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New member Username: OddyoCanada Post Number: 7 Registered: Sep-08 | Hi - I've had my Sttafs for quite a while and I've had a bag of sand, too, but just haven't got 'round to this job. When I bought them I did take my old speakers to the store to make sure I was getting an improvement. Well, the Sttaf were better, but nothing's perfect. One thing I noticed was that there could be a lot of boomy bass on heavy rock albums. I also noticed/ was surprised/ disappointed that the Sttaf are incredibly light, so...I was thinking a loading of sand in the bases should tighten things up a bit. Can anybody comment/ advise on amount, etc? |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 7727 Registered: Feb-05 | The FAQ page at the Totem website advises as to the amount. http://www.totemacoustic.com/us/support/faq/ |
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New member Username: OddyoCanada Post Number: 10 Registered: Sep-08 | Thanks, Art. I will take that as my guide but was hoping for someone's personal experience. In the end, I suppose it will be all about my room, my system, my ears.... |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 7728 Registered: Feb-05 | Believe me Brian if someone does have personal experience with it they will be here to tell ya. Good luck with your project. |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 3000 Registered: May-05 | Brian, I have you tried playing around with speaker and listening chair placement? Its probably the most important thing in this regard. If you have, the mass loading may help. I don't own them, so I can't give personal experiences. |
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Gold Member Username: DmitchellOttawa, Ontario Canada Post Number: 1405 Registered: Feb-07 | Hey Brian, I don't find my Sttafs boomy at all. They are very light, but that's by design - sorta the Totem way of doing things. I've never felt the need to mass load mine. Stu is right - maybe try moving them around a bit. I have mine about 3 feet from the back wall, about 5 1/2 feet apart (it's a small room). How much juice those Adcoms pushing? |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 10754 Registered: Dec-04 | And what kind of volume are you working with? |
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Silver Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 129 Registered: Nov-07 | I had the Sttafs before but I did not find them booming so I did not try the sand. Sorry I can't help you. |
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Bronze Member Username: OddyoCanada Post Number: 11 Registered: Sep-08 | My volumes, aren't particularly high as rule, but once in a while...the Adcoms are giving out 50W each...my room is about 12' x 22' with large entrances on adjacent walls...space and WAF demands the speakers are close to the back wall, about 9' apart... |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 3005 Registered: May-05 | Just for your sake and before you start getting into adding sand, changing components, etc., try pulling them out from against the wall a few feet. This won't be permanent, but it'll determine if its due to placement or not. If the problem is corrected, you could look into some sort of acoustic treatment for behind the speakers. Not something that'll stick out like a sore thumb, but something around the house that'll blend. If pulling them out doesn't correct the problem, you may want to look into a different power amp. The Adcoms are good for the money, but the Sttafs will yeild better results from a better power amp. Not only cleaner power, but better synergy. Or if after you pull the speakers out and they're still boomy, fill 'em with sand. My reservation with filling them with sand before trying things out would be that once the sand is in there, its in there. It seems like it would be a huge pain the the rear end to get it out, not to mention the potential mess from filling them and emptying them may cause. |
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Gold Member Username: DmitchellOttawa, Ontario Canada Post Number: 1419 Registered: Feb-07 | Good advice Stu. It was also my suspicion that the Adcoms are not pushing enough clean power for the the Totems. Even the relatively easy to drive Sttafs like oodles of clean power. |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 10774 Registered: Dec-04 | The Adcom's have more than enough power, and the signal path looks ok for BF. I think it is all placement and room. |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 3006 Registered: May-05 | Adcom makes some good stuff. I'm not sure two 50 watt Adcom amps are really the best case scenario for the Sttafs though. Totems like a stiff and stable power supply. The Sttafs may be asking a little too much from the Adcoms. Keep impedence, phase angle, sensitivity, etc. in mind. They're not an easy load in any way. If my memory serves me correctly, Adcom isn't exactly the cleanest and quietest sounding gear around. Its also not the fastest and tightest sounding gear either. Bass isn't exactly its strong suit. Please don't read that and think I hate Adcom. I rate them on the same level as NAD, Cambridge, and Rotel. Those brands do most things well, especially for the money. But, as with any level, there's always better. Totem speakers like clean, fast and quiet amplification. IMO, pairing up Totem and Adcom is like pairing up Totem and NAD. Pleasant sounding, but not exactly captivating. With lesser speakers, these problems would most likely be hidden. With Totems, a spotlight is being shined on them. But before anything that costs money is contemplated and/or discussed, the free stuff should be tried out first. Only spend money if and when it makes sense - i.e. when all other options are exhausted. |
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Gold Member Username: DmitchellOttawa, Ontario Canada Post Number: 1423 Registered: Feb-07 | Stu said exactly what I was trying to say, but as usual, more eloquently. |
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Bronze Member Username: OddyoCanada Post Number: 12 Registered: Sep-08 | Thanks, Stu - that's good advice. And having read a bit more...I think you are onto something. Only problem is my choices (money) are pretty limited. I think you must be right on because the stuff you're talking abut (NAD, Adcom, Cambridge) are all stuff I have and can afford. Ultimately, I know I can sell off a bunch of my stuff and reach the next level with a component or two, but I'm having a lot of fun with all this stuff, not to mention, I just got married and things need to change. For example, my "A" system has always been in my front room and been what it is - turn on a preamp, two power amps, a tuner if you want it, and my Micromega Stage 3 - not a single word on the fascia to tell you how to use it. Great for me - not so much for anyone else. So, the nest step there (where the Sttafs will stay) is to have a system much more user-friendly but still trying to keep good sound. Not likely some Bryston momnblocks though...think you're right about the bass lack in the Adcoms, but do find them tight, and switching from the Linns to the Totems added the missing bottom end...just need a little more tightness to that, too (being used to the Linns - great definition to the bass, but not much "umph").... |
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Bronze Member Username: SmwickB.C Canada Post Number: 17 Registered: Dec-07 | Brian, I have had my Sttafs for almost two years now. Earlier this year I played with mass loading them to see if they could sound even better. My system; Totem Sttaf speakers, Rega Apollo cdp, HK AVR 445 receiver. I know the HK receiver has to go one day. I would like to replace it with the Mira3. I wonder if I can hook up my XboX through the Mira3? Anyway, I started with about 5lbs of silica sand in each then tried them. Seem to make a very small improvement in the tightness of the bass, so I added a little more. Each time I added some sand it seemed to get a little better. In the end I added about 8lbs to each speaker. I also took the spikes out and put rubber bumpers where the spikes were and set the speaker on 1'x1' marble tiles. The combination of the sand and the marble tile base really seemed to solidify the bass and produce even cleaner sound IMO. |
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Bronze Member Username: OddyoCanada Post Number: 13 Registered: Sep-08 | Thanks for the input, Steve. It's good to have something to go on when I get around to trying it! Speaking to those who talked about power to drive the Totems, I'm a little worried now as I am thinking of switching from the two Adcoms to a 50W Linn amp... |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 3245 Registered: Sep-04 | Brian, I'd pull them out from the wall another 6 inches or so. I think you'll find the bass frees up a bit. Also, very important, the Sttafs should not be toed in very much, just enough to make an image in the middle but that's it./ I always start by setting them up just off straight and usually end up with just about 5 degrees of toe-in. Leaving them as un-toed-in as possible has the happy effect of loosening up the bass, making it less 'ploddy'. I have never tried mass loading Sttafs, but I ahve tried it on other Totems and I'm not a fan. |
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Silver Member Username: PabloPost Number: 133 Registered: Mar-06 | I have tried loading my Arro's with silica sand and removed it after a while. I think they lost bit of sharpness and details with sand. Pablo |
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Bronze Member Username: SmwickB.C Canada Post Number: 18 Registered: Dec-07 | Pablo, I found the opposite. Detail was better, maybe because of less vibration within the enclosure. Sttafs might react differently to mass loading than Arro's. |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 10976 Registered: Dec-04 | The differing stands are likely a factor here, it is easy to overdamp the lively cabinets. |
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Silver Member Username: PabloPost Number: 134 Registered: Mar-06 | Since then I have installed totem claws on Arro's. May be I will give another try... I run them on Arcam AVR350 by-amped so there should be suficient power. Pablo |