The Amps
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 23 Registered: Dec-06 | As some of you I'm putting together an A/V system for my vehicle (Expedition '07) and now that I've chosen the actual speakers and subs (4 IDMAX12D4 subs, 2 sets of focal F165K3P UV components) I'm wondering what amps would be good to power those. For the subs the manufacturers recommend 200-1000 watts for each subs, and for the components 200-400 watts is the recommendation. Thanks in advance for helping me choose the right amps. Ask questions if needed! |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1797 Registered: Aug-05 | Hrmmmm, what do you think for the subs guys? A couple of Orion 2500D's? You could wire 2 of the ID's to 1 ohm, supplying 2500W RMS to them both (~1250W RMS/sub), giving some headroom in wattage, and then do the same with the other two subs to the other amp. Just remember, with all of this, you'll need a beefy H/O alt. |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1801 Registered: Aug-05 | Oh and after this insanely amazing system is complete, you need to come pick up all of us who've helped for a joy ride lol  . |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 24 Registered: Dec-06 | Well, I suppose I should start taking a good look at some amps. Do you realize how loud that would be? Those subs have a sensitivity of ~95dB SPL. Well, thanks very much guys. I'm new to this and I'm not sure what amps are good and brands and all that. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 25 Registered: Dec-06 | Lol I don't know I'd have to drive like 2000 miles  |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8547 Registered: Dec-04 | I would look into more like 2 kicker 1500's or zapco whatever models. I would give them 750/piece. Are you running them sealed? if yes in small sealed enclosures you can give a little more but for a SQ application I would give them 750/piece. |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1802 Registered: Aug-05 | Haha, James just has to show up and show ME up all the time with his undying knowledge . J/k j/k. I'm pretty sure in his posts in the sub. threads he said he was going for SQL. Would that change anything? |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1804 Registered: Aug-05 | I'm getting the feeling though, when he's watching Pirates 2 while driving, he wants the entire neighborhood to know it! |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 27 Registered: Dec-06 | Yeah guys SQL don't forget. Also don't forget the subs are all dual 4 ohm and the components are 6 ohm. Thanks again! I'm just not quite sure since if you don't get the right amp, from what I've read it can seriously mess up the sound quality! |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8549 Registered: Dec-04 | thats true and false! so if you run one amp and you are going ported or small sealed you will need something around 3000-4000 watts at 2 ohms. If you run 2 amps you can wire each pair to a 1 ohm load and look into 2 1500-2000 watt amps at 1 ohm. With those subs and components you are going to want to get a good amp which I am sure you are well aware of. If I had that set up I would get 2 zapco c2k 9.0's and run each stereo at 2 ohms 1100 watts whats the rms on those components? |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8551 Registered: Dec-04 | damn that wouldnt work !!!!!! bridge each pair at 4 ohms 2200x1 to each |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 28 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok I didn't quite understand that (probably because I don't know Ohm's law too well). The Rms is 200 watts on all the components lol  . I'll take a look at the amps now. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 29 Registered: Dec-06 | Oh ok that makes more sense |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8553 Registered: Dec-04 | I would run a zapco c2K 4.0 on your components and 2 C2K 9.0's on your subs. That would be VERY VERY VERY nice Those subs demand the best Zapco is the way to go. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 30 Registered: Dec-06 | Let me take a good look at those then |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8555 Registered: Dec-04 | you wont be dissapointed |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 31 Registered: Dec-06 | Wow you're right those are some nice amps! The specs are awesome and everything! I think I'll go with those! That is some (sorry I don't curse, cuss, swear). Those amps are perfect for this application! Are you sure I shouldn't get two 4.0s bridged to give the components the power they deserve? |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8558 Registered: Dec-04 | they are rated at 12 volts so you will get the right amount of power. I wouldnt go ported with only that 1 set of components because the bass will deff drown out the mids. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 32 Registered: Dec-06 | It's 2 sets of components |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8560 Registered: Dec-04 | ohh then yes get 2 4.0s you are going to need one hell of a charging system man. I hope you have that all maped out already. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 33 Registered: Dec-06 | Yeah, of course I've been taking a good look at the power requirements! I'm still figuring how much power all that will require though. I'm still working on that. I think you can ramp up the voltage to like 20 volts idle. I'm not sure if that damages anything though. ANYWAY! What about a head unit? We've got the speakers, subs and amps picked out now. We have to have a preamp or something right? I'm not sure because it is a video system and there will also be monitors and stuff to decide on AND A GOOD SECURITY SYSTEM. There's going to be so much I can't forget about. But, let's just try and find the right head unit or whatever I need for now to handle all that stuff . Thanks everyone for yor help! |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8562 Registered: Dec-04 | any budget? do you want a screen up front as your deck? I reccomend alpine F1 status but they are expensive but they are the best. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8563 Registered: Dec-04 | you would have to do some modding to the amps to get them to accept that type of voltage. I would reccomend 2 200amp alts with a kinetic battery in the back. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8564 Registered: Dec-04 | you are pushing toward my dream system here now bud |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 34 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok, remember how in the sub thread I decided to make up the system and if it turns out to be more than I afford then I'll back off a little? It's still that way. I don't know much about alternators and also how many watts equals what amperage and whatever a kinetic batter is? Well anyway, I'm not too sure of the options out there, but I'm sure you can help me out bud. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8565 Registered: Dec-04 | yup I can help you out. A good way to get a rough estimate on amperage needed is to take the number of watts and divide by 10. so 4000 watts 400 amps. Thats not exact but to find out more visit www.bcae1.com for all your equasion needs. I am going to bed but I will post back in the morning if you have any questions. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 35 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok thanks! I'll keep looking around. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8566 Registered: Dec-04 | all good |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 36 Registered: Dec-06 | I did a lot of reading on that and I think that Alpine 9990 mixed with their Multichannel processor will provide what I'm looking for and will maximize the potential of the system. It plays anything basically that a Dvd audio/video player will play in a home theater system. It also has the features of a good home theater receiver and a 31 band equalizer. I will definitely have control over my music and movies, and in surround sound I'm very impressed with that head unit! All that's left is the in-dash screen for the videos and that's also taken care of with Alpine's in-dash screen. Now all we need to figure out is the charging system, fuses, batteries?, cabling, and all that. Thanks for your help, again! Am I forgetting anything? |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8569 Registered: Dec-04 | ok as far as charging it depends on whaat you want to get into. I personally would run aa dual alternator set-up with a kinetic under the hood and one in the back. go to www.excessiveamperage.com nate will be able to help you out there. As far as fuses you wont know that untill you buy the amps you will be running. You take the number in amps each amps fuses are and add them together then use that size for an inline fuse. Wiring just go to knuconcept.com. that HU is a nice absolutely top notch you will also need to upgrade what is called "The Big 3" it is your battery to ground connection to 0ga wire, along with your alt to engine, and engine to chassis. man I am soooooo jelous you are going to make me do something crazy just talking about this |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 38 Registered: Dec-06 | I did some calculations and the calc says it'll take about 600 amps for the amps at 15 volts running a test tone at maximum RMS wattage. I just learned that those amps have a regulated power supply, so adding more voltage on the charging system doesn't increase their output much(a few watts for a few volts). That's not even considering the processors and the head unit, video display, and all that as well as the other electronics in the vehicle. Thanks again! Also, would it be better to use dual 2 ohms instead of 4 since I could then give each subwoofer it's own channel of amplification at 1100/Rms? Well I hope I'm not forgetting much in the way of charging system, cabling...Oh yeah the security system must keep the vehicle from getting stolen, good investment. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 39 Registered: Dec-06 | Oh! Thanks man. I'll look into the excessive amperage. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 41 Registered: Dec-06 | Well, I'm going to go make a few calls to a few shops around town and then go to sleep since I was up all night and hopefully wake up before 2007. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8575 Registered: Dec-04 | cool man good luck with that! |
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Silver Member Username: LoudonPost Number: 702 Registered: Jun-04 | umm good luck spending about 5000 dollars but in the end will be heavenly |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8577 Registered: Dec-04 | yup mucho dinero and yes it sure will sound AMAZING |
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New member Username: MisifusPost Number: 2 Registered: Dec-06 | HI.. COULD ANYONE HELP ME??... I BOUGHT A CAR AND IN THE TRUNK CAME AN CUSPID USA AMP.. ARE THEY ANY GOOD?? ..DOESN'T LOOK SO GOOD BUT IT'S NOT CONECTED AND I DONT WANT TO PAY TO GET INSTALL AND THEN FIND OUT IT SOUNDS LIKE CRAP |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 42 Registered: Dec-06 | I found a good deal on the head unit, monitor, processor, and manager, so I was able to get costs on it down to about $4000 which I'm very happy about Now I can afford a much better charging system and cabling and accessories ! I also have a relative that works in the auto business and he can get me 2 high performance 300 amp alternators for the price of one since he works in the business, so that'll help my budget. All that's left now is cabling and all those accessories, which I'll look into right now. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8594 Registered: Dec-04 | damn man that is going to sound AMAZING if tyhe install is good. I wouldnt let just anyone do that install I would look for reference's get someone good, seriously! |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 52 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok! OK! But first I think I need to make sure that everything is what it should be and make sure I've made the right choice. Since the surround processor I'm getting is a 16.2 channel I can always upgrade later, which is good. I decided not to get a home theater in my house for a little while so that I can make the car better because I'm really intrigued by the car thing since people spend a lot of their time in their cars. Any suggestions to improve the sound? Well, I think I should put the rest into a car SECURITY SYSTEM. With a system like that in there...man I think it's required to to have a GOOD security system to avoid break-ins. Any suggestions on a good security system? I'm also wondering if different cable brands or types will be better. I'm running S-video for the video monitors, optical cables for the audio feeds to the head unit and processors, the Symbilink Balanced system from Zapco which is Anti-hum so I don't get any hums anywhere. Everything will be shielded. The Head Unit's final output will be 16 volts once it reaches all the amps. I just need to order it I think. Zapco has special in line processors that will tune the signal before it reaches the amps and everything will be good from there! I just need to order it! Thanks a lot for your help again! |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8606 Registered: Dec-04 | dude you sound like you have it all under control Honestly the only change I would make is on the components. I would go with either Seas,Morel,or Dynaudio but thats me. As far as security there are many out there Alpine makes a good one. As far as cables you have it under control man. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 53 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok I'll take a look at those other components first before I make the final decision! Well Off I go. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 54 Registered: Dec-06 | After looking at those I've decided I still like the focals since I think they'll make a good combination with the IDMAXes. However I think it might be a good idea to add one more pair of components and an an amp in for 6.1 surround...I don't know if that'd be a good idea or not though. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 55 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok I've been looking at some car security systems and decided the type I want is a quintuple horn system that when the alarm actually goes off, it can hit volumes over 130 dB, that should definitely call attention to the car, and hurt the thief's ears. I'm still looking at different types thought, so I'm going to get back to looking. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 56 Registered: Dec-06 | I think a good car system with all the things (motion sensors, glass break detection, tracking, remote start, other remote control, 2000' range, etc) that come with a high-end car system will provide protection enough for me. I also think it'd be a good idea to fit Ulta-Powerful add-on sirens to the main system in order to create an extreme burst of alarm power with a bunch of beeps, warnings, grinding noises, and whatever else will be good, plus the most extreme legal window tint I can get. I think if I get like 7 alarms under the hood and like 13 others hidden around the car with high power provided for maximum SPL output that would be able to help keep thiefs away. I'm guessing it could be made so that it hits up to 120 dB+. It'd be funny if I could put a Chrysler Air Raid siren on the car. It's so loud it can be heard up 50 miles away with the right conditions, 50! It was measured at over 140 dB at 100 feet away! I mean come on! I bet right at the siren it was like 180 or 190 dB, crazy. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 57 Registered: Dec-06 | What's really cool about the head unit is, if you play a track that is just digital silence on a cd, but turn it up really, really loud, it'll actually use the speakers heavily by using them to cancel the noise from outside. Basically if you have everything turned all the way up playing digital silence the speakers and subs might be playing silence, making it quiet in the car. It's confusing, since they're not just using phase, they're using other things as well. Well thanks again guys. I'm going to order probably this week and let it be professionally installed so that it looks AND sounds professional. Amp racks and everything, I think. |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8609 Registered: Dec-04 | nice man as FAR AS 10 -20 sirens go that is up to you lolol the focal's are great components so you can't go wrong with them. Under no circumstances would I give the dealer who you are having install this your home address for anything, thats how 75% of systems get stolen. |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1821 Registered: Aug-05 | OK DAMNIT STOP WITH THE SMILING! J/k guys, but people might start thinking you're flirting with each other over CAR AUDIO!!! Hahahahahahaha! |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 59 Registered: Dec-06 | Well I'm going to take one last look before I order anything. I'll probably start with the source to speaker, making sure I have everything I need to maximise/ze it's potential |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 60 Registered: Dec-06 | Lol I didn't see that. I didn't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !POWERSMILE |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8611 Registered: Dec-04 | Tyler is just jelous lol |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1822 Registered: Aug-05 | LMFAO! Yep, totally jealous of the BENDMEOVER club ;). J/k guys. Although I am slowly getting jealous of this amazing system! |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 64 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok, I've got the kinks worked out. Should I order it all now?? |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8621 Registered: Dec-04 | absolutely! |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 65 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok I'm going to order it all and let you know once it's all here. I'll then take it straight to the installer, and have the security system, alternator installed, and windows tinted beforehand. It's all planned out I can't wait. Well, see ya later, I'm outta here. |
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Gold Member Username: TdbdadrummerWellsburg, WV USA Post Number: 1836 Registered: Aug-05 | Oh yea, guys did he mention!?!? He ordered double everything so I could have the exact same setup!!! Isn't that TRIPPY!? Hehe, j/k j/k. |
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Bronze Member Username: ThecryptPost Number: 67 Registered: Dec-06 | Ok I expect the Alpine Sources, Processors, and the head unit to arrive tomorrow morning. I'm busy, I need to head off to a business meeting. The Christmas season has come to end for me here, so back to business. Bye! |
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Gold Member Username: James1115Use a simple... Post Number: 8625 Registered: Dec-04 | good luck buddy |
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Silver Member Username: Arande2400dB could probably d..., 4000 isnt ev... 100,000dB FU... Post Number: 572 Registered: Dec-06 | My vehicle is in the shop and I'll get it back next week they said. They better get it right I can't wait. |
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Silver Member Username: Arande2400dB could probably d..., 4000 isnt ev... 100,000dB FU... Post Number: 573 Registered: Dec-06 | =P Lol. I see my thread over in the sub forum got hijacked. |
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