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New member Username: Mad320Auburn, Ny Usa Post Number: 1 Registered: Jun-04 | I have a Marantz SR6400 reciever and use paradigm Legend speakers with built in subs. I am looking to upgrade and have narrowed my choices to the Paradigm monitor 90p, definitive technology BP7004 or looked into The Axiom 80's which are probably out because I would like the built in subs. Lucky for me, my dealer carries both Paradigm and Definitive, so i can compare both. My Question to you is Any personal reviews and what should I look for that anyone has for PLUSES or MINUSES to either one. Any feedback would be appreciated. |
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Unregistered guest | Between those 3, Paradigm. Hands down. Definitive has phase issues, Axiom looks to have even more phase issues. Paradigm builds a pretty decent speaker for the $$. If you want better, find a Green Mountain Audio dealer near you and listen to the "Europa" model. You'll not want the others after that. $880.00/pair. Cast marble cabinets. No resonances. Best possible parts. Time/phase aligned/ VERY musical.....best I have heard under $3K |
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New member Username: Mad320Upstate NY, NY USA Post Number: 3 Registered: Jun-04 | Thanks, anyone else? |
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Silver Member Username: Elitefan1Post Number: 428 Registered: Dec-03 | Considering you have a Marantz receiver I would go with the Def Tech's. Marantz with Paradigm is too laid back for me. If you have a Monitor Audio dealer in your area I highly recommend you give the Monitor Silver Series a long listen. You might also want to listen to the Monitor Gold 10 and 20. IMO Marantz with Monitor is a better combo than any of the above but of your list again I'd go with the Def Tech's. Buy the way you are considering some rather expensive speakers considering the cost of your receiver. |
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Bronze Member Username: MarkuspToronto, ON Canada Post Number: 54 Registered: Apr-04 | I agree - Marantz with Paradigm isn't the greatest combination (atleast it didn't work well for me). I'd try the Def Tech's. |
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New member Username: Mad320Upstate NY, NY USA Post Number: 4 Registered: Jun-04 | Thanks, I know there is more input than this. To elitefan 1. Is there a problem with the speaker selection? It is a $600.00 receiver, how much more do i need to spend? Just wondering why you made the comment. Also it's "by" the way. Thanks to all for your input I will consider all input. |
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Silver Member Username: Elitefan1Post Number: 433 Registered: Dec-03 | Michael, My comment was just that it's a bit unusual to spend $2000 plus for a pair of mains to go with a $600 receiver but there is nothing sonically wrong with that at all. You have a very nice receiver with plenty of multichannel power and a nice warm sound so match it correctly and you'll have a real winner of a system. Good luck. |
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New member Username: Mad320Upstate NY, NY USA Post Number: 5 Registered: Jun-04 | thanks |
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Unregistered guest | Michael, one thing you need to realise is the room accoustics makes a HUGE difference in sound. Thats why you need to listen to both amps on the speakers IN YOUR ROOM. Make sense? Markus says the amp is too "laid back" with those speakers. Definitive Tech speakers definately have lots of phase problems, by design. Paradigm not so much so. Hmmmm....could it be his room? Placement is also key in the final sound you hear. Thats why you want to hook it up, take some time and LISTEN. Listen to all kinds of music. Good recordings. CRAP recordings. Most gear can make audiophile recordings sound listenable. But most gear falls apart on junk recordings. Get some old Janis Joplin. Crank it up. Sound good? Or does it sound like you wanna throw up? Great speakers will still sound fine on even the WORST recordings. I could recomend a great speaker for you. Let me know. I could be totally wrong. Or, I may know what i'm talking about. You don't know. Thats why you need to listen for yourself, then go back and read what others advise you of....and determine what advise is good, sound advise and whats not. Your money.....your ears. Good listening and good luck. |
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Bronze Member Username: MarkuspToronto, ON Canada Post Number: 59 Registered: Apr-04 | Mauimusicman - I agree that auditioning amps at home is essential as everyone's listening environment is quite different. I also agree that my listening environment may have influenced my opinion that Paragidm speakers are not an ideal match for the Marantz. I owned Paradigm mini monitors, monitor 5s, a cc-370 center channel and adp 170s matched with a Marantz sr7300. This combination never gave me the excitement that I had once I switched out the Paradigm system for a B&W system. This may have been my personal preference, the speakers themselves, or my room acoustics etc. In truth, probably a combination of all three. Just for my own information, what is this phase problem with Def Techs you keep reffering to? Thanks, Markus |
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Unregistered guest | Markus, many, if not most speakers are out of phase in the critical voice range. Even many who claim to be phase aligned are really not. The woofer and tweeter don't start and stop on the same cycle, if you will. Speakers that are very sensitive to a certian amplifier have a phase response that is all screwed up, thus revealing any problems the amplifier may have more clearly. Generally, these phase problems are caused by the crossover system. Anything other than a simple 1st order crossover at 6db/octave cannot be time/phase coherent. Most crossovers cannot pass the most delicate signals, which makes the speaker sound bland. A harmonic oscillator(driver) has a 1/4 wave's worth of time-delay down at its low-frequecy resonance, compared to the midrange tones. For a sealed woofer with -3dB at 40Hz (close-mic'd measured), that means 1/4 of 1/40th of a second, or 1/160th of a second=6.25 milliseconds. That doesn't sound like much time delay, but it is ~7 feet of distance, at the speed of sound.Put two microphones on a piano- one for the left hand, one for the right; both equally close to the strings/soundboard. Now, impose 6.25 milliseconds delay between those two mics- that is, between the lowest notes and the mid-scale notes. Imagine what the piano would sound like if the right hand tones got to the microphone seven feet sooner than the left hand's lowest notes, because that's what's happening as you slide down the scale for ANY loudspeaker- and it's a gradual change in phase, which is why we don't complain too much. Another thing to note here is that with the exception of synth's, almost all music we listen to is recorded via a microphone. The mic can only hear one thing: distance. Distance is time. Time/phase. If the speaker screws up this critical timing of the music, the performance is lost, to a degree. Most headphones have little or no phase shift. Most people like a headphones "realism" if you will. Why? Little phase shift. Thats also why so many designers opt for single driver systems (no phase shift induced by the x-over) and why so many audiophiles love electrostatic speakers. Again, less phase shift. If you were around when the original cd players were introduced, you'd recall them sounding flat out horrible. Why? Phase problems introduced by the anti-aliasing filters at 22.05khz, causing massive phase irregularities thru the middle frequency range. Our ears are most sensitive to phase in the voice range, therefore any phase issues in that bandwith will be very annoying. Do some research on time/phase issues. A good place to start would be http:www.meadowlarkaudio.com They have a very good explanation there of why time/phase is critical in loudspeakers. Good listening and aloha. |
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New member Username: Mad320Upstate NY, NY USA Post Number: 6 Registered: Jun-04 | Hey, guys just want opinions on speakers, don,t get all crazy on me now. |
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Silver Member Username: Project6Post Number: 682 Registered: Dec-03 | Yes, we do tend to go overboard don't we. There is just so much information to share, coupled with different types of experiences. However, I tend to agree with Elitefan, Definitive Technology or Axiom M80 would go well with the Marantz. cheers |