Outlaw 990/7125 + Studio 20's +Hsu VTF3 MK2

DGR Bronze Member Username: Dgr69 Post Number: 11 Registered: Mar-06	Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 15:55 GMT I really only have one nagging question on this setup: the Paradigm book says the Studio 20s are rated at 100w. The Outlaw 7125 drives 125w. Am I going to risk damaging these? I could down shift to the Outlaw 1070 for less power & $$ or upshift to the B&W 603s (which I may still do anyway pending one last listening session). All of your opinions and advice have been incredibly valuable. Your specific thoughts on this pairing will be like sweet water to a burgeoning audiophile wandering in the wilderness. Thanks! DGR
Stu Pitt Gold Member Username: Stu_pitt Irvington, New York USA Post Number: 1220 Registered: May-05	Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 16:28 GMT DGR - Forget the speaker wattage spec. It's relatively meaningless. Most all damage comes from under-powering speakers, not over-powering them. The Outlaw products reportedly have more than enough clean power to drive your speakers safely, yet won't over do it either. I haven't heard the Outlaw products, but from what I've heard and my experience with the Studio 20s, they should sound great together.
Stu Pitt Gold Member Username: Stu_pitt Irvington, New York USA Post Number: 1221 Registered: May-05	Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 16:32 GMT I forgot to say - I'm not a fan of the B&W 603, but a lot of people love them. To my ears they work very well with Rotel, which reportedly sounds similar to Outlaw. If so, they would probably be a good match too. It's a matter of preference really. I prefer the Studios by a large margin, but that's just me. If you're only reason for contemplating the B&W's is power handling, it's not worth your time and effort.
Hawk Silver Member Username: Hawk Highlands Ranch, CO USA Post Number: 854 Registered: Dec-03	Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 22:43 GMT DGR: I think the Paradigm Studios are a very good pairing with the Outlaws. As for your other concern, I think Stu is absolutely right, but let me amplify his answer. Your speakers are rated at 100 watt continuous, but you are not going to send a 100 watt continuous signal to them. Instead, you may hit an occasional 125 watt peak, but that is transitory, lasting milliseconds. The Studios will eat that up--they have good thermal dissapation and they do like power. They are very well built and will have no problem with 125 watt peaks because in all likelyhood, most of the musical signal will be more like 15-30 watts, at most. Remember, to get an extra 3 db of sound, you must double the amount of power, so a 15 watt signal, which will probably be fairly loud already (the Studios being a pretty efficient speaker I think at 90 db/1 watt/1 meter) were to get louder, it goes to 30 watts, then 60 watts and then 120 watts. Believe me, you just won't be listening to that system that loud. It will be extremely rare you would ever even get that loud, but if you did, it would only last an extremely short period of time. Enjoy!!!
Art Kyle Gold Member Username: Artk Albany, Oregon USA Post Number: 3164 Registered: Feb-05	Posted on Thursday, April 27, 2006 - 01:16 GMT Yup! Enjoy the setup it should be awesome!
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 3 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 20:39 GMT You already got an answer but just to add, the recommended amp power for the 20's is 15 -- 150 watts according to paradigm. I'm planning on that exact same system. Going to go demo the 20's and some revel concertas tomorrow.
William Rush Bronze Member Username: Rushwj Knoxville, TN USA Post Number: 33 Registered: Feb-05	Posted on Friday, May 12, 2006 - 15:27 GMT Let me know how you like that setup! I've got the paradigm studio's all around also and a HSU sub (the new VTF3-HO) and was considering the Outlaw separates w/ the 990 paired up to the 7125. I'm excited to hear how it all mates up! also, what are you using for a dvd and/or cd player. -bill
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 4 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Friday, May 12, 2006 - 15:42 GMT I'm actually going to audition the Arcam AVR300 this afternoon. The store I'm getting the speakers from has it on sale and I might be able to get a bigger discount if I get everything from the same place. I'm also auditioning a cambridge audio 340C CD player and a pioneer DV588a DVD player. Currently I'm just using a cheap toshiba DVD player. Are you using the ADP's in the rear or Studio 20's. I'm still trying to decide. I might still get the outlaw stuff but right now even without a discount the Arcam is $300 cheaper.
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 5 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Saturday, May 13, 2006 - 00:45 GMT Just finished auditioning the Arcam. I must say I was less impressed than the first time I heard the Studio 20's last weekend. Last time I heard them connected to a Linn independents classik. I really liked the 20's but I don't think I would run them without a sub even for music. He had them going with a Seismic 10 with the cross over at 50hz and the LFE output (or whatever it is) turned way down so I was mostly hearing just the 20's. It seemed to be lacking a lot of the low end stuff. I think the first time I liked them better because he played music I'd never heard before (Dead Can Dance) and this time I brought my own stuff (Dire Straits, Chris Issak) that I'm used to listening to in my car with a JL Audio sub (12w3). So, I really noticed the lack of bass that I was used to in my car. Except for that it sounded really good. It was the 540C not the 340C that I auditioned. It seemed good but I haven't heard anything else to compare it to (except the linn I guess). Now I have to decide what to get. The Arcam would be $2300CAN and the outlaw stuff would be about $2450CAN (I was including gst for the outlaw stuff when I said the arcam was $300 cheaper). Any opinions on any of this. He's giving my quite a good deal on the speakers (21% off MSRP) but only $90 off the reciever and $40 off the cdp cause they are already on sale.
William Rush Bronze Member Username: Rushwj Knoxville, TN USA Post Number: 34 Registered: Feb-05	Posted on Saturday, May 13, 2006 - 01:27 GMT rob, the 20's, as most bookshelves, do best w/ a good sub paired to them. that being said, i do enjoy mine by themselves at times for just a good clean mid/high end. certainly if you're used to the acoustics and bass that you hear in your car then they would seem lacking without it. it's funny that you've considered the arcam 300 as i am also torn between arcam and outlaw and am undecided as to which one to get. i likely won't upgrade from my current marantz 7500 (which i'm enjoying) for about a year and a half, at which point my finances would allow me to get arcam separates if i wanted. as to the rears, i went w/ the adp's as i wanted the bi/dipole surrounds. it's a matter of preference which one you get - some like direct (20s) others like bi/dipoles (adp) for the rears. only you can decide. i like the sound as more of ambience and less localised, hence the adp's. i've considered the 340c as a cd player but have not been able to audition it. i've heard good recommendations for it though. the speakers sound like a good deal, but rarely do places offer any kind of discount on arcam equipment. the avr300 may be on a little sale because they're working on the next model (350?) which will have a little more power and HDMI. this is all heresay from my local dealer. we'll see. good luck with it and keep us updated! remember to have fun with!
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 6 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Saturday, May 13, 2006 - 01:51 GMT Yeah, they are expecting the AVR350 in 45 days. His arcam rep told him the only difference was HDMI and it will be $3000. The regular price they sell the AVR300 for is $2900 and it's on sale for $2400. I think I'll go with the ADP's as well. I don't own a single multichannel audio disc so I'm not too worried about that. Also, I thought the ADP's would be a lot more than the 20's (at another store I noticed the adp370's were double the price of the mini monitors) but it turns out they are only $100 more and I won't have to pay for stands. I'll most likely get the arcam. I want to make up my mind by tomorrow as that's when they do their orders. Otherwise I might have to wait till next sat before they order whatever I decide. I'm also considering a NAD521bee at another dealer that is $50 cheaper than the 540C. Most of the searches I do for the 540C end up with people recommending the NAD over it. The NAD is apparently warmer too which I think I would like better. The 540 was a little too cold or whatever the word is.
William Rush Bronze Member Username: Rushwj Knoxville, TN USA Post Number: 35 Registered: Feb-05	Posted on Saturday, May 13, 2006 - 13:22 GMT thanks for the tip on the NAD cdp. i'll have to take a look at it.
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 7 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Tuesday, May 16, 2006 - 00:13 GMT Bought the Arcam, 20's, CC470, ADP470 and J Series Stands today. I have to wait two weeks for delivery to the store though. Once I get it setup I'll probably demo the NAD player.
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 8 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 16:36 GMT Went to a local HSU dealer to get some prices. He said the HSU was a good sub but he was really pushing a James Loudspeaker EMB1000 which he just became a dealer for (getting his first shipment next week). He said he'll give me a 45% discount (although it's only a 20% discount if compared to the US price converted to Canadian dollars) but it's still double what the vtf3 costs. The emb1000 has gotten really good reviews but I'm wondering if there are other subs I should be looking at if I go up to that price range ($1500CAN).
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 9 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 16:39 GMT EMB1000 info http://www.jamesloudspeaker.com/speakerdetail.cfm?id=52 Reviews http://www.jamesloudspeaker.com/literature.cfm?type=model&spkid=52
William Rush Bronze Member Username: Rushwj Knoxville, TN USA Post Number: 36 Registered: Feb-05	Posted on Tuesday, May 23, 2006 - 13:21 GMT I have Hsu's new VTF3-HO and am very pleased w/ it w/ my paradigm studios. i think hsu is a great deal for what you get. i'm not familiar w/ james loudspeaker.
rob New member Username: Rob1234 Post Number: 10 Registered: Feb-06	Posted on Tuesday, May 23, 2006 - 16:01 GMT I think James Loudspeaker is more popular with custom home theatre builders than the retail market. Everything I've read about them is very good. I'd like to take a look at the HO but HSU is replacing the driver and fixing a bunch of stuff on them so who knows how long it will be until it's available in Canada.

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