I could not part with them. There are things that my much higher output solid state MAC had that I missed at first. After adding some ASC tube traps I now get so much from the 240s that I no longer miss anything about the amp they replaced but thoroughly enjoy everything they have that the solid state was just short on. No I will not get the volumes I could have before but I am loud enough with the 240s so its all good.
I am sure stryvn had some trade offs from his Rotel to his MAC but no doubt the pluses outweigh the minuses on his end.
I suspect whomever picks up your Classe gear will also find that the pluses outweigh the minuses.
Let us know when you discover some of the other pluses of the 6900 and whatever other minuses besides the remote.
Nuck you sound like someone who doesn't use their cell phone to text very often. LOL
I agree with Mike relative to the Classe gear and you already know that Nuck. However much as you don't listen with my ears neither do I with yours and so if you like the Classe better don't let any kind of pressure push you up off of it. I do believe that with time you'll come to appreciate the musicality of the Mac vs the brute strength of your Classe but that's not a given...there are plenty of folks who don't like Mac.
A ton of folk who don't like Mac and a ton of people who live and die by Classe. I have only hear Classe, and thought it was fantastic. Never heard Mac. There is a huge MAC following on this site, but use your ears Nuck. You got to live with it boss.
The guy coming today knows what he wants all right. He just doesnt know that he wants the preamp and cables as well, LOL!
Just a bit of audio confusion on my part, I suppose. I didn't get what I expected right out of the box, and this without doing anything in the room or placing speakers too much. Back to the setup basics, follow the advise that we send out to others. I have a few funky ideas for the room, both appearance and sound wise that I will look into toay.
Just my two cents worth (or less) Nuck, but I've found initial impressions more dangerous than valuable sometimes. The ear (and more importantly, the attached brain) will tune into differences (gains and loses) right away and you'll get that quick impression of better or worse. My experience is that this all shakes out over time to a more "true" sense of better or worse.
I'm undoubtedly telling you sh!t you already know, but take your time with the decision. Do some longer term listening (and play with the setup) and then flip back to our old gear. You'll know.
Thanks CH. In fact, I made a more rational selection of music this morning, some stuff that I really know and love.
Boston...master vinyl Al Stewart...year of the cat...vinyl
After todays demo, I am going to plug the VPI into the Mac phono. There is a switch for high level input, but my guess is that the Dyn 10X5 is gonna be high enough for the superior mm stage in the Mac.
Did a dvd in the bdp last night, The Incredibles. The performance was nothing short of stunning!!! I had to turn on the lights and check the speakers at the first big bass hit, for fear of damage, it was just so deep and powerful that I thought I must be into baaaad territory. The amp was at 11 00, nothing big, and the drivers were just moving a bit. So I turned it up. At 20-50 on the meters of the Mac, you could hardly sit in the room. The bass could only be replicated with a very very fast and powerful sub. It flattened my date to the chair..Oh wait, that was me. Just tremendous, and I do not recall the Classe doing that nearly so well. I pulled the speakers out an closer to center to get a phanton center, and it worked very well wthout really tryin, and looking like a neurotic weeniee.
I like it, and I will be better off when I get the room settled down and stop fidling with the EQ.
FWIW I am in audio nirvana thanks to my dealer and stryvn.
I have ACS bass traps 9, 11, & 16 inchers on demo at home with the remastered "The Song Remains The Same" on the Linn, courtesy of stryvn's most excellent recommendation.
Now back to the 6900!
Why is it that I am beginning to think that Nuck only bought it for the numerology?
The ca300 amp is gone, for list price. I think the guy thought that he would make a deal, but he brought his wife along(good idea), and his jaw hit the floor. That is a good thing. The guy alreday has a DR5 preamp like mine, but had no idea about balanced connections. Needless to say, they are now fully informed, and th transter was effortless, except the hoisting.
All is well. The couple left with maybe the deal of the month.
I guess I missed this latest acquisition Nuck. Congrats man - damn, just what we need - another Mac owner on this forum. Should call it McCoustics or something.
On the first try too Nuck.LOL. Nice pic though man. Those big blue meters are dazzling.
"Blame it on JV if you want to stir the pot a bit."
Thanks JV.
"Oh, and let's not overlook the Bryston contingency just off to the Northeast a bit mind you."
lol North a bit? hmmmm Texas to Ontario....I can make it on bike in 30 minutes. lol.
Zeppelin rule. Mr. Wodek if your looking for something new right up your alley, take a look at the new album by HURT. Its called " Goodbye To The Machine". Download the song "Wars". Its awesome. I think you will like. Thought I would throw it out there while I had your attention. ;)
The Mac has so much more grip on the drivers that I am shocked.
That's one thing I noticed too, Nuck, but I moved up from Rotel. The attack is changed but the authority with which the drivers are escorted is stunning.
Well, here is an unfortunate turn of events. Warmed the amp up for about 90 mins while doing laundry, then played one cd, Robert Palmer collection. It was not overley high, nor bass heavy, tonals flat, the meterstouching halfway between 20 and 200, 20 nominal I say. Played one cd and the amp shut down, power guard on both channels and the amp was hot, hotter on the left, and my guess is that it shut down thermally, which is the worst. turned off the speaker output and waited 5 mins, thenturned to standy.
The cables are untouched, and the power guards have never ever lit, which I expected with the Totems.
Uh oh... that's not good Nuck. I had my 6300 peaking around 60 watts steady on the weekend (the hardest I've pushed it since I bought it). Didn't even break a sweat.
Hmmm, then again, looking at the 1st pic you posted, that Classe may have had a hand in this.
I wouldn't particularly like being a starter for a couple of years then being benched, not only benched but having my replacement sitting right on top of me. Just a little bit too much in the face of the Classe for you not to consider that it may have had something to do with the distress the MAC is suddenly experiencing.
That's why I keep my benched parts on the other side of the room or release them outright.
Only guarantee from seller was bring it here and see it working. I have run it hard and longer just fine. Hmmm...
The lights work on startup, and on activation of protection apparantly of course, so I don't think the circuit is in play at any time during use, just not enough load.
I have been playing the tunes for close to 2 hrs, 4 ohm taps, and pretty loud. Noissues, other than the amp is running a little hotter than I guess it should. The electronics cover is only 6 screws to view, I will have a peek.
Figgur this... played Clapton's 24 nights cd (If you like Clapton, get this)!!! a wonderfully balanced recording. I played it flat and very loud and the guard lights showed up. The amp is not 'hot' and the meters touched near the top, but not the abyss. All systems normal.
I need new speaker runs sooooo bad. I only touched one cable...
How loud you playing things Nuck? I have to turn mine up insanely loud to get the meters to come even close to peaking. Is it maybe the Mani's are hard to drive? 4 ohm/85 db... that's a lot of speaker to handle.
David, it was a test this time, and it was plenty loud, and the best recording possible on cd, as far as I have heard. Guys, just buy it. I never listen at anything over 20w for more than one song. The meter is fine at 2w, touching 20.
David, the amp won't care if it is shorted, neither will yours. The Mac does it differently, but both are safe.
The cables are shite, which I knew, but the new ones didn't show up yet...don't ask...and I have to move the amp to use the short spares that I have. I am gonna pull some ripcord and reterm the wire, have to make a jumper as well. Another 21c investment.
Never did see the new runs that I ordered. I have some spares kicking around, but gonna find some 14g spool runs and bi-wire or jumper to ease my mind. Ripping it apart today to cut down the stand anyhow, so get that out of my mind. Might order some Bluejeans stuff, just cause.
I finally got around to moving gear here and there, placed the VPI on a side table9vastly lowering flutter), and plugged the table directly into the Mac's mm phono input. The very high output of the Dynavector 10X5 lets me play directly, so a little Roy Orbison is in order.
The Mac phono section is more than capable, but plays differently than the tube Jolida, of course. The Jolida, with a single EH 12AX7 tube sported more gain, to be sure, but added(or subtracted) from the music in a sweet smokey way, which was very nice and comforting. The Mac's phono is more direct, it seems to me. A little more action, less politic to smooth me over...
I will have to listen for the weekend on a bunch of stuff, but I think I will have one less piece to find a home for on my new stand.
That's interesting Nuck. It's very rare that we hear McIntosh anything described as direct. I guess the Jolida tube adds a lot of warmth. I've been interested in the Jolida integrateds for awhile now but I've always been wary of their build quality.
I can't speak to the whole lineup, David, but the tube pre has been moved many times. It always works, never makes a sound other than music, and very connective and adaptable.
It will find a new home if the Mac wins the weekend.
CM, I have swapped the Mac MX112 preamp in with the 6900 as amp, mixed in with Stryvn's QOD thread. I am home tomorrow for a bit, I am going to use the 6900 to pre the Mac 2505 tamp this weekend.
Heres a pic from my work this week in North Newfoundland.
I have dozens more pics, I will crop and fix and post somewhere, maybe a photobucket link. I am gonna start carrying the camera around...15 years too late.
Using the 6900 to run both the Mac units is a bonus, with one known factor involved each time. I will also run the oldies together and see how that sounds, but the Mani-2's are a pretty tough load.
I was in Winterpeg one time in January for a business trip. It was the coldest I've ever been in my life... and I live in the second coldest capital city in the world.
Well, the problem persists. The 6900 shut down on heat after 7 songs today. Taps are 4 ohm, power guard lights are not lighting, but are tempted.
So I sent an email to Mac, 4 45 on a Friday. Answer in 3 mins!!! The fellow there said 4 ohm taps are needed, and sent along a response graph for the Mani-2's!
But I can't seem to copy it from email...lemme try again.
