Hello all, I also posted this under the CD thread so I apologize for the redundancy. I wrote NAD recently and they told me the best way to connect my C542 CD player to my T773 receiver was via the analog RCA connection since the DAC's in the C542 are of higher quality. This makes sense to me but I am curious? I am using bookshelf speakers for my L/R mains and a subwoofer crossed over at 80hz. If I use an analog connection won't the signal be converted several times before being output to the speakers? Once in the CD player (D2A), and twice in the receiver (A2D & D2A) causing a degredation of the origanl signal. Wouldn't it be better to use a digital connection so that the signal only has to go through one conversion? I guess what I'm really asking is are the DAC's in the CD player really that much better such that the signal could go through 3 conversions and still sound better than the DAC's used only once in the receiver? Direct Bypass is not an option since my fronts don't go low enough to produce decent full range sound and need a subwoofer for the low end.
I doubt you will hear the conversions. Anytime you use the DSP's built into the receiver (to set speaker distance, size, etc.) you have some possibility for errors. Try both and listen for which you prefer. It would be unlike NAD to tell you they put crappy DAC's in their stuff.
Blazer: as Jan wrote, digital is perfect! What Jan is referring to is that you don't want to go through TOO MANY conversions of the audio signal as you will have some form of degredation.
What your dealer (NAD) is telling you is that the DACs in your C542 are better Burr-Brown DACs than the ones in your T7xx receiver. For the "best" audio, it's better to use the best DACs during the processing.
There are few people I know who have an ear that good... to tell the difference... but there would be some small difference. As my friend Jan writes, listen for yourself.
In any event, you hit on another thing. If you are going to do any sound processing (any effects or surround formats) on your CD input, then you should use the DIGITAL INPUTS!!! This is because you certainly don't want to do a DA conversion and then an AD conversion -- so that the system can do the "digital" affects -- and then another DA conversion before amplification! So I wholeheartedly agree with you on that point. But, that's only if you're using the digital processing capabilities.
Personally, I listen to 99.9% of my CDs in stereo mode (no processing whatsoever). Therefore, I use the stereo connectors only. However, my DVD/CD player is also connected via the Optical connectors as well. I have assigned the digital connection to the "DVD" input on my receiver and the analogue connection to the "CD" input on my receiver! It's cool and it works!
Thanks so much geekboy, Since you are using analog connections with your CD player and listening in stereo, am I to assume you have full range front speakers and not using your receiver's bass management (digital processing as you refer to it) which would add another AD/DA conversion to the signal?
Blazer: yes, when I'm in stereo only mode (surround off), I send all information to my front L/R pair only. THey are full range towers with base extension to 18Hz. So, I don't go through the processing logic in the system.
Geekboy, since my front L/R speakers are bookshelfs and only play down to about 60Hz, I am using a sub. Am I right in assuming then that the best way to connect my CD player is via digital to avoid the extra processing that comes from the receiver's bass management when connect via analog? Thanks!
You can always use the speaker level sub connection. The sub is in play at all times and the adjustment range using the sub's own crossover will normally provide a finer degree of choice than the typical ten Hertz jump which receiver's provide. You loose the ability to alter any sub settings on the fly; but is that how you use your system?
Blazer: as Jan writes, you could always wire your front L/R pair through your sub-woofer. That way, you don't have the affects of processing. However, as he writes, you will not be able to change the sub crossover settings via the receiver, and you will loose some flexibility.
But, if this is mostly for music, who cares? However, if you're using it for multi-channel sound (movies or music), then you could be in a pickle.
Thanks jan and and geekboy. Geekboy, I assume when you say "affects of processing" you are referring to bass management as well as surround processing. If I rout the L/R pre-outs to the sub's line level inputs (setting my mains to large and sub to off) am I not now using the subwoofer's digital processing for bass management? I must be confused on how an analog signal sent from the CD player is processed when it gets to the receiver or subwoofer if a crossover setting is used instead a direct bypass.
I'm really enjoying learning. Thank you so much. Just thougt of one more novice question. Does it make much of a difference how "good" a DVD or CD player is if it is connected to a receiver via digital? Obviously it would if connected via analog but with digital aren't you just using the player as a transport therefore anything short of a "really cheap" player would work just as well as another? Example: Would someone hear much of a difference listening to a CD played on either an NAD C542 CD player or NAD T542 DVD player if both are connected to the receiver via digital connection?
Blazer: well... the "transport" can be important as well. As DVD/CD players and more generally, optical readers, have improved over the years, there's some things which affect playback and two of them are "wow and flutter" and "jitter".
So many of the higher end models of CD "transports" have very stable read rates of the spinning CD/DVD as it pulls information off. Some of them even buffer the information so as to reduce the affects of "wow and flutter" on the actual playback. So most CD transports today have gotten rid of this problem.. or at least maksed it enough to render the affects... immeasurable.
The thing that probably is the most annoying now is jitter. Jitter has to do with the timing of how the digital data is played back. Having said that, there are beliefs that some $2K or more CD transports play back the audio better!
Now, can I hear the difference... I don't think I can. Maybe when comparing a really bad CD player to a good player (NAD C542 for example)... I could hear the difference.
But paying $2K for a CD transport... is silly. (Sorry audiophiles.)
I would say that... you may not be able to hear the difference in the connections. However, some purist would believe that the cable has some affect on the "digital" signal even though it's light and 1s and 0s. The 1s and 0s have to arrive at a certain pace (interval) which reflects what was originally recorded. I cant' tell... and I don't know if I want to be able to tell! I'm a 70% movies 30% music guy... leaning towards 80/20 in reality!
Great stuff geekboy! If I'm understanding you correctly, unless you're superman, you shouldn't be able to hear a difference between a C542 CD player and T534 DVD player if both are connected to a receiver through their digital outputs. If that statement is correct, you have done a very good job in educating me and I thank you whole heartedly.
Blazer: while I can't hear the difference, there are people who can/could. I do have near perfect pitch -- I'm a pianist -- but unless I'm doing real critical listening (to music)... I don't think I could tell the difference!
In any event, the differences are so minute, only the true audiophile would care... and spend more than $2K on a CD transport (only)!
Your short answer is, no. I don't think there would be any significant difference in the device. However, if you have both, try it!
ypur amp should have a direct stereo setup that bypasses the dsp processors. Connect using the analog and set rour amp for direct stereo and you should have the best sound possible...