1200 watt Hifonics keeps shorting out-why
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 1 Registered: Sep-08 | I have a 1200 watt 1205D Hifonics amp and when the bass hits hard it shorts out and my protct light comes on. What the hell did I do and how do I fix it? |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 340 Registered: Mar-08 | do you have speaker wires touching? are the speakers hooked up right? |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 2 Registered: Sep-08 | honostly, i dont know. someone else conected everything. how can i tell? I dont see any markings on the wires to say what one is pos. and neg. If i swith them and try it cant hurt can it? |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 341 Registered: Mar-08 | its not marked on the speaker terminals which one it it? i know it on the amp. dont just start swaping stuff around or it may never work again LOL. look at the speakers and find the pos and neg terminals if they are marked and trace the wires back to the amp and see whats hooked up if you could take detailed pics of the back of the subs and the amp terminals as i will have a better understanding of how its hooked up if i can look at it. do you happen to know if they are SVC or DVC subs? the wiring configuration may not be right either so send amp specs and sub specs plz. |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 5 Registered: Sep-08 | Gonna check the wires in daylight tomorow, but wondering how I know/find out about the SVC or DVC? Also could it be a fuse since it only cuts out when loud? And theres a wierd sound when its turned down low? Distorted somewhat. (Im kinda really new at this if you couldnt tell  ) |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 342 Registered: Mar-08 | check all your rca connections. this is really odd. svc stabds for single voice coil. dvc is dual voice coil (subwoofer voice coils) what type of subs u have? how big is the fuse in the power wire to the amp? do you have a DMM? (digital multimeter) is the amp getting 12 volta to it? is it grounded good? " but wondering how I know/find out about the SVC or DVC" do your subs have 1 set of terminals or two? 1 they = SVC 2 =DVC ALL is valuable information. the impedence to which the subs coils are wired may not be compatible with the amp. i.e if a sub is a 2 ohm and the amp isnt 2 ohm stable its not gonna work. you have to know the capacity of the amp and make sure you select subs with the proper specs... to make a long story short. |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10396 Registered: Jun-04 | It sounds like you dont have enough alternator to run the amp and the voltage is dropping too low. What vehicle and year do you have? |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 343 Registered: Mar-08 | yes sean, i tried to find an owners manual for this amp to get the specs. i thought about it and asked him if he had a dmm to check the voltage going to the amp. |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10397 Registered: Jun-04 | I just checked on the fuse size for this amp and its 80 amps. So at 80% efficiency that is 921 watts at 14.4 volts. |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 344 Registered: Mar-08 | i dont doubt you in any way. but where did you find the info???? |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10398 Registered: Jun-04 | Oh I wasnt questioning you eithier. Just doing the math for you to be able to calculate the gain voltage. Might as well call it 900 watts. An old ecoustics post and I posted in it haha. https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/car-audio/144944.html |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 345 Registered: Mar-08 | i quoted this from that other thread. "sorry to point this out but 80 amps times 14.4 volts is 1152 watts and your luck if that amp is more than 80 percent efficient so now your down to 921.60 watts rms" so let me understand. you take the amp ratomg of the fuse(s) multiply it by14.4 volts and that gives you ur watts at 100% efficeincy. btw i almost failed math in highschool so... but anyway now that i have the watts at 100% how do i get down to 80% like you to figure out what it is at 80% efficient? i have learned sumin new 2day. |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10399 Registered: Jun-04 | Remember only class d amps are this efficient and not always that high. When you crunch the numbers some are only 70% but 80 percent is the accepted average. Ok 80 amps x 14.4 volts is 1152 then you hit minus 20 percent on the calculator or on paper 1152 x .20 and you get 230.4 and then you hit equals and you get 921.6 or on paper 1152 minus 230.4 and you get 921.6. |
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Gold Member Username: N2audioLawrence, Ks USA Post Number: 1615 Registered: Mar-04 | The over-riding factor is that the fuses on an amp don't tell you with any precision at all what power it can actually produce. An 80A fuse should pass 160A for several seconds. It would require 3 or 4x rated current to blow instantaneously. Without knowing how the designer implemented the fuse size you don't know if it's supposed to blow at the first sign of stress or at the last possible moment. However - the few tests floating around on the older Brutus' always showed them to be somewhat over-rated. 900-1000w at 1 ohm is probably a fair guesstimation. W/O knowing the specifics on the subs it's running, and how they're wired it's about impossible to speculate on what's causing the shut down. |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 6 Registered: Sep-08 | my cd player reads out anywhere from 13.5-14.4 volts. 13.7 average.the subs are 12' JL Audio and i believe they are SVC thats about all I know . Its in a 95 Grand Prix. The thing was bumpin great and I messed with the Phase or Level control, one of the ones on the amp you turn with a small screwdriver or knife, and one day outta nowhere i have a problem. from what i see no crossed wires. the first guy who put this in ran it for couple years no problem and im sure he grounded everything rite. Then this other guy decided to take my speakers out of the box and re-wired them (down wired?)so i didnt blow them. they were wired for maximum power i guess. Bridged? But it still worked fine just not as much power. Untill i started turning knobs back there. I will take pictures today so you can see what i got. |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 346 Registered: Mar-08 | turn everything back where it was when it all worked see i didnt know all this at first now you may be asking too much of the amp and it may be clipping and causing itself to go into protect. pics will help? and what state are u in? we're in GA if i can help as far as fixing it back. |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 7 Registered: Sep-08 | Thats the problem. Idont know where it was all set to. I always had people to do it for me so I didnt pay attention when i did it. heres some pic's let me know if you need better ones my camera was dyin. by the way the silver thind that reads digital numbers, it was on when i opened mt trunk and went off and came back on. is that normal?     |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 347 Registered: Mar-08 | ur using speaker level inputs? not rc jacks? is that gain level turned up all the way? if so turn it down to about half way and try it. do ur radio go off at high volumes too or just the amp? i need those last two pics again but not so blurry if u could. those will help the most but i need to be able to read whats on the amp. |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10408 Registered: Jun-04 | Optidriven...."The over-riding factor is that the fuses on an amp don't tell you with any precision at all what power it can actually produce. An 80A fuse should pass 160A for several seconds. It would require 3 or 4x rated current to blow instantaneously. Without knowing how the designer implemented the fuse size you don't know if it's supposed to blow at the first sign of stress or at the last possible moment. However - the few tests floating around on the older Brutus' always showed them to be somewhat over-rated. 900-1000w at 1 ohm is probably a fair guesstimation." You are right it could be misleading and in this case I agree 900 to 1000. |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 348 Registered: Mar-08 | take pics of the subs plz. sean i have this set up where it emails me new posts. they sent me the email for this thread and theres stuff in the email thats supposed to be on ut last post and its not. idk. W/O knowing the specifics on the subs it's running, and how they're wired it's about impossible to speculate on what's causing the shut down." |
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Gold Member Username: Snowball123West Allis, WI United States Post Number: 1007 Registered: Oct-07 | should'nt phase be all the way down? |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10412 Registered: Jun-04 | "sean i have this set up where it emails me new posts. they sent me the email for this thread and theres stuff in the email thats supposed to be on ut last post and its not. idk." Yeah it was late and I was tired but I edited my original post thats probably it. I just remembered to check on the voice coil ohms so i edited this post too. I just remembered to check on the voice coil ohms so I edited this post too. Anyway what model Jl 12 do you have Nina Caradonna? Optidriven...."W/O knowing the specifics on the subs it's running, and how they're wired it's about impossible to speculate on what's causing the shut down." I dont think Jl makes a dual 2 ohm but thats the only case where he could be wired lower than 1 ohm. |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 349 Registered: Mar-08 | ok sean |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 8 Registered: Sep-08 | i dont know what rc jacks compared to speaker level inputs? And when it shuts down i still have music in the car just no subs. will have new pics for you this evening |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 9 Registered: Sep-08 | Are these any better? Can take more if needed    |
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New member Username: Nina08Post Number: 10 Registered: Sep-08 |    |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 351 Registered: Mar-08 | how old is the amp? im starting to think its an internal defect. does it have a warrenty? |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 352 Registered: Mar-08 | hey whats that black wire thats plugged in go0ing to |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 11 Registered: Sep-08 | I assume it goes to the knob they installed by my steering wheel for my bass, to turn it up and down. Im not sure how old it is but i can ask the guy i got it from. probably no warranty |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 12 Registered: Sep-08 |  |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 353 Registered: Mar-08 | ok so whats it set on turn it all the way down and see what happens. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 13 Registered: Sep-08 | i did and theres NO bass when its all the way down. 1/2 to 3/4 is about where i've had it now. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 14 Registered: Sep-08 | No thats wrong, barely any bass but it doesnt cut out when i turn it up |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 354 Registered: Mar-08 | so with the knob turnd down it doesnt protect anymore? unplug the knob from the amp and try it then. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 15 Registered: Sep-08 | so i unplugged it and it seems to take more before it protects, pretty much max volume. The power just isnt there like it was before. i think i blew my speakers cause theres distortion/ crackling? |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 16 Registered: Sep-08 | does a blown speaker still push bass? when you refer to the Gain, which one is that? |
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Gold Member Username: Snowball123West Allis, WI United States Post Number: 1011 Registered: Oct-07 | yeah you shouldn't have the bass knob plugged in, usually clips the subs which is bad. Set your gains correctly with a 50 hz tone and a DMM. |
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Gold Member Username: JuliobSanto DomingoDominican Re... Post Number: 5476 Registered: Dec-05 | i think your gain is kinda high, did you install your stff with a DMM like sean said? IMO there's part of your voltage drops if not installed properly |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 17 Registered: Sep-08 | which one is gain? Dont know what gain is....And I dont know about the DMM i didnt install any of this. But probably not. Blown speakers...what do they sound like? |
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Silver Member Username: WaresgaragestereoFort Valley, GA Post Number: 355 Registered: Mar-08 | the level is the gain it just says level. i think the thing mounted to the dash is caled a bass knob. sean, expound on the whole DMM thing plz. Mina, its a bussing or crackling sound? all the time or just when the volume is up? are the RCA jacks plugged in all the way? the nlue one and the white one. |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10417 Registered: Jun-04 | http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3704 "Most audio equipment dies for one simple reason. Most people push their equipment beyond its limits. Whether it is the amplifier, subwoofer or full range speakers, clipping is the number one cause of failure. To prevent clipping, use this tutorial. To figure out what voltage you should set the gains to, multiply the RMS power of the amplifiers output by the impedance of the speaker, then find the square root of that number. If you are using an amplifier that has an RMS rating of more than your speaker(s) can handle/rated for, then use the RMS rating of the speaker (instead of the RMS of the amplifier) to determine the voltage to set your amp to. This is also referred to as gaining down. Gain Setting Equation Voltage of the output = sqrt(RMS Power X impedance of the speaker) Example Say the amp provides 100WRMS into a 4 ohm speaker: Voltage = sqrt(100W X 4 ohms) Voltage = sqrt(400W*ohms) Voltage = 20V Again, that was only an example, use the ratings of your amp to figure that out. Setting the Gain(s) To set the gain(s), you need two things: 1. A DMM (digital multi-meter) that is capable of measuring AC voltage (needs to be able to measure up to a range of 200V). 2. A test tone CD to use to set the gains at the correct setting. Now, to set the gain(s): 1. Start the vehicle, and pop the test tone CD in the head unit. 2. DO NOT hook up the sub(s) or speaker(s) to the amplifier while doing this, just leave the outputs unused at this time. 3. Now, time to set up the head unit. a. If the loudest you listen to your music at on a regular basis is 22/35 with bass @ +3 and treble @ 0 with MX (or any other sound processor) on, use those settings. NEVER turn the headunit above 3/4 of the maximum volume. b. Remember to have the car turned on. c. If you want to use bass boost on a sub amp, set it prior to setting the gains on the amp and use the center frequency of the bass boost (45 Hz for most amps) as your test tone. d. Please remember that if you have a subwoofer volume control on the headunit and/or a bass knob for the amplifier, set it to the maximum before you set the gains on the sub amp.4. Take the leads from the DMM and but them on the outputs from the amp. 5. Set the gain so that the outputs of the amplifier equal the voltage you found above. This is a MUST. Here is JL Audio tutorial on their site: http://www.jlaudio.com/tutorials/Input_Sen...ensitivity.html Here is where you can download some test tones for system testing/gain setting: http://www.ronelmm.com/tones/ http://www.eminent-tech.com/music/multimediatest.html For test tones higher than 80Hz, download this program and you can create your own: Adobe Audition Trial Version It is best to use 50 Hz tone for a sub amp (unless you have bass boost, use the frequency that is boosted as the tone), and a 1kHz tone for a full-range amp. This is a good way to set the gains, but if you have access to an oscilloscope, by all means use it. Then you can set the gains to their absolute maximum as you can see when the amplifier clips. If you are wondering what exactly clipping is, and what it looks like, read this: http://www.bcae1.com/2ltlpwr.htm If you have any questions about this, post up, I'll try my best to answer them. Also, remember a sub can only handle" what it can, if you set the amp to its RMS you have to remember that the sub can handle only so much. It is box dependant, but it is best if you are not experienced to follow the manufacturers recommendations." (what he means here is a sub can be run with more power than its rated for but within limits but if you arent experienced you shouldnt run more than the manufacture recommends) I didnt check out the guys links but here is a simple voltage calculator. Just type in the power you want to set it at and the ohm load you will be running it at and it gives you your target voltage. http://www.caraudio911.com/tutorials/GainSet/voltage.htm |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 18 Registered: Sep-08 | its more of a crackling pretty much all the time. and the white and blue are in all the way. gonna wait and see if this guy can come take a look today before i do anything else to it. |
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Platinum Member Username: WingmanaliveA pic is worth 1000 posts!! Post Number: 18044 Registered: Jun-06 | "its more of a crackling pretty much all the time." Have you heard of "distortion"? If the amp isn't internally damaged then I believe you just have. How does the speaker move when you gently manually push on the cone with the stereo off? Does it move freely or are there scratchy noises? If there's noise then the driver has sustained damage. If you suspect either the amp or subs then try swapping both. Use a friend's sub and try playing it with your amp. LOW levels of course. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 19 Registered: Sep-08 | pushed on them and no scratchy noise so i guess thats a good thing? |
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Platinum Member Username: WingmanaliveA pic is worth 1000 posts!! Post Number: 18045 Registered: Jun-06 | Good thing for the subs. Now it's probably with the amp's settings or an internal malfunction. I would still try the amp and subs out with a friend's setup first. And the dial marked "level" is most likely your gain knob. It appears to be set less than 50%. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 20 Registered: Sep-08 | well guys the mysterery is solved, apparently I fried my amp. we did the switch with the subs and then the amp and sure enough. thank you for all the help i sure learned alot about this stuff. So now im wondering is it possible to fix this if i bring it or send it in somewhere? |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10432 Registered: Jun-04 | If you didnt switch a new amp into your car then it still might not be a bad amp. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 21 Registered: Sep-08 | so i should try my amp in a friends car to make sure? The old amp im borowing is only 100 watts, rather not have anything in there cuz it doesnt do s*** really. But theres no distortion anymore so we thought it was my amp. |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10442 Registered: Jun-04 | If your using an amp in your car now with no problems and you didnt mess with any wiring the amp you had in there is probably bad but if you want to try it in his to be sure it wont hurt. |
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Bronze Member Username: Nina08Post Number: 22 Registered: Sep-08 | Are their people i can bring or send it to to fix it? |
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Platinum Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 10455 Registered: Jun-04 | You can check with hifonics and see what they charge. |
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New member Username: Tymyshoe32Post Number: 1 Registered: Oct-08 | i have been reading everything you guys have said. i have the same exact problem. i have two 12" duals and a 1200 watt hifonics amp(same one as the one in the pictures). could it be blown speakers causing the auto-protect to cut off my subs or is it most likely a defective amp. i have tried two sets of the same subs and the same thing happens. everytime it gets too loud they cut off. i think im just gonna buy a new 600 watt amp and two 6" two way speakers. any suggestions cheap suggestions? |
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New member Username: Tymyshoe32Post Number: 2 Registered: Oct-08 | i have been reading everything you guys have said. i have the same exact problem. i have two 12" duals and a 1200 watt hifonics amp(same one as the one in the pictures). could it be blown speakers causing the auto-protect to cut off my subs or is it most likely a defective amp. i have tried two sets of the same subs and the same thing happens. everytime it gets too loud they cut off. i have had people tell me it may be my battery, a blown fuse(which i checked at car toys and they said it was fine), a short, bad wiring, and one that my amp was getting too hot from the sun. i think im just gonna buy a new 600 watt amp and two 6" two way speakers. think that would cure my problem. if i do should i just keep the normal settings that the amp came with? any cheap suggestions? |
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