JL1000\1, PPI PC21400, Arc 2500XXK, US amps 1000x
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Silver Member Username: Loc_outSanta Ana, Ca Post Number: 418 Registered: Feb-05 | I need help choosing and amp. Here are 4 that I am considering. I have 3 15w6 6ohm the sub are rated at 400rms. I want to wire them to a 4 ohm load I really don't want to run them at 1 ohm but if I have to I will. JL 1000\1 = 1000 @ 4 ohm PPI PC21400 = 1400 @ 4 ohm bridged Arc Audio 2500XXK = 1050 @ 4 ohm bridged US Amps 1000X = 1000 @ 4 ohm bridged Which amp should be best for this application? Is there other amp I should be looking for? Thank you. |
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Gold Member Username: B101Queen City, NC USA Post Number: 3356 Registered: Sep-05 | PPI would prob sound best... |
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Silver Member Username: Buddyleee5Post Number: 278 Registered: May-05 | why not just run it at 1 ohm? |
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Silver Member Username: SkiesCourtenay, British Colu... Canada Post Number: 170 Registered: Aug-05 | It would be 1.5 ohm wouldnt it? |
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Silver Member Username: Buddyleee5Post Number: 279 Registered: May-05 | not sure, but even still, why not run the lowest ohm load possible. The lower you go the more output, the less you have to spend on an amp. If you get an amp that does 2500@1 ohm so you can have it do 1400@4 ohms why not just get a 1400@1 ohm amp and save your self some money. Its possible im wrong about this, but i would assume that since it can produce so much power even though its not at a low ohm load it would strain your chargining system more then an amp producing at 1 ohm, but like i said i could be wrong. |
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Silver Member Username: SkiesCourtenay, British Colu... Canada Post Number: 171 Registered: Aug-05 | sounds right... |
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Silver Member Username: JohnfiacIl USA Post Number: 217 Registered: Mar-06 | Do you got a charging system for that already? Stock isnt gunna let you get that power out of it. |
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Silver Member Username: Loc_outSanta Ana, Ca Post Number: 419 Registered: Feb-05 | Yes i have done the big 3 upgrade. |
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Gold Member Username: RovinTrinidad & T... Post Number: 8211 Registered: Jul-05 | Judging by just the specs u listed alone i too would pick PPI Also u can get PHOENIX GOLN XENON 1200.1 which does 1200wrms @ 1-4ohms ...... |
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Silver Member Username: JuliobSanto DomingoDominican Re... Post Number: 798 Registered: Dec-05 | if you have the BIG 3, run it at 1 ohm like matthew said, if you think that the quality at 4 ohm and 1 ohm is huge, then is not too much, i think it's not noticeable to our ears |
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Silver Member Username: Loc_outSanta Ana, Ca Post Number: 420 Registered: Feb-05 | So you guys think i should run them at 1 ohm? should 1000rms be enough? or should i look at amp that are rate over 1000rms? |
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Gold Member Username: Dustin3Tigard, Or U.S. Post Number: 1770 Registered: Oct-05 | it would make them bump. i would get the the PG xenon 1200.1 though. |
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Silver Member Username: Loc_outSanta Ana, Ca Post Number: 423 Registered: Feb-05 | What about a Precision Power Power Class 2350. Its rate at 1400 wrms x 1 @ 4? Dont sub's run cooler at 4 ohm then 1 ohm? |
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Bronze Member Username: NikoncdPost Number: 33 Registered: Jul-05 | I have a somewhat related question... the XXK series Arc Amps are all 2 channel amps (at least from what I've seen available), are these as good a D-class amps? I mean, how efficient are they? or would a JL 1000/1 be better for subs? |
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New member Username: Sony_big_chimPost Number: 1 Registered: Jun-06 | hey everyone. i'm new...but i would like to share my thoughts. Firstly, Ohms!!! For those who think it is a good idea to run everything at 1-ohms... i don't think you are very smart. Yes it does save a bit of money... but when running at low ohms, your amp will produce MASSIVE amounts of heat, and thus would need a lot of ventilation and that is not what you have if you are putting everything in the BOOT!!! Another reason not to run low ohms is because when running low ohms, there is just about ABSOLUTELY no amplification and as such its just straight through power from your battery to your subs. THIS WOULD BE SILLY. And because of this, you will loose significant dampening factor. in this Case, LOC_OUT, you have JL W6s, you must be going for Sound quality. For you to run your subs at 1 ohms, you would have less than 1/4 of the initial dampening factors, as such you will have distortion. There is also a higher chance of clipping, if your charging system cannot produce the power required for say... a Bass note of 1500watts. And if you get clipping, then say bye bye to your subs and your amp within around 2 months (because it is slowly being burnt inside out). The second thought, is runing channels. i think it is best to run your subs on Mono because of the advantage of the low deep output gained from Class-D technology. From the amps you have listed, i favor the JL 1000/1 and the PPI PC2350. I own the JL 1000/1 and a similar PPI amp (PC-1400 sharkskin - 800wrms @ 2ohm). From my knowledge, the PPI PC1400/1800 has a few advantages over the PC2350 because of the aided frequency selections and some other handy functions. But thats not to say that the quality of the PC2350 is not as good. I have ran both amps on my subs, and to decide the victor, its very hard. The JL 1000/1 is very good, JL has it this time making the amp's output is very clear and is capable of hitting those really LOW notes that are around 20-29hz. The output is extremely smooth like the PPI. But the PPI has a few advantages over the JL, that is its extremely advanced Q-bass and frequency selections. I find the subsonic filter on the PPI a bit better than the JL. As for power, i've heard that the PPI is often heavily underrated, as such the PC2350 (1400wrms) can sometime produce above 1600wrms. But then again JL has also underrated their amps to a certain extent. But i've heard very little about their ability to go above 1000wrms. I mean if you open up the JL 1000/1 and the PC2350 and compare... you'll find the JL 1000/1 to be more packed with capacitors and posibily a larger coil. BUT does this really matter?? As for the Phoenix Gold, I ask a question to you people... have you actually own and tested out the JL and the PPI? Don't judge it if you haven't used it. I've own Phoenix Gold amps for a fairly long time now...and have found that the stuff they are making nowadays are not as good as what it used to me. I have owned the QX, XS, ZX and even the M series Amps. In my experience, i've found PPI to be a grade above the Phoenix Golds (strictly OLD school here). I don't mean to sound like i know everything because there are a lot to learn, i'm just sharing what i know. I don't like it when people show up and say things from how little their experience, and yet act like they know it all. I've met people who claim to be a full Audiophile, yet have never heard of PPI, Orion, Hifonics, Audiocontrol, Dynaudios, MA audio, etc... These are the people i don't bother with, but it is a good feeling when i rock up with a system that turns heads and yet they don't have a clue what i'm running. Well... Overall, the choice between the JL Audio 1000/1 and the PPI PC2350 is yours. Remember, you are comparing two amps from two eras, New/Current to Old school. I would personally go for the PPI as i am old-school and POOR. But if you have the money, then go for the JL 1000/1. You can pick them up for around $500AU second hand (i've just sold mine on Ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=013%26item%3D230000943091%26 &sspagename=STRK%3AMESO%3AIT%26). And depending on where you live, picking up a PPI PC2350 may be a bit difficult. Anyways, If anyone has any objections to what i've said, feel free to give positive criticism. Just don't dis me!!! |
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Silver Member Username: JohnfiacIl USA Post Number: 243 Registered: Mar-06 | for the most part i think the only people running 1ohm have warrantys on their amps (atleast if there smart or just dont care) but 1ohm always seems to sound so much better.... i want to cut some holes in my amps to install fans also and run them to the remote for power on the inside of the amp... this should keep them cool, and another thing i dont think it is just 1ohm that gets hot as hell, i run one of my current amps at 3.6ohms\2 ch. and it gets hotter then a earthquake phd10000w\2 mono that i ran at 1ohm.. but then again i think thats the audiobahn issue.... |
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Gold Member Username: Dustin3Tigard, Or U.S. Post Number: 1931 Registered: Oct-05 | For you to run your subs at 1 ohms, you would have less than 1/4 of the initial dampening factors, as such you will have distortion." yes, the amp does get warmer and produce more heat, but you will be getting more power and the amp SHOULD not overheat since we are mentioning some great amps here. the only chance for any of those to get warm or yet overheat and go into protection is if you set it on fire yourself. When you buy a great amp like those, there is no reason not to run it a 1 ohm. unless it like the jl or PG that does 1000 and 1200 @ 1-4 ohms. "I don't like it when people show up and say things from how little their experience, and yet act like they know it all. I've met people who claim to be a full Audiophile, yet have never heard of PPI, Orion, Hifonics, Audiocontrol, Dynaudios, MA audio," if you dont know hifonics, it not a big loss. and it should not be mentioned in the same sentence with PPI orion or jl. and PG xenon series amp even the newer ones are very nice and i will always rec. them to people. "I find the subsonic filter on the PPI a bit better than the JL." its not a big deal. its a subsonic filter. it doesnt even need to be touched if you dont have a ported box, so mentioning that was ridiculous. when you look for an amp, the last thing that you should be judging it by is the subsonic filter, lol and again, your statement about why its a bad idea to run subs at 1 ohm is completly ridiculous. this is just my opinion  |
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Gold Member Username: Dustin3Tigard, Or U.S. Post Number: 1935 Registered: Oct-05 | ur not going to be missing an beats. all the ohm load does it match the subs. meaning wiring the subs to a certain load so the amp can put out that power. there is no diff AT ALL audibly and mono amps are the most popular amps in the world when running subs @ 1 ohm |
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Silver Member Username: JohnfiacIl USA Post Number: 244 Registered: Mar-06 | id like to add another thing with that, with good brands, you get good quality not distortion |
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Gold Member Username: B101Queen City, NC USA Post Number: 3454 Registered: Sep-05 | Firstly, Ohms!!! For those who think it is a good idea to run everything at 1-ohms... i don't think you are very smart. Yes it does save a bit of money... but when running at low ohms, your amp will produce MASSIVE amounts of heat, and thus would need a lot of ventilation and that is not what you have if you are putting everything in the BOOT!!! Another reason not to run low ohms is because when running low ohms, there is just about ABSOLUTELY no amplification and as such its just straight through power from your battery to your subs. THIS WOULD BE SILLY. And because of this, you will loose significant dampening factor. WRONG Go learn OHMS Law & Kirchoffs Law... Your statements make NO SENSE AT ALL TO ME...  |
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Silver Member Username: Loc_outSanta Ana, Ca Post Number: 454 Registered: Feb-05 | Looks like i am going to buy the 1000\1 |
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Silver Member Username: JuliobSanto DomingoDominican Re... Post Number: 984 Registered: Dec-05 | son pham went to an electronic class, and didn't pay attention, he messed up everything lol! |
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New member Username: Sony_big_chimPost Number: 2 Registered: Jun-06 | Like i have said..... the dampening factor plays a significant role when going for SQL. If you think that running your amp at 1ohm still sound as good then.... i suggest you try it out for yourself. The dampening factor, is defined as your amplifier's ability to control your subwoofer movement. If you are decreasing this factor then obviously you will loose control and hence greater distortion and less tighter bass!!! Secondly, Although your subs won't missout on any beats, it doesn't mean that those beats will sound good. And yes, with good brands you will get good quality, but here you are aiming for the BEST quality, if you run the amp at such low ohms, you will increase distortion and as a result it won't run at its optimum anymore. Also, the PPI amps are NOT MADE TO HANDLE 1ohm LOADS!!! SO why do you insist that it is not a problem to run them at 1ohm. I've seen many high powered top amplifiers being burnt to crisp black on the chip board because of people who run the amp at ohm loads that it can't handle. This is a silly mistake. |
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Bronze Member Username: KravenbloodOhio Post Number: 71 Registered: Aug-05 | i run my hifonics amp 2005d at one ohm id doest get hot warm but not hot.. its hotter than an amp that has better efficency. but it still isnt hot just warm so if those amps are more efficent at 1 ohm then my hifonics get it and dont worry about running it at 1 ohm.. and if you want to cool it off computer fans do the trick.. |
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Gold Member Username: IlluminatorUSA Post Number: 3287 Registered: Apr-05 | Son Pham, Have you seen this? http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/audioprinciples/amplifiers/DampingFactor.htm l The first chart clearly shows the decay time due to low dampening factors is hardly (if at all) audible. |
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Gold Member Username: Suleman36Maryland U.S.A. Post Number: 3959 Registered: Feb-05 | I whould take the Arc Audio 2500-XXK and then the PPI PC |
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