Voice perfection from receiver
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New member Username: MartiniPost Number: 8 Registered: May-04 | I just bought a Yamaha RX-V2400 receiver to go with my Polk speakers. I did the auto setup for the receiver and I'm not very happy with the sound of people's voices in movies. Can someone help me? Should I change the type of surround sound or should I change something else? Please help |
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Silver Member Username: Elitefan1Post Number: 440 Registered: Dec-03 | Marty, If it's not to late I would return the 2400 and get something that matches the Polk's better. The 2400 is not as bright as past Yamaha's but is too thin sounding to work well with any Polk speaker I have heard. I have always liked Polk's but they need a warmer receiver to sound their best like H/K, Elite or Marantz. The 2400 is an improvement but matches best with Paradigm or PSB. |
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J. Vigne Unregistered guest | Marty, why don't you tell us what you're not happy with about voices? Just saying you're not happy doesn't give us much of a clue as to what you think is wrong. |
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New member Username: MartiniPost Number: 9 Registered: May-04 | Well I'm not going to return my Yamaha receiver. Its one of the best on the market and that's not the problem. I just need some help on fine tuning my receiver to make movies/tv sound the best. I just didn't like how when I listened to some movies the music in the back 2 speakers would drown out the actors voices. Maybe I should try turning up the center speaker volume. |
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New member Username: MartiniPost Number: 10 Registered: May-04 | And what do you mean by not as bright and warmer? I think that is just something that can be perfected with some fine tuning. Plus I can tell that you prefer Elite from your profile name. I just heard and read reviews online and from the sound guys working at Tweeter that Yamaha and Denon and HK are the best |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 265 Registered: Feb-04 | ...and they probably also sell those and get the commission for themselves. The Yam has nice features and the new 1400/2400 are a step up in sound quality over the previous ones, but I think they still cant match with similar priced Marantz or P-Elite receivers or even with the smallest NAD in terms of sound quality. But oh well, it should still be good enough for most situations. By the way did do properly do the YPAO calibration. It should do everyhting for you. If you're not satisfied after that there's not much you can do to make it better. I strongly feel that mainly your problem is with your center speaker. What is it? how did you place it? |
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Unregistered guest | Marty, You own a terrific A/V reciever that may be complicated to set-up and calibrate; I haven't played with it's features - wish I could help. Perhaps, the attached link would help out: http://www.audioholics.com/productreviews/avhardware/YamahaRXV-2400Receiver-p1.h tml |
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Silver Member Username: JohnnyMissouri Post Number: 343 Registered: Dec-03 | Marty, I am not going to sit here and tell you that you should return your receiver. You bought it, so obviously you like it. However, elitefan is correct when he mentions that Yamaha and Polk typically don't make a good combination. Whether you have personally heard it or not, all A/V receivers have very definate and unique tonal qualities. Some sound warmer and more mellow while others sound brighter place a greater emphasis on the higher registers. Speakers are the same way. Therefore, when purchasing a receiver/speaker combination, it is important to get the right combination. If you pair a bright receiver with bright speakers (which you have done), the sound will likely sound shrill and overly bright. On the flip side, if you pair a warm receiver with warm speakers, the sound will likely sound muddled and lifeless. Receivers and speakers should be matched as to bring the sound closer to "neutral". I have spent hours upon hours listening to MANY different receiver/speaker combinations...trust me, these tonal charachteristcs are there. It is true that SOME of this MAY be tamed by adjusting settings on the receiver...but in the end...the receiver will still retain its overall tonal qualities. If you are happy with the overall sound of your current setup, then maybe some tweaking will help. Obviously, you are not happy with the way things sound now. What will you do if you still aren't happy after the tweaking is done? Elitefan's receiver/speaker recommendations are right on. Maybe you don't like his suggestion of returning your equipment...but if you remain unhappy with your current setup...keep his suggestions in mind. As for which receiver brands are "the best" in this price range...it is impossible to make any claims in this area. Yamaha, Denon, and HK are certainly good...but they are not the only good ones out there. You are forgetting some very respected brands. Any salesman that tells you that "Brand X" is the best undoubtedly has some hidden motives. It is just simply impossible to make such claims. I think if you look at what brands Tweeter sells, I would venture to guess that they sell all three brands they said were "the best". |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 11 Registered: May-04 | Well its stupid for me to just return this receiver and buy a new one. I'm VERY happy with how it sounds and its producing a great sound on my movie collection. I just want the actors voices to be higher. I have the center speaker placed on top of my TV so maybe it needs to be directed more downward. I just have whatever center speaker they sent me with the RM6700s. I see what your saying with warn and bright, but I guess I just can't tell the difference. As for the guy at Tweeter, yea I agree that they will sell anything that they have and what they got is always the best. Obviously. But they also had Denon's and HKs and Sonys and this particular guy was telling me why and showed me why those weren't as good as all 3 Yamaha's. |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 12 Registered: May-04 | I'll try tonight by playing a loud movie such as Jurrassic Park and see if the actors voices keep getting drowned out by the back speakers playing the music. I'll turn up the center speaker volume to try and correct this. I still don't think having a different receiver will change this and I really have no way of knowing unless I buy a new receiver and hook it up again. Which I reallllly wanna do. Maybe the music seems too loud cause the back speakers are right behind my couch and the tv speakers are about 7 feet away. I did use the YPAO and it seemed to do everything so easily. I love it. This is just me being VERY picky, cause I've played a few movies on this system and I LOVE IT. I've played Star Wars, Tombstone, Sopranos, Aliens, Jurassic Park and some tv shows. One more thing, I don't know if this is a problem or not but on the receiver is shows only the left (L) and right(R) lights lite up. But I can definately hear stuff out of all the speakers. Only time the other lights show is when I use the YPAO thing. Anyone have this receiver notice it? |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 270 Registered: Feb-04 | "I just have whatever center speaker they sent me with the RM6700s." Is this your speaker system: http://www.polkaudio.com/home/products.php?category=1&speaker=317 ? If it is I'm not at all surprised that you cant identify speech very well. For that money you could have had better speakers. I dont see the point in investing a fortune on a receiver and then getting crappy speakers with it. Just my opinion, no offence. |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 13 Registered: May-04 | Yep thats the system I got. Those ARE NOT crappy speakers. Show me what you would consider to be good. And don't say Bose cause those aren't good at all. Plus I wanted satelite speakers and these are the best for those |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 271 Registered: Feb-04 | Bose is even worse. What do you mean by satellite? small? |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 16 Registered: May-04 | Yea, look at the link that you sent me. Those are satellite speakers. Tiny ones that barely can be seen and placed on a nice stand. I got a good subwoofer cause I know the tiny speakers can't produce alot of bass |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 272 Registered: Feb-04 | Small speakers cant deliver great sound no matter what. There's also no point coupling them with an expensive and powerful receiver wich will be using just a tiny portion of it's capabilities. The result would have been very similar with a $400-500 receiver than with the double price Yam. If you really must have tiny speakers I would probably have gotten a little cheaper receiver (the 1400 or 650 if you like Yam) and the Elac Cinema 3 ESP speakersystem. If you could fit a little bigger boxes I would have taken a different approach with 5-7 identical magnetically shielded bookshelf speakers like the Tannoy Fusion 1 and some nice sub to go with them like Velodyne, SVS or HSU. |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 17 Registered: May-04 | Yea I was initially looking at the 650 or the 1400 for a Yamaha Receiver. But I am also thinking about the future and I don't want to have to upgrade everything when that time comes. I didn't go with the 1400 because it was only 6.1 and the 650 didn't have as many inputs, options or THX. Plus money aint a thang, so I didn't mind dropping a few extra hundred for a better receiver. And from what I have heard, the small speakers do just fine against massive speakers, plus they look better. Now can we all get back on topic here and try to help me out with the problem I'm having with the actors voices being drown by the loud music of a movie. Just seems like I need to have the dB set to about -20 to be happy with the actors voices but when the music plays, its really loud. Or is this how movies are suppose to be? This is my first system, and I'm coming off of a small Aiwa system before |
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Silver Member Username: JohnnyMissouri Post Number: 346 Registered: Dec-03 | This may be really elementary here, but can't you just adjust the different channels? I know you said you used the YPAO, and I don't know much about the features of Yamaha receivers, but can't you just turn up the db of the center speaker and turn down the db of the rear speakers? Or are you locked in to what the YPAO sets? I had an older version of this Polk system, and I must say, for the size, they do a good job. However, I think you would see a pretty big difference if you tried some bigger speakers. I mean, it just isn't physically possible for a small speaker such as that to produce the same amount of sound as a bigger speaker. For that type of money, you could have gotten a nice PSB or Paradigm system that in my opinion would have sounded MUCH better than those Polk's...especially with Yamaha. With those Polk speakers you aren't coming close to getting all of what the Yamaha can offer. What speakers did you listen to when you auditioned that receiver? |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 18 Registered: May-04 | Well I can adjust the db of each speaker, I just haven't tried yet. I'm not locked in with the YPAO but I figured I'd give that a shot at first. Remember, I don't know very much about speaker settings and such. As for the speakers they guy at Tweeter tested, I can't remember the name but it was a 5.1 system that cost about $4000-5000. it was INSANE. Almost too loud to be played without getting a noice violation. Yea I guess I could have gotten bigger ones for the same price, but its all about size. From my ears, I think the satellites produce the same sound and are just as good. Yea maybe the bigger ones will be better, but for the size that they are it isnt worth it |
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Silver Member Username: JohnnyMissouri Post Number: 348 Registered: Dec-03 | I would try adjusting the speaker levels and see what happens. It seems like it should be an easy way to solve your problem. Those automatic setup features (like the YPAO) can't take into account personal listening preferences...so don't be afraid to change the levels yourself to cater to your own likings. |
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Anonymous | "Well I'm not going to return my Yamaha receiver. Its one of the best on the market and that's not the problem." "I just heard and read reviews online and from the sound guys working at Tweeter that Yamaha and Denon and HK are the best." "Those ARE NOT crappy speakers. Show me what you would consider to be good." "And from what I have heard, the small speakers do just fine against massive speakers, plus they look better." Pretty full of yourself aren't you? Try be a bit more humble and maybe you'll learn a tad bit from the nice folks who've gone out of their way to try help you out.  |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 273 Registered: Feb-04 | The worst thing about YPAO on 1400(wich BTW is also 7.1)/2400 compared to Pioneers MCACC is that you cant change the settings it sets, only choice is manual or YPAO. I think this applies also to new Denons. With MCACC you can store a couple different autocalibrated settings and modify them as you like. One thing you could try is to place the YPAO microphone differently (closer to surrounds) and see if it helps. I dont get this size is a problem thing. Those little Polks on stands take up as much space as almost any other ordinary bookshelf speaker on a stand. Placing a bigger center channel shouldn't be a problem either. As for surrounds you can continue to use small speakers because they're not so crucial about the overall soundstage and speech. |
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Bronze Member Username: Bobby29Post Number: 21 Registered: Apr-04 | "The worst thing about YPAO on 1400(wich BTW is also 7.1)/2400 compared to Pioneers MCACC is that you cant change the settings it sets, only choice is manual or YPAO. I think this applies also to new Denons" The new Denon 3805 will allow you to manually over ride any or all of the auto-cal/eq settings. (Don't have it yet, but I've been researching the crap out of this receiver.) |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 275 Registered: Feb-04 | Ok, so the Denon is good and I also think the new 650 and 750 allows you to adjust the Y"P"AO settings, but I'm not totally sure about that. |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 19 Registered: May-04 | Yea I'll look into that tonight to see if you can modify the YPAO settings. If not, you can do it the long way by writing down the settings and changing them manually. As for my Polk on the stands, yes they do probably take up as much room. But I have the option of putting them on the wall and they look better. It's sad when your Left, Right and Center speakers look bigger than your tv. But I have the option of using those 2 side speakers for more surrounds and buying BIG front speakers in the future. Then I'll have an amazing 7.1 system. woo haaa Tonight I'm going to try turning up the center speaker to hear actors voices better so they don't get drowned out by the music coming out of the 2 surrounds I have. |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 277 Registered: Feb-04 | Also one thing you could try is to put your center vertically. It would decrease the negative interference on some frequencies caused by the distance difference from the two drivers. It's not a big concern becauce the small size of the speaker, but yet worth a try. |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 20 Registered: May-04 | yea that might look kinda weird too. Well I watched a few movies tonight, but they were from digital cable tv. Almost as good as a DVD. I watched Bourne Identity and Terminator and some of Fear Factor show and some other random movies. It seemed to be perfect. I guess I'm just weird. haha. Now its time to try out some movies. I like doing scenes of great movies. Any suggestions? I have a good amount of DVDs. So I'll let ya know what I got and what I don't got. |
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Bronze Member Username: MartiniPost Number: 23 Registered: May-04 | Any suggestions on good DVDs or scenes to watch that are great for surround sound? Too bad I bought the Simpsons Season 4 on DVD yesterday. Not the best for surround sound |
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Silver Member Username: LandrovalPost Number: 293 Registered: Feb-04 | All the LOTRs, Episode 1 Pod race... |
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Silver Member Username: KeggerMICHIGAN Post Number: 448 Registered: Dec-03 | just my 2 cents but to me most of the automatic settings on recievers get you close then you need to fine tune from their. and i usually have my center channel about 2-3db higher than the rest of my speakers. it does help on dialogue in movies. if after that you are still not happy their should be a test tone that goes around all the speakers from your reciever so you sit in the listening position and play that while adjusting and listening to try and get the same or close amount of sound from each speaker with the center being slightly higher. now most people do this with a meter say from radio shack "pretty cheap" but you can do descent job by ear. now short of that you could try a new center channel maybe something that you would of upgraded to in the future. |
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