Neutral speakers????
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Bronze Member Username: Kinggimp82Post Number: 19 Registered: May-05 | ive been reasearching acsend cmb-170's and keep hearing that they are very neutral. What exactly does that mean? i listen to mainly rock music. are they a good fit 4 that genre? |
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Silver Member Username: TwebbzAnn Arbor, Michigan USA Post Number: 111 Registered: Apr-04 | You need to talk with EDSTER. He has ASCENDS. |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 852 Registered: Mar-05 | Andrew, I used to think that the Ascends were not suited for rock music, but after going over more of my cd library I saw that it all depends on the quality of the recording. Classic rock is over half of my rock CD collection, and a lot of it---Beatles, Lennon, Zeppelin---sounded better on my old Sony minisystem than my Ascend+Marantz/NAD setup, scarily enough. Yet similar types of music recorded 20-30 years later (Dire Straits, Nirvana, U2, Black Crows) sounded GREAT! Of course it goes without saying that almost all jazz, classical, and accoustic/vocal music sounds amazing on the Ascends. Neil Young's CDs from the early 70s to his later stuff from the 90s both sound amazing. As for what "neutral" means, here's Stereophile's definition: neutral Free from coloration. (http://stereophile.com/reference/50/index6.html) coloration An audible "signature" with which a reproducing system imbues all signals passing through it. (http://stereophile.com/reference/50/index2.html) Yes, I'd agree that Ascends are very neutral indeed, probably the most neutral speaker I've ever heard under about $1300. This is especially evident when listening to vocal-dominant music like Norah Jones, or when watching TV and movies---with my Ascend 340 center I find that I don't need to crank the volume as much in order to understand dialogue. For more reading on the ascends, go to avsforum.com or hometheaterforum.com and do a search. |
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Gold Member Username: Paul_ohstbucksPost Number: 1231 Registered: Jan-05 | Pauls definition of neutral......"Dull and boring". Yea, I know...I know, that this is technical and advanced terminology. I'll try to refrain from using such technical terms in the future to avoid going over the heads of the audio 'lay-persons'.  |
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Bronze Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 67 Registered: May-05 | "Dull and boring", Paul you make me laugh. ROTFL But, don't you think that "Dull and boring" is also advanced terminology since it suggests a listeners viewpoint as to how the speakers respond to audio input, which is also over the head of us audio "lay persons"? What if the audio lay person is listening to the Helms Keep portion of LOTR II at about -15? Geez, I'm starting to scare myself here so I'm just going to shut up and let you return flame me. :-) |
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Gold Member Username: Paul_ohstbucksPost Number: 1234 Registered: Jan-05 | Ahhh...great flick. I still need to add part1 to my collection. |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 866 Registered: Mar-05 | Actually -15db is just about right for movie watching, esp. a movie like LOTR. I've gone as low as -5db, but not into the plus numbers though. |
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Bronze Member Username: Kinggimp82Post Number: 20 Registered: May-05 | most of my rock cds are newer recording. nirvana, acdc, metallica, g n r, colective soul, godsmack, and velvet revolver to name a few. ill probably try the 170's out when i have the cash. if i dont like the sound ill send em back. |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 871 Registered: Mar-05 | > most of my rock cds are newer recording. in that case I doubt you'll be sending them back. Just a hunch... ; ) |
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Somed00d Unregistered guest | Youre going to need a sub to match up with the Ascends, especially with rock. Also Id suggest at least a budget integrated amp for them, like a NAD or Cambrdige or else theyll sound lifeless and harsh. I didnt really like the Ascends, but ill leave this for another discussion. btw I listen to mostly rock music too- lots of older Iron Maiden, Metallica, Montley Crue, Deep Purple etc. |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 875 Registered: Mar-05 | Somed00d, it's very likely that with your tastes a pair of JBLs or Cerwin Vegas would be the more appropriate choice since they exaggerate the frequencies that this type of music sounds best at. BTW those bands you listed were my faves too when I was in my teenage-headbanging days. Iron Maiden's "Piece of Mind" was my all-time favorite, but they went downhill after "Powerslave." I would've also included Judas Priest and AC/DC on that list. However I think that only Metallica is still going strong these days. anyways I remember back in those days I always had my EQ sliders in a U-shape: all lows and highs, very light on the mids. Needless to say that as my musical tastes have changed with time so have my EQ settings, lol. |
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Barnacle Unregistered guest | As Edster said the Ascends are quite neutral. And as such quite revealing too. If you like a warmer sound they may not be the speaker for you. They will not warm up old rock-n-roll recordings but will reveal every detail and expose poor quality recordings. Which you may or may not like. If you play your music really loud you might think about stepping up the Ascend's 340s. |
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Somed00d Unregistered guest | Edster, Actually, no, CV and JBL are mass market junk that make my ears bleed because of their bright presentation and are best suited for people who listen to Eminem and Snoop Dogg. I have no idea why people suggest a bright speaker for music that already tends to sound bright itself. This doesnt make very much sense to me. Anyways, the Ascends are terrible for rock, or any other music with bass because their -3db point is at 69hz. The lowest note on double bass drums is 41hz. Im also not a big fan of trying to integrate a sub - this ususally causes more problems than it fixes. I also listen to all different styles of music, those bands I listed were just to show I have experiance with rock/heavy metal. Besides being able to rock more, my current speakers (PSB Stratus Mini's) also sound flatter, more detailed, have better decay, better ambience and just sound more like real music than the Ascends (which I owned for a year) ever did. I really think it comes down to taste, you may like the analytical presentation the Ascends put out, but I sure dont. In the end this poster should audition the Ascends if they interest him, but he should also audition different types of speakers at home during the same period. I made the mistake of buying speakers before comparing them to anything else, I just thought "ok this sounds good enough, ill buy them". |
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Somed00d Unregistered guest | I wanted to clarify that I didnt mean to bash Ascend, even though it seemed that way. The fact is, I wouldnt want to own any speaker in this price range, including the cheaper PSB's- which to me were bright and had horrendous box resonances- the Ascend's cabinets were much cleaner. Actually, id probably rather own the Ascend's than similiar priced speakers by Paradigm ( hear they are briiight) B&W ( similiar sound to Ascend, but with a bright tweeter and much more expensive) and most likelly many other brands. Ascends may not be the most musical to my ears, but at least they dont have any glaring weaknesses that will give you headaches . |
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Bronze Member Username: Kinggimp82Post Number: 21 Registered: May-05 | im not worried about the lack of bass, i recently bought a hsu stf-2 which can easily handle the low end. bass drums sound incredible on the stf-2. btw edster i said in another post that the stf-2 couldnt fill ur awkward room. it may do just fine. not really sure. the LFE was set too low on my reciever. i only have it set to 50% volume and it is quite powerful. |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 887 Registered: Mar-05 | Somed00d, not much in your post that I would really kick up a fuss against, it's clear we probably have different musical preferences/tastes. For the record though you are about the only person I've ever come across on any audio forum who didn't adopt a "til death do we part" attitude about the Ascends...heathen! ;-) Your advice to the Andrew (the original poster) is very reasonable, I would add the suggestion of taking the Ascends around to different shops and doing A/B comparisons if they'll let you. I did just that after I got my 340s, went back to the audio place where I had originally bought my Marantz 5400 and spent the better part of an afternoon trying them out against their stock of Klipsch, PSB, Triangle, Monitor Audio and NHT. The stiffest competition I found was from the Triangle speakers but they were over twice the price. The PSBs I heard were very bright---unforutnately I don't remember the exact models, I was pretty much experiencing information overload thanks to my very loquacious sales rep. But an honest sales rep---in the end he agreed with me that the only speakers he carried which could match the Ascends were in the + $1200 range. |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 888 Registered: Mar-05 | andrew, glad to hear that, the wife would give me less grief for the STF-2 due to its smaller size and pricetag than the STF-3. Funny thing is, since my NAD gear has no crossover I am basically running my Ascend 340s at full range and with the huge bass increase that the NAD provides, it really makes up for the otherwise weak bass of my JBL sub. So for the moment I am turning my attention towards upgrading my CD player to maybe a NAD 542, though not without doing a direct a/b comparison by bringing in my current cd player to a shop that has the 542. |
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Bronze Member Username: Kinggimp82Post Number: 22 Registered: May-05 | my only other concern with acsend 170s is if my reciever will have enough power for them. its 100watt pc. its only a pioneer VSX-D514. would i be ok with the acsends running on it or would i be better served with a cheaper pair of say athena as-b2s |
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Silver Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 910 Registered: Mar-05 | I don't think you have any cause for concern even with a Pio 514, the cbm-170 and as-b2 have the exact same 91db sensitivity and are not exactly massive floorstanders which would indeed require more power. The only advantage with the as-b2 is cost, the cbm-170 would have a clear SQ superiority. |
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Gold Member Username: Paul_ohstbucksPost Number: 1317 Registered: Jan-05 | I agree with Eddie. Any receiver should be good enough to power those speakers. Good luck |
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