Hello, Actually I have two questions. How hard can two 6.5 woofers really hit? I am used to having 10 inch woofers so I wonder if I will be satisfied with the bass response of 6.5 cones? The ones I am looking at have a freq.response of 35hz so I know they CAN go low, but will it sound full and deep like 10's? My other question is, how good are glass fiber woofers? I never heard a cone with that material before. Any comments appreciated, thank you. Max
G-Man
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Look at the output in SPL's at 35Hz and the distortion at 90db's or so. If they can play at 85 or 90 db's at 35 Hz with under 3% distortion then you will probably be happy. But if they hot 8-10% distortion you won't be happy.
The size of the woofer is just one of the many parameters that effect deep and clean output. There are plenty of 6.5" woofers with cleaner output than 8" and 10" counterparts. But they generally have far superior magnetry and much better design and very-well matched power supplies.
There are lots of manufacturers of flabby 10" and 12" subwoofers that sound awful. They slap in a big speaker and any old powerful amplifier and sell it according to those reasons.
Only way to really assess a subwoofer is the method I said above. % distortion at least 85 db's and at 30 Hz is a good example of a test. You can try this a various Hz's and high outputs and see how well the distortions hold up.
Now, if you are talking about 6.5" woofers in full-range speakers without self-powered woofers that is a different issue. I would call the manufacturer and see if they have done the tests I mentioned above. Tell them you are interested in a 90 db output at 35 Hz and you want to know the distortion at that level. You can ask them to do this at 30 Hz and at 50Hz. This will give you a good idea of the low-end speaker performance and tell you whether you need to buy a self-powered PSB, HSU, etc. subwoofer.
G.DawG
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6.5's CAN deffinitly thump. I have Pro-Linear towers with dual 6.5s and they rock. Are you talking about a subwoofer or full range tower or bookshelfs? The only way to tell if they thump is A:listen to G-Man or B: Listen to them at home, that woukld be the absolutley only way to really hear is they do as room size speaker place ment and room acoustics all affect bass output.Also the amp would play a huge role in the sound output too.
Max
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Hey, Ok thanks guys! Oh they are 3-way tower speakers with a 3inch tuning port in the front. I will e-mail Dcm and ask them about the distortion level. My old 10's were Dcm's too and they were pretty nice, real tight smooth clean bass, but I know what you mean about lower end 10's and 12's that just sound like gargled booms. Oh yea and they will be powered by the H/K 525. Thanks again and more response's are very welcome!
G-Man
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DCM has usually made fine speakers. Of course, that doesn't mean they all play well in the bass area, but what they can play they usually do a good job on.
To realt great bass it is almost always necessary to have a good subwoofer. But that is something you can always add at another time. Many people can still enjoy their set-up without them--particularly for music. For jet engines in Top Gun or stuff like like you can't expect to get the deep rattling tones out of most three-way speakers and this is mostly due to two things: 1) the speaker really isn't designed to do that and 2) it is difficult to expect the receiver to have sufficient power to drive the woofer adequately without high distortion, particularly in most medium to small sized tower speakers (which goes triple for bookshelf speakers).
But as I said--you can always get a separate self-powered subwoofer at another time if you want that extra low octave with punch.
Max
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Hey, Ok yeah that would work! I guess I never really thought of that which is dumb of me because even with my old 10's I needed a subwoofer to get the giant bass. I have heard smaller cones like 8's are better for Pwrd subs because they move faster and arent as sloppy as a big woofer? any truth to this? Ok talk to ya later and thanks again, Max
G-Man
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There are a number of good quality 10" to 15" self-powered subwoofers. A couple of 8" ones too. Companies such as HSU, SVS, PSB, and some Velodynes (to name a few) make excellent ones at their price points. But there are a lot of companies that make mediocre and worse ones at this size too.
It isn't the speed of the subwoofer--it is the size of the magnet, the mating of the amp to the woofer,the resonance of the cabinet, and the "damping" and/or recovery of the speaker during its long throw excursion that determines how sloppy it sounds or how precise it sounds.
Speed is really a false description spred by many tweako magazines. If a subwoofer were actually fast--it would be a midrange speaker. They probably mean that a subwoofer which sounds poorly damped and sloppy sounds as if it were slow--and one that sounds well-damped and accurate sounds fast. But that is a poor description of what is really occuring. Much better to say poorly damped, high distortion at medium to high decibels, variable SPL's at different Hz when played at the same volume, etc.
Probably the best $350 unit is the PSB subsonic 5. The HSU VTF-2 at $499 has only a couple of betters at up to $1,000. The HSU VTF-3 at $849 is wonderful. There are a few SVS subwoofers that are just as good if you can tolerate their intrusive appearance (they are very tall).
But it is difficult to get "true" subwoofer performance at under $300. They either don't go low enough or they play with high distortion at low frequencies.
Max
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Hey, wow very informative, thanks a million. How the heck do you know all this? Ok weel I will take advantage of your knowledge and throw a few more questions at you. Ok first question, which is better, foam or rubber surround? also what is a large excursion vented pole piece woofer? and lastly what is a pole mounted phase plug? sorry for so many questions but you seem to have the answers so I figured I would ask. Thank you so much for your time and knowledge, Max
G.DawG
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Rubber is definelty better. It lasts twice as long(under the same conditions)The large excursion part means the amount the subwoofer can move which is good because it limits bottoming(the Polk 303 has a massive amount of excursion).Ask G-Man the rest that is the end of my knowledge in subs, and I dont want to give you false answers.
Max
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Hey, Ok thanks again for the useful info. I really appreciate it! Max
Max
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Hey, So the hsu vtf-2 is a good one? I checked their site and it looks like a great sub. I will probably just get that, its seems like a good bang for the buck!! Thank you very much for the info on HSU, I would have probably bought some damn cheapo sub with "1000"wtts or some other crazy gimmick. Thanks again, Max
G-Man
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You are welcome Max--and you are getting a wonderful subwoofer at its price. Heck, it is excellent even if it were to cost considerably more.
Max
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Hey, Yeah I am very excited now!! Thank you so much, Max