Eq needed with utopia's?
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 2 Registered: Oct-06 | I have a 04 f-350 crew cab. My system is an Alpine cda-9830 into a diamond audio d7152 driving focal utopia 165w's, and a rockford p600.1bd into 2 infinity reference 12's sealed. previous to the utopias, i had some cheap boston components and some infinity kappa components. all, including the focals have a peak around 2k in this truck. is there something installwise i can do for this? Also the alpine is not the easiest to get deep inside, i.e. time delay and user eq settings. It's seems like I have to change both every time I change an album. the time delay being the worst. the staging and imaging can go from good to bad like that. i am wondering if i should run the hu on defeat into a parametric eq within my reach or maybe i am being too picky. any help or suggestions would be appreciated. thanks, jason |
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Silver Member Username: BobimpactDanbury, CT US Post Number: 191 Registered: May-06 | Sounds like you're a victim of small field accoustics, but first things first, where are the tweeters installed? |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassCork, Cork Ireland Post Number: 281 Registered: May-06 | Your HU is good, DA amp is good too, hmm, don't know, you really should not have to adjust the time correction every time you change a CD. Mids and tweets could be out of phase? Where are those utopias located? |
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Silver Member Username: BobimpactDanbury, CT US Post Number: 193 Registered: May-06 | Time correction is the b*stard child of small field accoustics. Because instruments are phase located on a CD it's entirely possible that staging will be damaged by TA'ing a vehicle. I would recommend that you try to reinstall the speakers (tweeters specifically) in a manner that is more conducive to proper imaging. By Ta'ing it you may be damaging the sound, and by TA'ing a LOT you are definetly messing with the accoustics of the environment. |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 4 Registered: Oct-06 | tweeters are in the pillars about ear level facing in towards the center of the windshield, with the waveguides at about 2 and 8 o'clock. the are mounted in angle mount cups because i was scared to cut the metal under the plastic. i mounted tweets there on advide from a couple car audio shops after i tried other recommended spots on the dash. i don't know if the location is fine tuned, but it's not harsh like the others were, or i could hear the individual tweeters instead of them blending into the sound. up for any suggestions. thanks |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 5 Registered: Oct-06 | the mids are in the doors in the factory spots with speaker size adapters and 1" spacers. i used dynamat in the speaker area over the adapter plate. would stuffing the inside of the door with polyfill or lining it with dynamat help? |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassCork, Cork Ireland Post Number: 301 Registered: May-06 | Hmm, I had the same kind of set up in the Integra, mids in factory locations and tweets in the pillars (firing towards the sunroof). The speakers that I used were Morel Hybrid Ovation. As far as timing, I only delayed the front so the sub wave would get there in time, but as far as left/right time correction - I didn't adjust anything. The system sounded very good, however, next one is gonna be powered with separate amps: one amp for tweets and another amp for the mids. With a nice unit like CDA 7998 I will be able to play around with tweet vs mid timing to get those boys in a perfect phase As far as the Focals go, well just yesterday I was in shop here in Cork - Secure Sounds, they have just picked up the Focal line, didn't have any Utopias hooked up, however, I did get to hear K2P's powered by a Focal amp, honestly, I was impressed with the level of detail, but I am 100% positive that if I cranked them in a car for about 1/2 hour, my ears would get VERY tired, because of the metal tweets. That shop also does it the same way - tweets in the pillars and mids in the factory. The guy was saying that Focals are VERY transparent and so on, tweets and mids blend nicely together blah, blah, blah. Well maybe metal domes are ment to be installed somewhere far away from ears like kick panels? You could give it a shot, I think metal doesn't work as nice when it's so close to your left ear LOL . I say try the kicks and see where it takes you, I think it would sound better. Good luck |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 6 Registered: Oct-06 | thanks for your responses. I really don't want to put the tweets in the kick panels mainly because I'm a rigwelder and outside jobs have mud, sometimes lots of mud, and I would be extremely upset if i drug my muddy boot accross the tweeter filling it with mud. I'm actually pretty happy with the highs. I have Infinity Reference Standard 2.5 speaqkers at home, which have 2 EMIT apiece and 2 EMIM (ribbon mids). They are pretty accurate, to say the least, and fed by my bryston preamp, are very smooth. I listened the other night to some music on the infinities and took the disc to the truck the next morning to see how the focals compared. Pretty darn good, for car speakers. I picked music that has different cymbals, bells, chimes, etc. The focals played the sounds accurately and cleanly. I think that the mids are projecting reflected sound inside the door or the mids are too close to parallel to each other, like i need to angle them one way or the other, or put a console between the dash and the seat to have a barrier to stop the sound waves. I am going to dynamat and polyfill the inside of the door and dynamat the rest of the door that hasn't been done already. the time correction I am not going to worry about until i can get the tone i am after. |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 7 Registered: Oct-06 | the reason i say these things is that, like I said, this is the third set of components i have had in this truck, tweeters in different locations every time. and every time the mids are way too bright. that is what makes me think it is something with the acoustical environment of the truck. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassCork, Cork Ireland Post Number: 311 Registered: May-06 | Hmm, maybe it's the Diamond amp that's doing it. Well, try cranking some piano tunes on those Focals and I am pretty sure that at the mid and tweet x-over point it will sound too bright. Man I hate mids that are too bright |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 8 Registered: Oct-06 | i installed dynaxorb over the weekend, and then a local audio shop ended up having focal plain-chant in stock. the dynaxorb worked okay, but the plain chant is better. it is wider and taller since there are four pieces per side. they absorb the back sound wave killing a lot of distortion that is present without them. I'm very pleased with the difference in sound. now i wonder if i should upgrade the HU to an older sony es or something of that quality. i don't know if i would gain anything or not. will have to do some more research. maybe i should try a different amp for the front, but the diamond is supposed to be a reference standard amplifier, and i don't know if i would be willing to spend more for something else. maybe mcintosh HU and amp sometime in the future. |
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Silver Member Username: BobimpactDanbury, CT US Post Number: 198 Registered: May-06 | You may want to consider varying the angle of the tweeter very slightly, the Focal Inverted Dome is meant to be fairly directional, if it's hitting you at an odd angle it could be causing the issue. Check out Focal's Dual Monitor amp, beautiful piece. |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 9 Registered: Oct-06 | the tweeters fire towards the windshield, so is there anything other than an odd angle? the other problem i have is that i had to use the surface mount cups which are angled. so you can't have any combination of rotation you want and the correct angle at the same time. i tried to position them firing at the center of the windshield and level (plumb) i don't have any fiberglass experience to fab some pods to flush mount them at the perfect spot. Bob, do you install the tweeters facing the listener or the windshield? p.s. speaking of tweeter angle and position, i'm wondering how do you tell what you have to do or do you just guess until it sounds right? thanks. |
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New member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 10 Registered: Oct-06 | the tweeters fire towards the windshield, so is there anything other than an odd angle? the other problem i have is that i had to use the surface mount cups which are angled. so you can't have any combination of rotation you want and the correct angle at the same time. i tried to position them firing at the center of the windshield and level (plumb)they are at ear level. i don't have any fiberglass experience to fab some pods to flush mount them at the perfect spot. Bob, do you install the tweeters facing the listener or the windshield? does it sound like i have the right general area or do i need to start over and drill more holes. my biggest problem this week is that when i picked up the plain chant, i listened to a 50k+ mcintosh system that sounded better than anything i have ever heard. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 11 Registered: Oct-06 | the tweeters fire towards the windshield, so is there anything other than an odd angle? the other problem i have is that i had to use the surface mount cups which are angled. so you can't have any combination of rotation you want and the correct angle at the same time. i tried to position them firing at the center of the windshield and level (plumb)they are at ear level. i don't have any fiberglass experience to fab some pods to flush mount them at the perfect spot. Bob, do you install the tweeters facing the listener or the windshield? does it sound like i have the right general area or do i need to start over and drill more holes. my biggest problem this week is that when i picked up the plain chant, i listened to a 50k+ mcintosh system that sounded better than anything i have ever heard. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 12 Registered: Oct-06 | the tweeters fire towards the windshield, so is there anything other than an odd angle? the other problem i have is that i had to use the surface mount cups which are angled. so you can't have any combination of rotation you want and the correct angle at the same time. i tried to position them firing at the center of the windshield and level (plumb)they are at ear level. i don't have any fiberglass experience to fab some pods to flush mount them at the perfect spot. Bob, do you install the tweeters facing the listener or the windshield? does it sound like i have the right general area or do i need to start over and drill more holes. my biggest problem this week is that when i picked up the plain chant, i listened to a 50k+ mcintosh system that sounded better than anything i have ever heard. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 13 Registered: Oct-06 | the tweeters fire towards the windshield, so is there anything other than an odd angle? the other problem i have is that i had to use the surface mount cups which are angled. so you can't have any combination of rotation you want and the correct angle at the same time. i tried to position them firing at the center of the windshield and level (plumb)they are at ear level. i don't have any fiberglass experience to fab some pods to flush mount them at the perfect spot. Bob, do you install the tweeters facing the listener or the windshield? does it sound like i have the right general area or do i need to start over and drill more holes. my biggest problem this week is that when i picked up the plain chant, i listened to a 50k+ mcintosh system that sounded better than anything i have ever heard. |
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Silver Member Username: BobimpactDanbury, CT US Post Number: 207 Registered: May-06 | I don't like the idea of those super bright, super directional tweeters being up that high, I almost always go as low in the door as possible with anything Focal. There should be almost nothing out there that can touch those Utopia's, you may need to seek out a really good professional. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassCork, Cork Ireland Post Number: 337 Registered: May-06 | Well, we also should not forget about the mid/tweet timing, that's why I like to biamp, cause then it's possible to do that timing to them in phase. As far as direction - I have even fired tweets against the windshield directly opposite the center of the car, depends on acoustics. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 14 Registered: Oct-06 | bob, are you telling me the utopias should match a $50,000 mcintosh home system? at 50k, that is two speakers, two amps, a preamp, and a turntable. i just don't see ever having the space, the size of the sound stage in a car compared to a 500 sq.ft. room. i grew up as a saxaphone player and played in 80+ piece bands regularly, and i don't think you can replicate that kind of sound in a car. i don't mean the tonal accuracy, but the weight, the size, the subtle things happening as well as the larger ones. i have never heard any system, home or car, that can come close to that. but home systems have been better at producing a stage that can compare in height, width, and depth. i started out with the tweeters in the doors, and hated it. of course, that was before the plain-chant, which i highly recommend. the set of utopias i bought at car toys didn't come with an instruction manual, but a friend of mine that has both a set of utopias and a set of k2p's let me borrow his manual. focal recommends having the tweeter on the dash, on the panel opposite your side mirrors, on the pillars, etc. they recommend having it high. both my friends trucks have the tweeters facing him on the pillars. one truck has factory tweeter spots that he used for this. they seem a little too harsh for me, but him and i have different tastes in treble. my system is more laid back on top with strong mids and midbass. some say the focals don't have much midbass. i think you have to start with your amp's crossover then your speakers crossover and the installation and you can have good midbass. there are times i turn the subs off just too get the speed with the utopias, and they still have good output down to around 65 hz, where i have the xover on the diamond set. i have the x-over set at -4 for tweets and mids. with most music, i have the alpine's eq flat for bands 2,3, and 4, which is about 100hz and up. i also have the time correction at 0. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 15 Registered: Oct-06 | p.s. if i had know it was posting when it said error, i wouldn't have sent the same post 4 times. oops |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 16 Registered: Oct-06 | maris, i was rereading the thread and i have to ask some questions. i am wondering if you could give a crash course on phase. i understand that there are 360 degrees, and that depending on your crossover slope, the separates could be in or out of phase. how do you adjust those things without a hu like you were talking about? i know nothing about this thanks |
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Silver Member Username: BobimpactDanbury, CT US Post Number: 215 Registered: May-06 | Focal makes home components too, not only that, they sell a Utopia line in home. Imagine that, Bob knows what he's talking about. Phase can go on a continuum fro 0 to 360 degrees, and most sound systems have at least one component are out of phase in relation to another one. This essentially means that the two sound waves are not positively couple throughout the entire run of the sound field. While most people speak about "out of phase" as a mechanical flop (180 degrees) or a negative coupling there is often confusion about what the term really means. Out of phase means anything within the continuum from 1 to 359 degrees, and is not always a bad thing. CDs are recorded with this in mind, in that by changing the phasing of certain sounds the "location" of that sound can be changed psychoacoustically. This means, in essense that sweeping changes to slopes and equalizers can change the phase location enough to cause a negative coupling in a certain location of the sound field. The other way to change phase easily is to move a driver. This is why many long time car stereo guys hate tweeters being up high, it makes phasing the sound field appropriately more difficult than it needs to be. Technically speaking coax arrangements are proper as the tweeter is reproducing same channel of audio, therefore the sound paths of the two drivers should be the same. This being said, being perfectly in phase is nearly impossible in any sound field, and even more so in such a short field as a car, this is why many installers will attempt to RTA out a good enough sound to keep themselves sane, and the customer happy. Even 180 degree phase reversals are not always bad, as if the cancellation occurs in an opportune spot it can result in better imaging. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 17 Registered: Oct-06 | Bob, do you happen to know anyone good in the colorado area? the people i talk to at the local audio shops are mostly clowns and i wouldn't trust them to do any better than me if not worse. i will concede that i know what my ears like, but with this truck and these speakers, i don't know that i'm getting the best out of it and don't understand things like phase, and other finer points to get the optimal sound quality. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 18 Registered: Oct-06 | bob, i didn't imply that you don't know what you are talking about. i have read alot of posts on related and unrelated items in the last few weeks and alot of educational answers are penned by you. focal's home line i would love to hear, especially the grand utopia. i don't know if they are currently producing that one or not. seems like the last time i was on the website it only listed small floorstanders. the reviews i have read of the grand say it is one of finest in the world. as you would expect from focal and approx. $85,000. if i could get the sound i get from my home speakers in my vehicle, i would be more than happy. which is to say, i would be willing to try. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 19 Registered: Oct-06 | so, low in the doors facing the opposite passenger's head? how low? forward of the mid or back? in the truck the mid is pretty far forward, and a little low, not as low as the 6x9 holes in older trucks but lower than a new dodge and way lower than my wife's intrepid, which i put the old bostons in tonight. she had blown a factory tweeter. the bostons sounded good in my old chevy truck with factory component locations in the door, and they sound good in my wife's car. they just sounded like sh*t in my ford. i just have a rf punch150s on them, and using the stock head unit for looks into a converter. she's happy, which is good for me. put the tweeters right next to the mid under the factory grill. thought i would try that instead of the factory tweeter locations up high. i like it in her car. maybe i need to try the old spot again on my truck. they were a little above and back of the mids before facing the opposite passenger. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassCork, Co.Cork Ireland Post Number: 348 Registered: May-06 | Sorry, been away for a while. "Even 180 degree phase reversals are not always bad", well the thing is - thats what they usually are (if they are needed), I have never seen anybody do say 30 degree phase correction. Jason, phase issue is a fairly simple thing - all it (usually) is that 2 drivers that are producing the same frequency waves (like mid and tweet at the x-over point) are installed out of phase. Well to get them in exact same phase is not that easy, however, the main thing would be for them not to cause wave cancelations at the xo point and that would occur if the phase difference was 180degrees. If it's more or less than 180 degrees it will simply mess with your stage and image. Well, regarding the tweets in the kicks - have them a little behind the mids, well, but that's just my preference. Well, Bob is absolutely right regarding the old school installers - it really is easier to get it phase correct by simply moving the tweets around. I am not sure where the x-over point is on the Utopias, but lets say it's 2000Hz. So at that frequency the wave lenght is 345/2000 which is about 17 centimeters so about 6.5 inches, so technically speaking, If your tweet is say 5 iches or less away from your mid, you should be all set in regards of phase correct issue, but even then you could still move them around a bit to find your favorite stage situation Another thing to note is that - the higher the x-over point (mid/tweet) the greater the possibility of getting wave cancelations at the xo point sice the higher hz the shorter the wave, so a small placement mistake can equal a big cancelation . That is another reason why Morel rulzzz - 1800Hz xo point I hope this makes some sense, one says how one can, this would be my 3rd language so I tried my best. Enjoy the sound |
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Silver Member Username: BobimpactDanbury, CT US Post Number: 226 Registered: May-06 | I really need to stop posting when i'm cranky, sorry to jump on ya like that. Maris filled out the rest of the car stuff, but speaking of Focal home stuff, check out their Chorus S line that just came out, it's reasonably priced (for Focal) and sounds unreal for the money. Maris, I've seen guys TRY to tune in precise phase corrections (say 30 degrees relating the tweeter to it's woofer, usually by attempting to mathmatically figure out the wave paths) and it almost invariably results in sheer chaos. I believe the Utopia's cross over somewhere in the general neighborhood of 2,000, which does create some issues. I've never heard any Focal speaker sound better with a large seperation between mid/tweet, but as they say your acoustics may vary. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 20 Registered: Oct-06 | bob, so you would leave it in the door? below and forward of the mid? aimed at the opposite side head rest? if i have both the mid and tweet at -4 on the xover, am i causing phase issues? thanks for your help |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 21 Registered: Oct-06 | i redid the tweets yesterday. started off with them in the kicks. lost my stage coming from my dash. messed with it a little, and decided that between my mounting options and seating position, there really wasn't a place where i could put the tweeter where it had an unobstructed path to the listener on either side and still have it somewhere where i or my kids wouldn't mash it with a foot. so, then i decided to drop them a little from where i had them. they are now about 4 or so inches off the dash, still in the pillars, but angled toward the listener instead of the windshield. the stage is back and deeper. a clarity that was missing before is here. i am getting music from all over the truck. i had to turn the subs almost off or else they smeared the imaging. perhaps, i am done. i really am amazed to hear the things i hear in an auto. i wonder what a 3way focal, dynaudio, rainbow, etc. and a TOTL HU/processor combo would sound like. not that i want to know(i would have to have it then). i might eventually upgrade the head unit but it will be awhile before i have the extra cash laying around, and i will want to do alot of research first. also, are there 12's out there that are fast enough and detailed enough to get a little more output without smearing the imaging and staging? should i downsize to some really good 8's or maybe even focal 5" k2p or utopia subs perhaps? i'm not sure where i would put them or anything, but that is in the future at any rate. i suppose everyone's tastes are different and vehicles are definitely different. my ears are happy now. i think if i tried 20 other locations, i might gain 1 or 2% better. to have what i have now is better than i had hoped for, and IMHO much better than the utopia system in my good friend's dodge truck, with the tweeters in the factory tweeter spot. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 463 Registered: May-06 | Subs won't smear the image, simply delay your fronts a bit so sub gets there in time, use a test tone at your sub/mid x-over frequency when timing, that's it. Glad that it worked out for you. Still I will take soft dome tweet over metal any day, unless it's Scan Speak of course |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 22 Registered: Oct-06 | AARGH, after turning it up today on my daily 1 hour commute, i hate it. i can't believe it sounded so good to me yesterday, and so sh*tty today. i didn't have it loud at all yesterday. so, back to the drawing board. i'm going to try facing them back at the windshield at the new height, and also play with the angles a little the way they are facing now. i don't care for the off-axis response i'm getting from my side tweet. i think i am describing this correctly. on axis would be firing at you, right?it seems like both tweeters would be off axis depending on where you are sitting. that's kinda what makes me think about facing them the other way again. i think i might lose a little detail, but much easier to listen to. i'm getting just a hair frustrated, because at certain times it has sounded wonderful, and i have been known to be a little obsessive/compulsive. hopefully, i can become happy with the system before i have 4,000 screw holes from different tweeter locations. either that, or if i can find someone who is really good in my area, i would let them mess with it, at least for a bit. anyway, progress report tommorrow. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 466 Registered: May-06 | Well, fack, that sucks, sorry to hear that. You are correct on the off axis and on axis understanding. We are talking about a clear pathway since they are on the dash, so even if you fire them against the windshield you could still get nice, bright detail. Now, when you are listening to music, can you pin point that the sound is coming from the tweets, can you separate what is coming from mids and what is coming from tweets, is the mid/tweet blend noticable? If you answered "yes" to any of above, there is still work to be done. Yeah, you are right about tuning it at low loudness nevel and then cranking it up - might sound totally different. Plus your ears get tired after prolonged listening so after night's rest you can hear and judge a bit better. I always tune the system with engine running and warmed up amps, it does involve canking it up Pls let us know how you are solving the situation. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 23 Registered: Oct-06 | when i had them firing towards me, yes, i could tell where the tweeter was very much, and very annoying. i turned them around firing towards the windshield at the new height last night. about 4 inches off the dash. we'll see, if i don't like it, i will put it back at ear level. at the old spot i had good integration between mids and tweets, as far as you couldn't localize the drivers. we'll see how it goes. i'll let you know. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 506 Registered: May-06 | So Jason, how is your stuff running? |
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Gold Member Username: Basshead86Try Google Post Number: 8188 Registered: Aug-05 | bob and MAris  |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 510 Registered: May-06 | what's FTW anyway? |
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Gold Member Username: Basshead86Try Google Post Number: 8199 Registered: Aug-05 | For The Win!!!!!!! |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 24 Registered: Oct-06 | let's see, faced the tweets back toward the windshield. set the passive crossover for the utopias at -4 tweets, 0 mids. i might eventually go -2 on the mids, not sure yet. left the height at about 4" up. it was nice but it wasn't blending the way i wanted, and the driver tweet was still noticeable some. thought i would be a little more drastic with the eq on the alpine and see what happened. i don't remember exactly where i ended up, but something like 0@40,-1@100,-3@1k,-4@10k?.something like that anyway, cut back the mids and highs quite a bit. the driver aren't noticeable anymore, and the left right blend of the mids is better. i was really noticing the passenger mid. the highs are there without being harsh(not my ribbon tweets at home but good). i was worried about cutting too much and losing my detail, but in fact, the opposite happened. the sound is much more balanced. if there is a cymbal crash or just a rythym on a high hat, you hear it, without it adding an edge to the vocals, guitar, etc. same with the mids. i'm probably going to adjust the gain on the amp slightly to compensate for cutting, as i can turn it up louder cleanly now. overall, i'm very satisfied, have listened to it on the road, and in the driveway, extremely loud and also softly. i'm not saying i won't ever touch anything again, esp. tuning of t-corr, eq, x-overs, etc. but i think i'm done with my placement issues. |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 25 Registered: Oct-06 | until i get ballsy enough to build some custom kicks for mids and tweets. thanks everyone for your support and help. i greatly appreciate it. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 516 Registered: May-06 | Congrats on your success Enjoy the music |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 26 Registered: Oct-06 | got a 7998 on monday. had to start over tuning. nice deck. finally got the 4band on the 9830 tuned and then got a 5 band on the 7998. and all the crossover settings, slopes, etc. "pulling hair out" probably gonna run active eventually. i'll have to start checking out amps for the tweeters. |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 591 Registered: May-06 | 7998 is among the best, I've had 7995, those are some very nice HU's That's exactly the direction I wanna head - active 3way, never done it before, but got to try. Dome mid and dome tweet in the pillar and the midbass in the door. Amp for tweets - Arc |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 29 Registered: Oct-06 | if i'm running 150w rms to the mids, what should i be running to the tweets? is Arc extremely expensive? |
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Bronze Member Username: Sswanny_1Colorado Springs, Colorado U.s. Post Number: 31 Registered: Oct-06 | would a xxk 2050 work? or do i need more juice? |
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Silver Member Username: JohammbassIRL Post Number: 597 Registered: May-06 | Well, highs are more sensitive than mids, but I would still give them XXK 2100, so there is plenty to go around Another thing - you want to measure your HU's output in Volts and see where it stands, because the input sensitivity on the XXK is 250mV - 2.5V. A lot of Alpines say that they are 4V units, but in reality they might only peak at 4V. See you don't wanna clip the XXK with that 7998. Arc is not too expensive on ebay. You could also call different Arc Audio dealers and hunt for the best price, because some of them will ship to you. That's how I got the Morel Hybrid Ovations - call around, prices varied from $600's to high $800's, so got them from a dealer in Anaheim Hills, CA, that guy also carried Arc. If the input sensitivity is an issue - look at Zapco Reference 350.2, they would be in the same class as Arc. |
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