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New member Username: Quentin2Post Number: 1 Registered: Jan-09 | Hello everyone, I've recently been looking into purchasing a record player, specifically a used Bang & Olufsen RX-2 however know very litle on the basics of setting it up. What I've gathered is I'll need an amplifier with phono inputs. So looking around I've heard old marantz receiver which seem to go for 100+ on ebay seem like a good option. However do all old receiver contain amplifier, and are their any other good inexpensive options. Finally looking at speakers specifically http://www.amazon.com/Boston-Acoustics-HS50-Midnight-Speakers/dp/B000W9DO5C how would I go about connecting speakers? Do they input to the aux connection on the receiver. Sorry for the long post and thanks for any help as I am obviously lost trying to get started. |
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Gold Member Username: Mike3Wylie, Tx USA Post Number: 1709 Registered: May-06 | Charles, Perhaps you should spend a little time educating yourself before you start spending money. A turntable requires either a phone stage to an intergrated amplifier, pre-amplifier, or amplifier, unless they have a phono input. However most units phono inputs are only useful for Moving Magnet cartridges, not so much for Moving Coil cartridges. Please go look up both of those so you may understand my point. If you need to learn more find a dealer, and by that I do not mean Best Buy, Future Shop, or Circuit City. Someplace that specializes in higher end audio and home theater. Let them know you are trying to learn, what you can afford, and ask them questions. They may have something new in your price range, or used, demo, or consignment gear for you to audition. Best to go on a week day afternoon. I know nothing of your experience or background with music so I would advise you to educate yourself on music by going to listen to live performances of the type of music you like. Whatever you buy should play music with a sound that resembles the live music you have heard. P.S. If there are no dealers available a better place to shop online would be Audiogon.com . |
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New member Username: Quentin2Post Number: 2 Registered: Jan-09 | Well from what I've learned a moving coil outputs a lower signal therefore requiring a higher boost, however since eventually I hope to purchase a bang & olufsen turntable they have their own developed their own patented moving micro cross cartridges. By looking around online I've haven't been able to figure whether the signal from these types of cartridges would be suitable to connect to a receiver/amplifier with phono inputs or the signal would need another source of pre-amplification. |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 13263 Registered: May-04 | . I hate to stomp on your heart but I would very strongly urge you to forget the B&O table. They are a design that never stood up to their similarly priced competition when they were new, especially the pivoted arm types such as the RX2. B&O stopped producing tables in the mid '80's and B&O does not support their older products with service or parts. The RX2 was a mediocre table with a far from great tonearm that accepts only B&O cartridges, which are not being manufactured today. So no new cartridges and no parts and service, that would stop me from buying anything unless you just like having Danish designed paper weights laying around your house. Did I mention the table didn't sound very good? Spend your money on a real table that has been designed and updated to 21st century specs. Buy a new phono cartridge that will easily surpass what B&O produced two decades ago. Enjoy a product that doesn't require extreme set up conditions to achieve mediocre sound quality. (Just so you know, I sold B&O products for a dozen years and this was the opinion of their tables when they were new and that opinion has only proven more correct in the last twenty years.) Look at the Rega tables or a similarly designed table. Buy a moving magnet cartridge, some of which will be labelled a "moving iron" cartridge. You'll need a a phono pre amp in whatever electronics you choose, not just an input labelled "phono". I would again say forget the vintage Marantz for many of the same reasons I gave for the B&O. Marantz was not a great product by the time they _ actually Superscope who had purchased the name - were selling receivers. Parts are pretty much non-existent right down to those nice blue dial lights. And, if you truly don't have a clue what you are doing but want good sound quality rather than just some looks, don't start picking stuff off of a pre owned site. Go to a dealer and spend a few more dollars for what will amount to a better system for less money spent down the road. . |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 11378 Registered: Dec-04 | I waited for JV before I said the exact same thing, except the selling part. |
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Silver Member Username: SoundgameRichmond Hill Toronto ..., Ontario Canada Post Number: 512 Registered: Jun-08 | A good starter table would be: Goldring GR1.2 (which comes with a mounted MM cartridge) Rega Plannar2 or P2 Project Debut III Music Hall 2.2 To start, match that to a decent pre-amplifier with a phono input or an AVR with a phone input. Stay with a moving magnet (MM) cartridge for now. You can always add a dedicated phono stage latter. it's better to take small steps towards the vinyl hobby to see if you really like it. If you do, then there is lot's to explore and spend if your heart and ears desire. Cheers and all the best with it! |
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New member Username: Quentin2Post Number: 3 Registered: Jan-09 | Thank you all for your comments as they have all been really helpful. I also agree about the B&0 as when researching I see that the cartridges are hard to come by and the new ones which were obviously snagged before manufacturing ceased are upwards of 400+ on some websites. Also, I realize I need a pre-amp not just a receiver with a phono input, however don't most older receiver with phono inputs already integrate pre-amps? I realize for a beginner it seems wiser to purchase a new receiver which I would probably need a separate pre-amp. |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 11381 Registered: Dec-04 | A Nad phono stage is cheap and works pretty well for starters, if we get away from receivers with cheap phono stages. Cambridge offers 2 as well... |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 13264 Registered: May-04 | . I don't normally recommend NAD products but in this case I would strongly suggest you go audition a basic NAD integrated amplifier for a few hundred dollars. Forget the vintage stuff if you don't know what was good and what wasn't. . |
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New member Username: Quentin2Post Number: 4 Registered: Jan-09 | Going with new gear seems wiser, however just to clarify looking at some older recievers or amplifiers with phono inputs alot seem to have both amps as well as preamps. Newer models only have aux inputs. So if I would use an older amp with both an amp/pre-amp and phono input I would be able to connect strait from the turntable to the amp right? |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 13267 Registered: May-04 | . You will be able to, as in, "Mother, may I ... ?" But you won't want to, as in, "Put that down before you put someone's eye out!" . |
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New member Username: Quentin2Post Number: 5 Registered: Jan-09 | I'm sorry I don't exactly follow, are you saying its will work but integrating an amp and pre-amp in one unit will produce a low quality pre-amp or vice-versa? |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 11390 Registered: Dec-04 | Charles, a stand alone phono preamp will be better than most receivers, then the table/preamp will play on anything that you want. |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 13268 Registered: May-04 | . "So if I would use an older amp with both an amp/pre-amp and phono input I would be able to connect strait from the turntable to the amp right?" Your questions reads as if you wish to plug the phono output directly into the power "amp" inputs. That won't work. You need a pre amp. The downside to an outboard phono section is an extra set of cables. The up side is you get something designed in the 21st c/ to do its job as well as possible for the price range. You can also upgrade an outboard unit without scrapping your other electronics. For the most part the phoho sections available today have far surpassed the performance of similarly priced products from two decades ago. If you were looking at true vintage gear, I would have a different opinion. But my opinion of most "vintage" receivers is they should be left for those who like the smell of solder in the morning. You continue to speak of vintage electronics; 1) as if they are all the same and only the faceplate changes and 2) as if you know the quality of each piece you might consider. Since neither is true I would still suggest you go out and listen to some new equipment and not waste your money on "vintage" that isn't really vintage worth owning. Or try another forum. There are a few forums where anything old is considered to be better than anything new. The guys who populate those forums will tell you it doesn't get much better than a Pioneer SX636 receiver. They will guide your selection of a "vintage" system that will sound, IMO, quite mediocre. They will even sell it to you and they will offer to repair it when it breaks. To them old is terrific because, like a '57 Chevy, they understand it. Don't get me wrong, I love true vintage gear, pieces that are recognized classics and stll produce music after forty or fifty years of service. I use a few pieces like that myself. But the true vintage pieces are few and far between and they command high prices. The rest are novelty items that are similar to owning a 1972 Dodge Dart. More trouble than its worth when it breaks and not all that interesting the rest of the time. Not all vintage products had decent phono sections, or pre amp sections or tuners or power amplifiers. Most of the receivers were more intersted in the wattage races, the highest number of switches and geegaws on the front panel and the lowest THD spec and the money went to those things rather than the quality of the product. Most of the phono sections in vintage receivers are ic (integrated circuit) based which tend to sound nasty and not at all interesting. Tolerances on passive pieces in these receivers are typically much broader than anything you'll find in the least expensive products from a "new" high end company such as NAD or Rotel. Most of the power supplies in vintage receivers are not very good. Many of the important parts that make the receiver work are no longer available if the equipment stops working. The number of people who service this sort of vintage component are fewer and farther between that are the decent pieces of vintage gear. If you truly want a vintage system, find someone who will take the time to provide their opinions of the equipment you choose. I have very little to say about receivers from the 1970's and even less to say about receivers from the '80's. IMO, you will do much better as far as sound and service with a new product than you will buying "vintage" when you don't know what you're buying. . |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 13269 Registered: May-04 | . "Or try another forum." Don't take this as me running you off this forum. You are more than welcome to stay. However, there are forums with members who share a deeper "appreciation" for "vintage" gear than those on this forum. If you are committed to a vintage system over the advice given here, you would do better on such a forum as they will have plenty to say in disagreement to my opinion of their favorite gear. However, IMO, the world of electronics did not stop with the release of the Pioneer SX636. . . |
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New member Username: Quentin2Post Number: 9 Registered: Jan-09 | Thank you all for your advice so far it has been more than helpful. I've been looking at some new amplifiers, and hoping to get your input on them. The first one is a marantz PM5003 http://us.marantz.com/Products/2564.asp# has a phono input which would save me from buying a pre-amp, however hearing by some that marantz has suffered in quality after being purchased by phillips would this be a good choice? Another option was the NAD C325BEE http://nadelectronics.com/products/hifi-amplifiers/C325BEE-Stereo-Integrated-Amp lifier. Both amps would come in the upper end of my budget. Are these good options, and any other good options for a budget of around $150-400? Thanks, Charles. |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 11408 Registered: Dec-04 | Charles, unless you are in need/want of a new integrated amp, I would still look at standalone phono preamps. |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 13274 Registered: May-04 | . Marantz long ago passed from ownership by Philips. Go listen, at this point I would favor the NAD. |