What capacitor to get?
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New member Username: AudiosaabPost Number: 3 Registered: Nov-07 | hey all, im making a new setup for my subwoofers in my car...ive recently purchased a fiberglass sealed enclosure to house 2 12" subwoofers (Alpine Type R) and was wondering what capacitor i should get if im trying to set one up... not sure what amps im getting yet but ive added that question to the other forums... |
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Gold Member Username: CarguyPost Number: 6572 Registered: Nov-04 | Use the 1F for every 1000w of peak power as a guide. Therefore, 2000w = 2F cap. |
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Bronze Member Username: AudiosaabPost Number: 13 Registered: Nov-07 | alright thanks that actually helps alot |
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Silver Member Username: Wylie_coyotePost Number: 111 Registered: Apr-07 | yeah man, that really does. i've always looked at threads like this and its all so mathematical. at least this little rule i will actually remember |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3690 Registered: Jul-06 | Heres an even simpler rule: you don't need a capacitor |
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Silver Member Username: Wylie_coyotePost Number: 113 Registered: Apr-07 | yeah i've already learnt that one from this forum, i know it like the back of my hands |
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Bronze Member Username: 94_toyPost Number: 83 Registered: Sep-07 | you dont need a cap, there uselesss |
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Gold Member Username: CarguyPost Number: 6576 Registered: Nov-04 | I beg to differ. If you install and use it properly, it has it's benefits. Before you believe what "everyone" says, test one out for yourself. As I have mentioned numerous times in the past, no electronic component is "useless". If that were the case, they would never have been created. Of course you can be biased towards testing. It can be made so that the caps "appear" useless. It can also be put under the right condition where it can perform as designed. So before you say something's "garbage" or "useless", know the facts. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3714 Registered: Jul-06 | I have tested one on my own system and it made no difference. Electrical system is a 200 amp alt and Odyssey 1500 battery. AndI have yet to see someone else with a good electrical system be helped by one. In other words, I haven't seen a case where using a capacitor works better than just using a good battery. |
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Gold Member Username: CarguyPost Number: 6579 Registered: Nov-04 | Precisely the point. Capacitors were designed to achieve certain goals. If your "test" environment is set up in such a way, that caps aren't needed, then you'll conclude that they're "useless". However, as I mentioned, they were designed to accomplish certain tasks. Whether they're utilized properly or not is up to the individuals. If you take your setup for example, and sub 50A alternator, 2000w amp, and blast it with long bass notes. It'll not only render caps useless, but it will appear as if it was adding to the problem. Under this condition, you'd conclude caps as "garbage". This is why I said caps have to be used as "designed" and properly. You can't abuse something and say it's not performing. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3719 Registered: Jul-06 | Ok then, what situations WOULD you use a capacitor in? And why would you not just use a better battery instead. |
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Gold Member Username: CarguyPost Number: 6581 Registered: Nov-04 | M.S. do you have some electronic background? You can easily simulate an environment where the benefits of caps can be expressed. Just as easily as you can render it "useless". Do a detailed research on batteries, alternator first, then capacitor. Once you have that, the answer you're seeking should come to fruit. When I say details, I mean real details as in how it's made/designed, and how it functions in a circuit. Electronics and mathematics go hand in hand. So not only should it make sense logically, it should also add up. |
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Bronze Member Username: AudiosaabPotomac, MD Post Number: 43 Registered: Nov-07 | Why have you guys taken a thread i created, which btw was not to argue capacitors it was to ask if i was going to get one what should i do for it.....and then turned it into a war zone like every other thread on caps....everyones got an opinion on caps but that dosen't mean you have to fight to get it across... |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3726 Registered: Jul-06 | Yes, I do have quite a bit of background in electronics. I know the function a capacitor in electronic devices. What I have not seen proven is a benefit from the very large 1F+ capacitors made for car audio. Amplifiers have some amount of capacitance built in, which seems to be enough. I've seen many people with stock electrical systems try using capacitors with no benefit, as you said it can even seem to make the problem worse. And you agreed that a capacitor would not help a good electrical system like mine. So what I was asking was, when would you want to use one? |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3727 Registered: Jul-06 | Mike your thread actually seems to have spawned an interesting debate on this topic, I wouldn't call it a war zone. I really am interested to hear what Issac has to say. |
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Bronze Member Username: AudiosaabPotomac, MD Post Number: 49 Registered: Nov-07 | k lets just try and be friends afterwards eh? :D |
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Gold Member Username: Nyyfan13Fi SSD USA Post Number: 6885 Registered: Jul-06 | stick aroud a little bit mike and you'll learn that threads like these will be the most informational when their done |
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Gold Member Username: CarguyPost Number: 6585 Registered: Nov-04 | Mike, there's no fighting on here. I haven't had one for a long time and probably never will. Unlike some people, if I disagree with something, I try to do it in a respectful manner. It's too easy to call someone an "idiot" or "stupid". Anyhow, capacitors were designed for a specific purpose, and if utilized, it will perform. I don't ever recall seeing an electronic piece that were "garbage" or "useless". Caps are great filters, especially since the rectifiers on the alternators are not perfect. They also can reduce voltage rails/spikes and reduce propagation delays in current supply/demand. Theoretically, since caps can release stored energy at a faster rate than a battery and alternator, it's suppose to be able to keep up with current demands of an amp. Proving in the real world is much tougher cause music is dynamic. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3742 Registered: Jul-06 | Well, until I see/hear an example of a system where a capacitor produced a beneficial effect that wouldn't also be achieved by upgrading the rest of the electrical system, my conclusion is that they are unnecessary. |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5641 Registered: Jul-06 | Just like Isaac said,they have their uses.They make solid filters in your current supply to your amplifiers.Sort of how a UPS kicks in when the power surges through your house,it kicks in after doing nothing but storing energy for when it notices a drop in voltage.Capacitors work in a similar way. |
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Platinum Member Username: GlasswolfWisteria, Lane USA Post Number: 12078 Registered: Dec-03 | a capacitor works as an AC ripple filter just fine, but what it won't do, which it's often misleadingly advertised for, is boost current or voltage when the alternator is overtaxed. a capacitor's voltage follows the circuit voltage. when the circuit voltage drops, so does the capacitor's. if you think the cap will take the place of an upgraded charging system, you're mistaken. end of story. |
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New member Username: JohndunnPost Number: 2 Registered: Nov-07 | hey, i've got 2 12 inch 800 watt clif design subs, and 2 12 inch 1000 watt DHD subs, i want to put them in my s10, i was looking at 2 4000 watt legacy amps, big wattage for when i upgrade. what kind of capacitor(s) should i get and what size? thanks |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3861 Registered: Jul-06 | ^^^^^ LMAO  |
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Gold Member Username: CarguyPost Number: 6607 Registered: Nov-04 | Since Legacy amps are as good as Pyramids, you'll need .01uF cap and maybe a bicycle generator. |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5679 Registered: Jul-06 | "cap and maybe a bicycle generator." Nah,you wouldn't need that much Isaac.A mouse running inside a wheel will do just fine for a generator to support that system. |
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New member Username: Mastersatan78Daytona beach, Fl Usa Post Number: 9 Registered: Nov-07 | this is my sys. and i run a stock alt. 4 15" soundstream xxx subs,4 soundstream xxx-10,000d 10,000 watt amps 4 6x8 pioneer door spk. 2 infinity 475a amps. 4 2" insignia tweets and 4 Soundstream SC-40CA caps 40.0 Farad Power Capacitor and 8 xcap bats. before i added the cap my charge sys. would drain when the bass hit. it all depends on the use and the set up and if the cap is charged right. you have to charge to caps first. |
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Platinum Member Username: GlasswolfWisteria, Lane USA Post Number: 12099 Registered: Dec-03 | capacitors don't do anything but mask the symptoms of the problem. read these: http://www.bcae1.com/capacitr.htm http://www.glasswolf.net/caraudio/capacitors.html http://www.glasswolf.net/caraudio/charging.html http://www.betteraudio.com/geolemon/newmain/battcapalt/ http://www.bcae1.com/charging.htm http://www.bcae1.com/chargin2.htm http://www.bcae1.com/battiso.htm http://www.glasswolf.net/caraudio/batteries.html http://www.the12volt.com/info/recwirsz.asp |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5903 Registered: Jul-06 | "this is my sys. and i run a stock alt. 4 15" soundstream xxx subs,4 soundstream xxx-10,000d 10,000 watt amps 4 6x8 pioneer door spk. 2 infinity 475a amps. 4 2" insignia tweets and 4 Soundstream SC-40CA caps 40.0 Farad Power Capacitor and 8 xcap bats. before i added the cap my charge sys. would drain when the bass hit. it all depends on the use and the set up and if the cap is charged right. you have to charge to caps first." Get us some pictures of that system. |
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