Reviews on Samsung dvdhd841?
Closed: New threads not accepted on this page| Thread | Last Poster | Posts | Last Post | |
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| Archive through July 12, 2004 | Jacob Pagel | 100 |
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Anonymous | Jacob, I was wondering if you could help me - I'm considering using a Samsung HD945 (UK version of the 941) with a plasma screen, either the Yamaha 4210 or the Hitachi C42PD5200 (both of which have a DVI input). Would these screens benefit from the upscaling to 720p available via the HDMI output DVI from the Samsung? The Hitachi specs state that it will accept a 720p signal, and its resolution is 1024x1024. Any help appreciated. |
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New member Username: Jamv4668Post Number: 6 Registered: Jul-04 | I ended up returning my 34 HDTV Panasonic due to some discoloration in the screen. I didn't want to go projection but ended up getting the Mitsubishi WS-48613. The Mitsubishi is a bigger TV but the Panasonic tube had a better picture. I'm currently using the DVI cable that came with the 841. Will I get a better pic if I bought a different DVI cable? Maybe like the monster DVI cable? I set up the 841 using composite cables and I turned the features on in the set up menu. I disconnected the composite cables and now I am only using the DVI cable. After selecting the 1080i after the movie starts I should be good to go and am seeing the pic on 1080i right? Anything else I should know? I'm a newb also sorry lol |
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VinDSL, Lenon.com Unregistered guest | Quick note: I have a Sammy 841 on a Sony Grand Wega. The combo works GREAT on a component cable, but the DVI leaves quite a bit to be desired. Classic mismatch using DVI, I'm afraid... Specifically, the black level is too dark, and there's no way to compensate for it. I'll be buying a 941 when I can get my hands on one. And... the 'ten second' rule that keeps confusing ppl simply refers to the 841 giving you 10 seconds to save the setting when you're done monkeying around, e.g. a screen will say "Do you want to save this setup? [yes, no]" After 10 seconds, if you don't click yes, all it does is go back to the old settings, just like adjusting the video resolution on your PC monitor in Windows. No big deal! It's just worded funny in this thread... |
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Bronze Member Username: Jbagel2Orem, UT USA Post Number: 47 Registered: Jun-04 | VinDSL- LCD TV's like the sony and panasonic just don't handle dark levels very well. the DLP's don't really have a noticable difference or at least not one that can't be ajusted easily. Johnny-, you might notice a little difference but on a CRT projection they just arn't quite sharp enough to see to much difference. I would say it probably wouldn't be worth your money. |
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Bronze Member Username: SlobizmanPost Number: 13 Registered: Jul-04 | Does anyone know if the upcoming 941 will have this "connect an inferior cable first and then click Yes within 10 seconds" thing? coming out soon? |
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New member Username: Jamv4668Post Number: 7 Registered: Jul-04 | I'm confused. What's not worth my money Jacob? |
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Unregistered guest | Does anybody know how to do 'code-free' with DVDHD841? I heard you can do it with your remote control.. but... how? Any answer would be appreciated. |
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Vinny Unregistered guest | Jacob, You are the man... I appreciate your input, you truly are a great help. I have a Samsung DLP HLN5065W. I have my hughes hd receiver connected to the tv with the dvi cables. I am considering getting the hd841 dvd player from bestbuy, but am not sure how I should do the configurations since I am using the dvi cable from the directv hughes receiver. I understand that all audio should go to the receiver, and video straight to tv. Should I connect the hughes box to the tv through s-video? Would that degrade my hd quality from my directv? Thanks for your help |
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Anonymous | Johnny, it would not be worth the money to buy a monster dvi cable. Keep the one that came with your 841. The value of diminishing returns would apply in your situation with a crt. A monster dvi costing 100+ would not be worth the small improvement. |
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Criss Unregistered guest | VinDSL and Jacob, been enjoying the exchanges for a few weeks now. I also have a grand vega and have been wondering if the 841 verses the 941 is going to yield a better picture. Disappointing to hear the DVI connection is inferior to component for Sony. In emails with Samsung they reccomended the DVI. Interesting. |
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New member Username: Jamv4668Post Number: 8 Registered: Jul-04 | I'm thinking of exchanging the Mitsubishi HDTV I bought. I'm not very impressed with it and my new 841 doesn't really impress me on it. Is it true that the tube TV's look better than any other type of HDTV? I was looking at a SONY 34 widescreen. |
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New member Username: VindslPost Number: 1 Registered: Jul-04 | Heh! Guess I might as well register. I like this board and, let's face it, considering the current state of flux in videoland, we all need a little hand-holding...  ///////////////////////////////////// Jacob: Thanks for your comments on the Sony Grand Wega. I'm fully aware of the 'dark level' situation, but others may not be. In a nutshell, some ppl consider the wimpy 'blacks' on the Grand Wega's to be a negative. Personally, I consider them a positive. Go figure! I guess I like pastel blacks, instead of neon black... All I can say in my defense (and Sony's) is, I contemplated and scrutinized the purchase of a HDTV for 2 years and the moment I saw a 4th gen Grand Wega, I knew it was 'the one.' But, that isn't the topic of this thread... Without turning this into a diatribe, my Sammy 841 is back in it's original box, ready to be returned to BB tomorrow. I replaced it with a Philips DVP-642 this afternoon. WHAT A DIFFERENCE! This isn't a Philips DVP-642 thread either, so I won't elaborate, other than to say it is a near perfect match for the Sony Grand Wega, IMHO. It's the current darling of computer hacks and video geeks, and in serious short-supply in every store in the Phoenix metro area. Take that for what it's worth... ///////////////////////////////////// Chris: Thanks for your reply also! I really can't recommend the use of a 841 on a Grand Wega, unless you use component output. On component cables, the 841 works flawlessly. It's just kinda sucky on DVI, especially on Grand Wega's. While other TV's may not experience the same degree of 'black crush' as the Sony's, it's a known problem with 841's using DVI output. "For our core tests, the 841 did pretty well. The player passes blacker than black just fine, though not via DVI. The DVI output is very similar to the 931 in that video levels are being stretched, so head and toe room (above white and below black) are not available. Not only does this get rid of information in the image, it makes it quite difficult to set up properly with a display. On the component video output side, the player's white output is perfect at 100 IRE, and there is no Y/C delay to worry about. It does have pretty significant Y/C delay via DVI though, so we recommend the component output for this player." SOURCE: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=118 ~ |
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Bru Unregistered guest | Mark Flemming: I'm also planning to purchase the HLP5063 but have been confused by some adds for the HLN5065 is there a difference? Also what did you decide - I have an unopened HD-841. Should I use it or take it back and wait for the HD-941 to use with my 5063? |
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RogerB Unregistered guest | Anyone using the HD841 with a Philips 60PW9363 rptv? I cant get mine to work in 1080i mode via DVI (AV5). It will only do 480p. If I hit the DVI SELECT button on the remote 4 times to go to 1080i mode, the video won't sync. (xxPW9363 DVI only supports 480p and 1080i, not 720p nor 768p). I got the HD841 because the component input on my tv is used by my Charter Cable HD receiver (component only), and that works fine in 1080i mode. The Philips docs say that DVI input supports 480p and 1080i-HDCP. |
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William Cameron Unregistered guest | For those of you who returned your 841 because of the door opening issue... did the replacement fix it ? I am having the same issue. |
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New member Username: VindslPost Number: 3 Registered: Jul-04 | "For those of you who returned your 841... did the replacement fix it?" Sorry for being a wise guy, but yes, my Philips DVP-642 replacement fixed it... On a side note, if you'll pardon the pun, I didn't realize how 'flat' the audio was on the 841, until I replaced it with the Philips. The volume was fine, but the 841 seemed devoid of dynamic range, like the sound was compressed. It didn't have any punch, you know? An "expert" salesman at CC confirmed this yesterday, when I was buying a Sammy SIR-T351. I hate to sound like sour grapes. I'm a Samsung lover - been buying their products for years - bought more yesterday - I'm viewing this web board on a Sammy 763mb SyncMaster monitor, blah, blah, blah. However, this 70-bone Philips runs circles around the 841. It's not Samsung's fault. The 642 is the hottest thing going right now. Try to find one (in stock), if you don't believe me... I'm gonna give the 941 a spin when it's available, but I have a feeling I'll be returning it too...  |
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Bronze Member Username: SlobizmanPost Number: 14 Registered: Jul-04 | Bru, I took back the 841. Since the 5063 upconverts anyway, I figured I'd keep my old DVD player until something I really want comes out. I'm assuming that will be the 941. I'm not sure about the HLN5065... |
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p5surf Unregistered guest | Question for Jacob: I just bought a Mitsubishi ws-65315 and the Samsung 841. I have it hooked up with the DVI cable (from monster / not the one in the 841 box). Initially I had the same 10 second thing problem but later was just able to hit the button on the remote for the 841 which switches video modes. Although I'm still having a problem - the TV displays the resolution on the screen and it is still saying 480p. Are you familiar with the Mitsubishi - not many people on this forum have mentioned that particular TV. Additionally I would like to ask an opionion question: My TV has only one DVI input. Along with the 841, my cable box also has a DVI output for the true HDTV picture. Which device should I leave on the DVI - Digital Cable (I/O here in NY) with HDTV feeds for multiple channels -OR- the Samsung 841. If you recommend the HDTV box then I'll be forced to use the Component cables for the 841, then I have to ask, was that particular DVD player really worth the money. -OR- should I consider a DVI 2-to-1 switch? Any recommendations in this area? Thank you!!! |
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vishv Unregistered guest | I just bought a Sony Grand Wega (50") and the Samsung 841 with Monster (DVI,component video, and audio) cables. So the questions for Jacob and the other experts here are: 1. Is it preferable to use DVI output of the 841 or does the component output provide a better picture? What differences can you see? 2. Since the component output provides 480p, while the DVI upconverts to 720p/1080i, shouldn't the DVI output in theory provide a sharper/superior picture? 3. Is the upconversion to 720p or 1080i selectable on the Sony? 4. I digress from the 841 thread but I assume there wouldn't be any picture quality issues with using the DVI feed from a cable HD or satellite HD box on the Sony? 5. Other suggestions? Many thanks. |
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New member Username: VindslPost Number: 6 Registered: Jul-04 | I just bought a Sony Grand Wega (50") and the Samsung 841 with Monster (DVI,component video, and audio) cables. So the questions for Jacob and the other experts here are: 1. Is it preferable to use DVI output of the 841 or does the component output provide a better picture? What differences can you see? When you hook a Sammy 841 to your GW via the DVI connector, you will experience what 'they' call 'black crush.' For example, one of my favorite movies is "The Adventures of Baron Munchausen." In it, there is a character - a shiek - with a huge, black beard. With component cables, you can see many individual shades of black in his beard, glistening in the light, like they put Afro Sheen on it. It's quit impressive! With DVI, his beard looks all the same dull color, like a big, flat black mop. This 'black crush' effect will apply to shadows, and so forth, as well; anything dark. And, there is no way to adjust for it. What the 841 needs is a 'black level' adjustment. The 941 is reportedly going to have one, as do most other DVD players with DVI output. Alas, the 841 is not one of them. If you are going to run a 841 on your GW, make sure to use the component cables. It makes a tremendous difference! |
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New member Username: P5surfNew York Post Number: 3 Registered: Jul-04 | NO 10 Second Workaround.....read more..... 1. Connect 841 with component cables (ok to substitute Red, White, Yellow cable temporarily) -OR- use S-video cable 2. Make certain there is NO DVD in machine 3. Start up 841 - wait for "Loading" to finish - screen may appear RED (unless you are using S-video cable) 4. Press button on remote to switch mode to 'Pscan & DVI' 5. Power down 841 (turn it off) 6. Disconnect component cables & attach DVI cable 7. Power back on (Still no DVD in drive) - it may take a few seconds for TV to adapt to new mode & make sure your TV is now viewing DVI input not component input (if this applies to your TV) 8. Press DVI Mode button on remote to switch from 480 to 1080 9. Power down again / power back up 10. insert DVD and enjoy! This method works great with my 841 and Mitsubishi ws-65315. I will be doing further experiments between DVI connection versus Component connection. I have all monster cables (DVI & Component) - not using the cable that came with the 841. |
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Bronze Member Username: Jbagel2Orem, UT USA Post Number: 51 Registered: Jun-04 | the main dvi black level problem that you have only shows up on a couple sets, the sony LCDs and LCD projections The Hitachi Plasmas and panasonic plasmas i will update the list as i hear of more but if you have a samsung DLP it looks great, no black level problems. |
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New member Username: Jamv4668Post Number: 9 Registered: Jul-04 | I didn't have to go through all that 10 second stuff. I first used an s-video plug, set it up, turned it off and Connected my DVI. I only have the DVI cable in now. I just put a DVD in, I select 1080i and watch my movies. That's all I really should do right? The TV i have is a SONY KV34HS420. Anyone have any good hints or any other advice for me using this TV? |
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New member Username: VindslPost Number: 7 Registered: Jul-04 | Yeah, this '10-second thing' is getting totally out of hand. Look, it's as simple as this... When you take your 841 out of the box,and plug it in for the first time, DVI output is turned off by default. All you have to do is turn DVI output on using the remote. However, when you turn DVI on, a window pops up and asks you if you're sure you want to turn it on. It gives you 10 seconds to click 'yes' or 'no. If you don't click anything, in 10 seconds it goes back to the default (DVI off) setting. This is probably for the benefit of ppl putzing around in the setup menu, who turn DVI output on by mistake, and don't know what to do. It's just like switching your PC monitor resolution from 800x600 to 1024x768 in Windows, except Windows gives you 15 seconds before it returns to the original setting, if you don't click 'OK'. The thing is, if you don't have either composite or component cables hooked up to your TV/monitor, how the heck are you supposed to see when to click 'yes' or 'no'? Hello?!?!? That's the only reason you need to hook up composite or component cables. Once DVI output is turned on, you can disconnect and forget about those cables. Or, leave them hooked up; your choice... It's no big deal, people! You don't have to plug the DVI cable in, 10 seconds after you click 'yes' button, or any of that horse puckey... |
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New member Username: UnrealtardLakeville, MN Post Number: 1 Registered: Jul-04 | Jacob: Any idea why I cannot change the black level setting to "On" in the "Setup/Display Setup" menu when the "Video Output" is set to P-SCAN & DVI mode? If I switch to S-Video input, I can toggle the Black Level setting on and off. When I'm in P-SCAN & DVI mode I cannot toggle the setting. It stays off. I appreciate the help. The DVD player rocks but I would like to turn the Black Level to "On". |
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fab 5 Unregistered guest | Hello Jacob. You are truly a video "god" on this board. I just purchased the 841 with a samsung tx-p2675 set. using the dvi cable, should i have the player set at 720p or 1080i? they both look good, but wasn't quite sure of which one to choose. cheers, |
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Fab 5 Unregistered guest | one more thing jacob, will it do me any good to get the 941 over the 841 that i have now? |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 14 Registered: Jul-04 | "...should i have the player set at 720p or 1080i?" If you'll pardon the pun, there's two ways of looking at it... Most 'experts' say to run 720p. They claim they can see a difference. And, they quip, "Why pay all that money to watch an interlaced picture?" Personally, I setup everything in 1080i mode. I figure I didn't pay all that money to watch 720 res... There should have been an '11th Commandment' - "Thou shall not seek perfection." |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 1 Registered: Jul-04 | Great thread! Got me to register. A lot of comments on DCDi here. Does DCDi do it's deinterlacing in the analog or digital domain? I always thought it was in the analog domain but all the comments about this function being in the 941 using DVI confused me. I am looking at the 841 but could wait for the 941 into a hlp-4663w. Is the "film mode" selection what activates the DCDi on this set? Thanks |
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Anonymous | Hey all, interesting thread. I just bought the sony KP-46WT510. First, should I go ahead and get the 841 (i really dont want to wait for the 941). And if I do what setting should i put it on 1080 etc. I havent got the tv yet (it gets delivered tomorrow morning) so I really dont know much yet. Thanks in advance. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 15 Registered: Jul-04 | "...should I go ahead and get the 841 (i really dont want to wait for the 941)" I offered an opinion above. Rather than repeat myself, let me put it this way... I was in a 'Best Buy' last night, looking for a PC video card, so I 'cruised' by the DVD players on the way out. Sometimes, they have good deals on returned items. To my shock and amazement, they had a STACK of returned 841's sitting there; three to be exact. It looked like a Salvation Army thrift shop. While this is anecdotal, the implication should be obvious! When I bought my Sammy 841, less than a month ago, they were in short supply. Now, evidently, they can't get rid of them... |
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Unregistered guest | Question for Jacob the Resident Guru: I'm a newbie and this thread has started to make my head spin, but my question is simple, similar to Mark Fleming's from awhile ago. Would really love to hear your thoughts. Just bought the HLP5063W and would appreciate your recommendation for a DVD player. My understanding is that my TV has one DVI input and one HDMI input. I'll be using the DVI output for my comcast digital cable/HDTV box, as my sales contact recommended. So, is the best choice simply to get this HD941 unit (I'm assuming by now it's available). The HD941 has this "HDMI" input, correct? So I could connect it to my TV using that input/output? I'm most interested in picture quality over sound quality, if that matters. Second part of the question...I've also considered getting a 5-disc player, but have been told there are no 5-disc players that will approach the video quality of something like the 941. My sales guy did say that if I do that, he's got a Denon multi-disc player he'd recommend - that would have to be connected to available component output since it's not "HDMI" - that would provide very good picture quality as well. If Jacob or anyone has input on this, I'd appreciate it. And as Homer Simpson would say, "Please dumb it down for me a little....a little more...a little more!" |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 19 Registered: Jul-04 | If Jacob or anyone has input... I'd appreciate it. And as Homer Simpson would say, "Please dumb it down for me a little....a little more...a little more! First, Denon makes the best DVD players, period. Samsung isn't in the same league. Sorry for sounding like a jerk, but IMHO any Denon will beat any Samsung, any way you look at it, except price. Second, DVD's aren't HD quality anyway, so this whole discussion is rather achedemic. That's okay. What else is there to talk about? I'm using a $70 Philips DVD player with my $3000 HDTV, via component cables, and I'm perfectly happy with this combination, but that's just me... Lastly, 941's are going to be available September 30, 2004, according to Amazon.com... SOURCE: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0001H4BZC |
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Unregistered guest | Vin, thanks for replying...any particular Denon model you'd recommend? What makes Denon superior, to you? Also, wondering why you don't have one yourself - because of price, of you thought your Philips player was just as good? |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 20 Registered: Jul-04 | Well, for the money, it's hard to beat a Denon DVD-2900. The 2900 is a good example of what I was talking about. The DVD-2900 is NOT a top-of-the-line Denon player, by any means. However, compare it to any Samsung DVD player you wish and I think the differences will become obvious. They're built a LOT better, they sound better, and the picture quality is nicer too. Basically, it's apples to oranges... Goggle Search: Denon DVD-2900 I bought the Philips DVP-642 as a novelty. It's a tech-savvy, multimedia toy, IMHO. LoL! Besides, who else makes a $70 DVD/MP3/Divx/Xvid player? The 642 will play anything you throw at it: DVD-video, video CD, audio CD, JPEG image CD (as well as Kodak's and Fuji's variants), CD's loaded with MP3, MPEG-4, or DivX 3.11/4.x/5.x files, CD-R, SVCD, CD-RW, DVD+R, DVD-R, DVD+RW, DVD-RW. I haven't found anything it won't play. It converts all region PAL-formatted discs (the video standard in Europe) for viewing on standard NTSC TV's and vice-versa. It has five-disc resume, blah, blah, blah, ad infinitum. While it's a 'must-have' item for computer geeks and hackers, it's no Denon! Anyway, I'm going off-topic, so I'll stop... |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 1 Registered: Aug-04 | Hi Y'all, Just got a Sammy 841 to connect via DVI to my new Sony HDTV. Component & S-Video work fine, however, can't get the DVI to work. It gives me a flashing blue screen. I'm thinking that it has to do with the copy protection fiasco. Is there a DVI to DVI with copy-protection converter to put on my Sony to allow the two to talk? If the DVI won't work I'll return it because that is why I got this unit. Thanks for your help. |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 4 Registered: Jul-04 | Rick Everything I have read here and elsewhere would suggest that there is no such converter. That would kind of defeat everything Hollywood is trying to do with copy protection. Have you verfied that your Sony definitely doesn't support HDCP? I thought you were supposed to get a snowy screen if HDCP wasn't supported not a flashing blue one. I read elsewhere that VOOM just enabled this on all their channels and a lot of folks without the HDCP support are hopping mad... |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 2 Registered: Aug-04 | Thanks Tim, Looks like I will be returning the Samsung DVD player. I just found this link: http://www.plasmatvbuyingguide.com/plasmatv-questions/sonyplasma_4.html#07169677 It states "The DVI input on the Sony PFM-42V1 is not HDCP compliant. If the DVD player sends out an HDCP encoded signal, it will not work." There is no intelligent reason to have copy protection on a TV, since it's an input-only device. Oh well. All that expensive technology rendered useless by Hollywood paranoia. It's only my money (and time) wasted. |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 5 Registered: Jul-04 | If you really want DVI, you might find a old new or used Vinc Bravo (D1??), I think all the new ones are HDCP comp. But the old ones (that it seems everyone does their reviews with) are not. Unfortunately, I think Hollywood won this round slow and sure. |
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Unregistered guest | Hey guys, need some advice here. I want to get one of the Samsung DVD players with DVI connection & wanted to know what you guys would recommend. HD931 has DVI connections & Faroudja DCDi whereas the HD 941 has an HDMI connection w/Faroudja DCDi. My TV (HLN617W 61" PROJECTION HDTV DLP) does not have a HDMI connection and only has one DVI connection. Therefore I would have to get a converter for the HD941 and might lose some quality there. So what do you guys think I should go with, HD931 or HD941??? If I went with the HD941 would there be some loss of quality due to using a converter? Also, should I invest in the Monster Cable DVI cable or stick with what comes with the DVD player??? Thanks for any feedback you guys give. |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 6 Registered: Jul-04 | The 941 isn't out yet. The 841 is. As far as DVI to HDMI there is not loss. You use an adapter or a DVI to HDMI cable. I think the 941 is supposed to come with a HDMI to DVI converter. Looks like Samsung has been promising the 941 since early May, so who knows if Sept is even going to happen. Maybe they will just save it till Xmas. Most post I have seen say the Monster is a waste of money. If you go above 15 feet the quality of the DVI cable is supposed to be come an issue. below 15, it isn't supposed to matter much. |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 7 Registered: Jul-04 | Rick I was just reading the shootout on the Bravo D2 DVI player it appears to not be HDCP compliant and is available for about what the 941 is going to be selling for street price. Might want to check it out. http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=118 |
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Dazed & Confused Unregistered guest | Thanks for your feedback Mr. Tim Clark. I've decided to go with the HD931. I also talked to a Samsung rep & he told me that this would be a better option. Once I get it I'll post the results. Again, thanks for your help. |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 8 Registered: Jul-04 | Dazed Pretty formal aren't we ;-) Tim works just fine. As to the 931, I would do some searches here and at avsforum.com. You may change your mind. The 841 has DVI, it also has SACD and DVD-Audio if your receiver has 5.1 inputs which the 931 doesn't have. The other thing I heard about the 931 was that if you watch a 4:3 (academy standard) aspect ration DVD (like Casablanca or any other older film) the DVD player stretches it to 16:9 widescreen format and won't let you override it. This is throught the DVI port I believe. I haven't heard if the 841 also has this problem but I suspect it does not. If you get the 931 get it very very cheap. I think they are just about giving them away. The 841 is about 179.00 around Chicago. |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 3 Registered: Aug-04 | Hi Tim, Thanks re the Bravo D2 DVI player. Now I'm wondering whether I really need a DVI at all. Mainly, I want to avoid the D/A then A/D conversion. But almost all the high end receivers and peripherals are component. And I'm totally confused as to whether component is always analog or maybe can be digital. I've read maybe 20 links regarding the topic Y Pr Pb vs. Y Cr Cb etc. and am still totally confused. If component is sometimes digital, how do you know? And is the quality difference even worth the trouble of trying to stick with all digital? Some people say the component is actually better than the DVI. So my tentative conclusion is to return the Samsung DVD and go with all component connections for my surround sound system. (I know the Samsung has component connections too, but there are other choices with more features like recording, VHS combo units, etc.) Your thoughts? |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 22 Registered: Jul-04 | Hrm... Sammy 941's for 230 bones?!?!?! |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 9 Registered: Jul-04 | Rick There are many here more in know than me but from what I know, component is always analog. That is how I run my system today. The only ways to eliminate the convertion is with DVI, HDMI or some sort of VGA connection (ala computer monitor connection.) If you can watch VHS on these new sets you are a better man than I. I tried to watch a VHS tape with my S-VHS player via S-Video and it was unwatchable on the Samsung HLP4663. Moved the VHS deck upstairs to the small TV. |
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New member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 10 Registered: Jul-04 | Vin A great price for thin air Eh? I wonder if they are ever really going to be able to deliver it. TV authority is saying some time in Sept. now. |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 4 Registered: Aug-04 | Tim My TV does have a component input via VGA connection, but not sure why the connection would make any difference since the signal is the same. Also just tried a VHS (Sopranos 2nd season) tape and it looked pretty good on my new Sony PFM-42V1 EDTV. One of the reasons I got the EDTV was that I heard that it handles older formats better than HDTV. And apparently Sony handles up-conversion the best. Anyway it seems that we are in a transition period from analog to digital and sometimes the best is the enemy of the good. If digital isn't ready for prime time maybe it's wise to go all component. (I have the same HDCP problem with DVI input from my Explorer 3250HD STB to the Sony EDTV.) |
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New member Username: SalrmrcreyCA USA Post Number: 2 Registered: Jul-04 | Samsung finally has the 941 listed on their site. this usually means that the release is very soon. (it happened that way with their DLP's) I have heard end of August more than once but who really knows. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 23 Registered: Jul-04 | "...Anyway it seems that we are in a transition period from analog to digital and sometimes the best is the enemy of the good. If digital isn't ready for prime time maybe it's wise to go all component..." It all depends... This decision shouldn't have to be 'rocket science', even though the technology may (or may not) be. It should be a trial 'n' error process, pure and simple! If you want proof of this, look no further than Jacob Pagel. He stated that his knowledge is based on watching TV's (plural) 10 hours a day, at work, and I believe him! There's more to his story than that, I'm sure. In order to sell something to someone else, it helps if you sell it to yourself first. Nevertheless, experience is the best teacher, not social reinforcement on web boards... Look, at some point, the signal is going to have to be converted to analog, in order for you to watch it. This is a given. We aren't living in "The Matrix." You can't watch 'digits'. YOUR DECISION revolves around which device you allow to do the digital to analog conversion. How does one decide that? Let's say you have a $3000 video camera and a $300 TV. Which one would you guess does the best digital to analog conversion, i.e. which one has the best DAC? If you think the camera does, s-video might be the way to go - let the camera do the conversion. Likewise, if you think the TV has a better DAC, then you would want a component connection - let the TV do the conversion. Put another way, there may be some situations where the loathsome, and much maligned, s-video connection actually gives you better results than component cables, FireWire, or whatever. Now, in 'our' case, which would you imagine does the best digital to analog conversion - a $300 DVD player or a $3000 TV? It's impossible to tell, for sure, until you try it. There are simply too many different combinations, with all the sundry foibles and pitfalls, to say one type of video connection trumps all the others. You can second-guess this stuff all you want, but the bottom line is: you will never know which combination works the best until you try them all - even if it takes you 10 hours a day to convince yourself. Whatever LOOKS the best IS the best. Don't summarily dismiss something just 'cause it isn't digital. If you feel like playing the 'digital' game, then you should realize it can be convincingly argued that the only TRUE digital connection is fiber optics. All the rest of these 'digital' technologies, so called, are simply throwing the word 'digital' around - 'digital watches' being a prime example. But, that's a subject for a different thread... |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 5 Registered: Aug-04 | Hi VinDSL, You're right! Experience is better than book knowledge any day. But the reason there are web boards (and books and schools and the internet) is so everyone does not have to take the 10 hours a day (or years as the case may be) to experience everything firsthand and make the same mistakes that other people have already made. BYW I tried contacting Jacob, but he is probably busy selling TVs. If a signal has to come through an optical cable in order to be digital, that is news to me. I wonder if the electrons coming through the coaxial cable to the STB are aware that they are being misrepresented by the cable company. Anywho, I purchased a $3000 "digital" EDTV which wants to be fed a $60/month "digital" cable service or $300 "digital" DVD signal. So it doesn't make sense to convert the digital signal to analog and then back again. It does make sense that everytime you convert and unconvert or compress and uncompress a signal that something will be lost in translation, and quality will suffer as a result. I am not a rocket scientist however. So that was my original interest in the Samsung 841, which I returned today because it will not talk to my TV via its "digital" DVI connection, thanks to Hollywood and HDCP incompatibilities. Although I'm sure you're a nice guy, talking with people on the web is not especially social for me. I'm attempting to make informed decisions about spending thousands of dollars on home electronics a/v equipment. But if something does not look or sound good to me it doesn't really matter what any expert says or what the theory holds. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 25 Registered: Jul-04 | Yeah, everything's a mess right now, and it's gonna get worse before it gets better. It reminds me of the early days of personal computing. Radio Shack, for instance, made like 5 different computer systems, with 5 different OS's. Each one had its' own special printer cable with different pin outs, and so forth. Whatever... I suppose we're all 'early adopters' in this HDTV gig. 'They' say, by 2007, 50% of all American homes will have HDTV's in them. In the meantime, and probably well beyond, it's gonna be a game of catch-up. DVI, for the most part, is already obsolete, so I wouldn't get to hung up on it, if I was you. OTA HDTD is a joke. In my area, sometimes they transmit, sometimes they don't. HD-DVD hasn't even been 'invented' yet, or at least ironed out. And, the list goes on... I'm not knocking anyone. This is going to be a steep learning curve for a lot of ppl. We're all gonna need a lot of hand holding, and this venue is a perfect place to cry on each other's shoulders. So, in that sense, a lot of this is social IMHO. Nobody wants to make the wrong decision, but a lot of wrong decisions are being made anyway. What you have to watch out for is someone helping you make the wrong decision. Misery loves company, you know? I would suggest that, for most ppl, buying a Sammy HD841 is the wrong decision. I can't imagine anyone but a died in the wool, unofficial, Samsung apologist with a Sammy DLP sitting in his living room, being happy with it, sticking tray and all. Maybe I'll have a different opinion of the 941. Only time will tell... |
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Ray Simon Unregistered guest | After reading these discussions, could someone (Jacob?) tell me why I would want the select the HD841 with my Samsung HLN61? It sounds as if I get minimal advantage at best for the upscaling the resolution, since the TV will do it on its own with other dvd players. I also have confusion on the SACD and DAD connections. I have read (and saw it in the manual) that only 2 channel or digital connections will work? |
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Ray Simon Unregistered guest | After reading these discussions, could someone (Jacob?) tell me why I would want the select the HD841 with my Samsung HLN61? It sounds as if I get minimal advantage at best for the upscaling the resolution, since the TV will do it on its own with other dvd players. I also have confusion on the SACD and DAD connections. I have read (and saw it in the manual) that only 2 channel or digital connections will work? |
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johnnytv2004 Unregistered guest | If I'm getting a picture through DVI and can change resolutions on the remote does this mean I'm all set up correctly ? Of can there possibly be more tweaking involved ? I have the dvdhd841 hooked up via DVI to my Sammy HLP5063W DLP |
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New member Username: MpricePost Number: 4 Registered: Jun-04 | I need to buy a much longer DVI cable than what came with my 841. When I get online to look for one, I see DVI-A and DVI-I and DVI-D and so on...Which one do I need? I couldn't find it mentioned in the manual for the player or my tv. Anyone know? |
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Bronze Member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 11 Registered: Jul-04 | Matt You need DVI-D. There are tutorials at pacificcable.com and ramelectronics.net. They are both places to buy DVI cables at prices better than Monster cables. Bettercables.com also sells DVI-D cables but thier price is about the same as Monster. They say you need to start worrying about cable quality beyond 15 ft for DVI. Check them out. I just ordered from Ram but will not get to see the results till tomorrow when the Sat receiver goes in. |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 6 Registered: Aug-04 | EVERYONE MUST READ THIS LINK (THIS GUY IS BRILLIANT): |
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johnnytv2004 Unregistered guest | One other thing that is not explained in the manuel, unless I'm missing it. In the set up menu under the PSACN&DVI line it says MODE A & MODE B.. What are those MODES for ??? I tried both and dont see a difference between the two. Can anyone offer help on these questions ? |
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New member Username: Hogrider69Taunton, MA US of A Post Number: 2 Registered: Aug-04 | I hooked up the 841 to my Fujitsu P50XHA30WS per instructions. Pitcure on DVI is green hued and kinda scrambled. Component input is scrambled & unwatchable. Composite looks GREAT! Any ideas before I toss this roach in the dumpster? |
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Ray Simon Unregistered guest | Hooked up my Samsung HLN61 TV witht the 841 through DVI cable (included with player) and a cheap RC cable set as a composite component. Everyone in my family preferred the composite component. I'm not sure that these cables are even right for the job. Now, mind you we had minimal samples from recent movies who have lots of depth of image and varying darkness. Me thinks that the 841 goes back (can't even remember where it leaves off on a scene & can't remember the resolution setting on the dvi once I turn it off). |
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mike h Unregistered guest | i have the same problem with mine Ray, you have to change the resolution everytime you change DVDs, and there is no resume feature which just sucks. The manual claims that it does resume, but mine just wont and its just unacceptable. but im a sucker for the picture quality, cause it does look really good. but does anyone know how to make the resume function work? please let me know. mike |
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Bronze Member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 12 Registered: Jul-04 | Rick He was a regular on the AVS forum and I believe he passed away a month or so ago. A bike accident or something. He was really into the DLP and DVI thing and put a lot of time into his site. TWC |
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New member Username: RickPost Number: 7 Registered: Aug-04 | Tim, It's a real loss if this guy, Arun Gupta, has passed away. He was the most informed person I've ever read regarding this whole analog-digital transition. Wish I had found his link earlier (and it's a year old). So my status is that after returning the Sammy 841, I have ordered the V Inc. Bravo 2. It is faring better in the reviews anyway. Hard to believe that this is the ONLY DVD player that will ever be DVI compatible with my TV. Just incredible that there is no adapter or way to get around the HDCP mess; just can't get there from here. I wrote the HDCP people a nasty note, so I feel a little better... Still I have this fancy digital TV and will be relegated to receiving analog component signals from the STB. Maybe VinDSL is right. It has to become analog eventually so maybe this just means that the signal is converted before entering the TV so the TV doesn't have to. I wonder if a digital TV converts an analog signal back to digital first? I will know for certain if it matters by comparing P/Q between component and DVI connections when the Bravo arrives. Gupta was raving about the increase in quality and became kind of a zealot. |
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Bronze Member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 13 Registered: Jul-04 | Rick Actually I just had my first brush with DVI into my Samsung hlp4663 using a Dish 811 receiver and to be honest, in that venue the difference between component and DVI is marginal at best. However I must admit that the overall PQ with the Dish SD is very soft. The HD looks good but I can't say it looks a lot better than my DVD component feed into the Samsung. |
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bb612 Unregistered guest | I have a Toshiba 42H83, and I noticed having problems with the black level when connected through the DVI. I was wondering if this was normal for this tv, since earlier it was said that was a problem with some other tvs using the DVI to connect. Or is it possible that I don't have it connected correctly? Any help would be appreciated. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 30 Registered: Jul-04 | Nah! There's nothing wrong with your Toshiba. The problem is DVI. When it comes to DVI, everyone is doing their own thing. I don't know what the lower-end black level is on a Sammy HD841, but I suspect it's around 5-10 IRE. This is fine if your TV is configured that way, but most TV's are expecting to see 0 IRE black level on the DVI input. Consequently, the black level is WAY too high on most TV's and there is no way to adjust the picture to be correct. There IS a black level adjustment on the 841, but it doesn't work on DVI. If you go into the menu, you will find it is 'ghosted out.' It supposedly works on s-vid and composite, but I never tried it. All you can do is buy something, stick it in the DVI port, and see if it works. If it works, fine - if not, return it and get your money back. IMHO, that's what they get for making incompatible devices with no black level adjustment. |
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encryption Unregistered guest | wow I'm glad I ran into this thread beacause I just bought the 841 not more than 4 days ago alongwith the Sony KV-30HS420. While my TV was not in stock at the local Circuit City, I bought the DVD player home to test against my hand me down DVD player and the result was instantly noticeable. however seeing that the 941 comes with faroudja DCDi and how much better it is, my question is, will the 841 be good enough with the Sony or will the upgrade to the 941 really make a world of a difference.... -e- |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 40 Registered: Jul-04 | Faroudja chipsets rock!!! I have an $800 Sony 8mm VCR. Guess what it uses - Faroudja. As far as being 'good enough' goes, you'll have to be the judge of that. Apriori knowledge tells me the 941 is going to be a much better choice, because it supposedly is going to have a 'black level' adjustment on the DVI/HDMI outs. That's the biggest problem with the 841, IMHO... |
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encryption Unregistered guest | the reason I asked is because in one of the threads above, a member posted that in order to use the Faroudja capabilities of the dvd player, the TV should support it..... I searched pretty darn hard trying to read into tech specs of the Sony but no where did it show compatibility to faroudja. hence I posted the question if the 941 would be a better choice or the 841 would be.... -e- |
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Unregistered guest | I have a 841 connected to a Fujitsu 42" monitor #P42HHA30WS using the DVI conection. I find that the componet out on the 841 produces a brighter and better image on the TV than the DVI connection. The reason I got the 841 was to upscale DVD's to near HD quality....It does not work as advertised for me. Maybe I don't have something set right. Any suggestions? |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 41 Registered: Jul-04 | JGCJR: This is a long thread, so you probably missed this link... http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=118 #SamsungDVD-HD841 It states: "For our core tests, the 841 did pretty well. The player passes blacker than black just fine, though not via DVI. The DVI output is very similar to the 931 in that video levels are being stretched, so head and toe room (above white and below black) are not available. Not only does this get rid of information in the image, it makes it quite difficult to set up properly with a display. On the component video output side, the player's white output is perfect at 100 IRE, and there is no Y/C delay to worry about. It does have pretty significant Y/C delay via DVI though, so we recommend the component output for this player." This was my experience, as well. The Sammy 841 looked great using a component connection, but it suffered from 'black crush' using the DVI cable... |
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Rob B Unregistered guest | I got an HD841, and all output modes seem to work (though DVI took some doing, or perhaps some luck). However, I believe that I notice occasional glitching with some discs, especially (but probably not exclusively) with the audio. The disc of the original "Matrix" glitches every 5 or 10 minutes - pix jumps, and audio mutes for a second or so. Only one glitch all the way through "Kill Bill Part 2" -- no glitching on Godzilla (though after my latest viewing, the whole movie seems like a glitch, but that's another story). I'm wondering if this glitching is characteristic of the model, or just the unit I have. I got it as a a customer return at Best Buy -- should I take it back for a new unit, or just return it and wait for something else? (My projector does a good job of scaling, so the upcoming 941's improvements may not be important to me.) Other than the glitching problem, the unit seems pretty good so far. And it's a good looking unit in my equipment stack. too. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 42 Registered: Jul-04 | "...should I take it back for a new unit, or just return it and wait for something else?" Referring to the article above, once again... "Samsung has another DVI player due out soon, the HD941. This player uses the Faroudja solution for its de-interlacing and scaling and hopefully won't have the same issues the 841 has shown via DVI. If you are in the market for a universal transport sporting DVI, you may want to wait for their newer 941 offering or look elsewhere on the market." |
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Unregistered guest | What's up everyone? Just wanted to let you guys know that www.pcmall.com is going to start shipping out the Samsung HD-941's "starting" September 12th. So far they have the best price: $239.99 I happen to work there so if anybody is ineterested in purchasing this unit, email me directly and I can hook you up with an even better price: $226.00 My email address: michaelr@pcmall.com I can also hook you guys up with great prices on everything we carry. Just let me know the manufacturer part number, and I can email you back the prices. |
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New member Username: P5surfNew York Post Number: 5 Registered: Jul-04 | *Remote Control* I know this may not be an issue with some of you who use a Univesal Remote, which includes me too - The remote control that comes with the 841 has a very short reach. Weird. My TV is no more than 20 feet from my couch but the remote for the 841 does not reach. I have to physically stand and step forward a foot or so and then it works fine. FYI the 841 unit is located on top of my Internal Projection Television with nothing blocking the path. There's no weird lighting or anything interfering with the signal. All other remotes work fine. I did have to program my TV remote to use the 841 and it works fine. The only downer about this is that some of the advanced funcationality found only on the 841 remote is no longer available to me unless I'm using their remote. |
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keno Unregistered guest | I'm hooked up and can see the dvd player menu screen just fine (hd841 and sony hx93 lcd monitor w/ dci). Not sure how but the default was already set to scan and dci in the player. Unfortunately, when i stick in a dvd, the sony lcd monitor just starts to blink black and blue after the loading. Is this the related to the HDCP issue or is there a favorable answer to this? Thanks |
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johnnytv2004 Unregistered guest | I took this Samsung back and got the Harman Kardon DVD 22. It is so much better than the Samsung DVDHD841. Ture it has no DVI but this model is progressive scan by pixel not line. This player hooked to component looks better than the DVDHD841 looked on DVI. The sound is also much better than the Sammy. And the construction is not even close, all inputs are tight and the door is so quiet and it actually opens when you hit the button. The Harman Kardon and my Sammy HLP5063W are a match made in heaven. Now that I have an HD STB from my cable co. I use the DVI for true HD viewing.. Until I get an STB with HDMI : ) lol |
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Nick H Unregistered guest | I recently purchased the HD841 to go with my new Samsung HDTV. It didn't take me too long to figure out how to switch over to get the DVI setting to stay. However, I moved earlier this week, and since hooking everything back up, I can no longer get the DVI to work. I keep attempting the same thing as before; I turn on the DVD player and the television using composite cables on Video 1, I switch the video output using the DVD menu to DVI, and then I switch my TV to DVI immediately. However, my television still can't locate a signal (I've checked the connections countless times). Any suggestions? This is extremely frustrating. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 47 Registered: Jul-04 | Well, if both units are in DVI mode, and you aren't getting a sig, I would guess that your cable is bad. Maybe a wire broke inside the cable, a pin got bent, a socket got pushed in, or something. I'd check it out with a continuity meter, or try a new cable... |
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Bruce Phillips Unregistered guest | keno: I'm having a similar problem. After doing the DVI setup OK, when I put in a (commercial) DVD, the player won't load it (errors out); this happened on all 5 DVDs I tried. Also, the audio through optical sounds awful (bitstream ON) -- I can't even get the audio TEST to run. I have the optical running directly to my Yamaha HTR-5450 (the cable works fine with my Toshiba player). My TV is an HLP-5063W. There's got to be something obvious I'm missing, or is this unit just defective? |
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New member Username: KlyonPost Number: 2 Registered: Sep-04 | Anyone else having problems with DTS audio on HD841? I have exchange unit and have same problem. Hooked up an old Toshiba cheapy with DTS and it played fine through my Onkyo 701. Samsung does not seem to officially recognize the problem- Any suggestions? |
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Unregistered guest | Hi, if some had the formula to change a region code of HD841, Thanks friends |
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New member Username: RuthenryWoodhaven, New York USA Post Number: 1 Registered: Sep-04 | Hello...Y would like to buy a HD DVD Player. My TV is a SONY GRAND WEGA 70 INCHES.... Which is the correct option: HD841/HD931/HD941 OR HD1000... Any Suggestions?---- Help me please.. Ruth. |
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Anonymous | None of the above. The Sony hd dvd players will be out soon. |
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New member Username: RuthenryWoodhaven, New York USA Post Number: 7 Registered: Sep-04 | Anonymous.. Thanks....... |
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JonD Unregistered guest | OK! Just bought an 841 (couldn't wait for the 941). It now comes with an idiot card and I had no trouble setting to the DVI output. I'm running the unit through a (self calibrated)Toshiba 42 CRT-RPTV and the picture looks fantastic. Black levels seem good with good deliniation in dark scenes and varying shades in dark fabrics etc. It may not be "technicaly" perfect but it is streets ahead of my other two p-scan players. Colour vibrancy and picture depth are both of a level that would have cost $1000+ a couple of years ago. The 841 works best at 1080i on my monitor much, much better than 720p. 1080i is the native resolution of my TV (and for that matter most CRT based HD displays) and an A-B comparison with the "elephant" scene in LOTR 3 showed noticibably better brightness, colour balance, and sharp focus than the 720p setting. DVD-Audio and SACD do work in 5.1 mode but only (as is to be expected) through the analog out connections (some DVD-Audio discs -but not SACDs-can output a high rez mix through the digital outputs but only in two channel stereo configuration, this is down to the disc not the player). You must go through the various menus to select the right audio output settings. If you're unsure how to do this, get someone knowledgable to do the set up. Sound quality is much better than regular CD. Maybe not as good as a high end player but consider the price at less than $200.00. This unit has a great feature set especially when you figure that the ex-factory price can't be more than 50-70 bucks. In order to avoid losing audio or resolution settings ALWAYS switch of the unit from the remote (i.e standby mode) if you use the panel switch you may need to reset. The 941 may be better for you. You will still lose progressive scan if you are scaling to 1080i (and the jury's out on whether you'll be able to select black levels through DVI on that unit too) also bear in mind that HDMI is only advantageous if you wish to pass audio signals through an HDMI enabled TV. If you're using the optical/coaxial digital outputs in concert with the analog 5.1 outs through a suitably equipped reciever/controller there's no benefit. Hope this helps. |
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Kevin Wolfe Unregistered guest | I've been waiting for this HD941 for quite a while and just watching everyone's comments. Well, I couldn't take it any more and went out and got the HD841 figuring it couldn't be that bad (with DVI inputs). Well, I was simply SHOCKED how much of a difference there was between the 841's DVI output and component. If you are like me and really want the DVI/HDMI input, do yourself a favor and look elsewhere or wait it out (only a few days now) till the 941 is released.... On another note, Plaxico above mentioned DCDi built into Sammy's DLPs would not work with the 841. This is not true as I was able to enable it on my HLP5063. |
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New member Username: RuthenryWoodhaven, New York USA Post Number: 8 Registered: Sep-04 | JonD Thank you very much..... |
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New member Username: RuthenryWoodhaven, New York USA Post Number: 9 Registered: Sep-04 | Kevin Wolfe I appreciate your advice but still can not take a decision Thanks. |
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Plaxico Unregistered guest | Kevin, the type of display or dvd player is irrelevant as far as DCDi is concerned on a display. Your best picture is achieved by letting the player deinterlace with DCDi BEFORE reaching your display (which is built into the 941). If your display receives a deinterlaced signal in 720p from ANY unit, then your display does not need to deinterlace as this was already done. Jacob is still confused on this aspect. The faroudja chip has other properties besides deinterlacing which you see enabled. Hence, the 941 will deint. w/ far. chip and send to display while 841 will not. The 841 is still a nice player and will take avia, etc. disks to show the difference so to most peoples' eyes there will not be a difference. In my personal opinion, the hdmi players are not worth the extra money since audio will most likely be sent to a surround sound system anyway. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 64 Registered: Jul-04 | "I was simply SHOCKED how much of a difference there was between the 841's DVI output and component. If you are like me and really want the DVI/HDMI input, do yourself a favor and look elsewhere or wait it out (only a few days now) till the 941 is released..." LoL! I tried to warn ya! Patience is a virtue... |
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Bronze Member Username: Jbagel2Orem, UT USA Post Number: 54 Registered: Jun-04 | sorry Plaxico Jacob isn't confused, the fact is, that the player does the deinterlacing with or with out the built in DCDi. with the DCDi built in to the player it takes it a step further and does some base level pulldowns and and corrilation filtering, but if your TV has the DCDi in it, it will continue the corrilation from the upconverted signal hence haveing the same effect. Please get you facts straight before you confuse everyone!!! |
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Plaxico Unregistered guest | Jacob, sorry to disagree. It will not have the same effect. Parts of the faroudja chip are disabled in the display if fed native 720p. That is why for videophiles the best picture is from a player with faroudja built in. This is my only point. The avia or other test disks are the proof. Sending the display a 1080i signal kicks in the full chip inside the display but that is not the issue here. Sorry if I ruffled your feathers. I meant no disrespect. I am interested to hear Vin's comments since many people in this thread question whether to buy the 841 or the 941. I believe me and Vin will at least agree the 941 is better than the 841. |
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cybertec Unregistered guest | Just got mine yesterday, the 841, and it is going back today for a full refund, I keep getting freezups every couple of minutes, in all modes, it plays smooth and then the picture just freezes for a split sec, then back to normal, sometimes it freezes for 2-3 sec and back to normal, it acts as if it is very sick, how can they release a products like this, don't they know that it will cost them in the long run by returns and disatisfied customers, I have a Samy HDTV LCD and love it, but this HD-DVD player is an abomination. |
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rtwaters Unregistered guest | So I've been lurking on these boards for a while now, but I still can't seem to understand this 100%... If I've got a Samsung DLP with the Faroudja chip in it, do I get any benefit at all from having a DVD player with a Faoudja chip in it, too? It seems like no, but like I said, I'm having trouble being completely clear on it. If not, then the 841 might be right up my alley, right? Thanks, Rick |
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mrtanner Unregistered guest | Double Faroudja If you're using a standard DVD player then you could use your display's Faroudja de-interlacer. However, if you're using an upconverting DVD player, the deinterlacing is done in the player and the results digitally delivered to your display, thus bypassing the display's de-interlacer. |
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MNBugeater Unregistered guest | 841 vs. 941 Please correct me if I am misunderstanding the differences in the 841 & 941, but isnt the main difference that the 941 has the Farouda chip ? And if so, If I have a Sam HLP series TV, WITH the Farouda chip, why couldn't I let the HLP utilize it's chip and then NOT buy the 941. I guess my point is that, if your TV is a Samsung with a Farouda chip, then do you really need the 941 ? Thanks Warren in MN |
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Jedi_Master_Wind Unregistered guest | It's my understanding your connection point is the real question. By using DVI input you bypass the TVs farouda chip all together so having the chip in your DVD player would be usefull. However if you run compent cables then you would be going thru the TV farouda along with the DVDs. I don't think the dual pass has a cumulative effect on the image sharpness. But don't quote me I'm still learning this as I go. |
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JonD Unregistered guest | Sorry to rain on my own parade but I'm going to have to withdraw my reccomendation of this player (the 841). Picture quality isn't the issue here. I ran an A/B comparison of the component v. DVI outputs and to my eyes the DVI was still better. I ran the same section from LOTR 3 through both outputs and on first viewing there was, to my eyes, hardly any difference (which speaks volumes for the component's quality). After this I froze the picture (for once the 841 didn't do this by itself :-)) and scoured the screen for difference. There was a clear difference in sharpness with the DVI. I could realy see the texture in some of those old sackcloth garments which, through the component outputs, simply looked like a grey fuzz. I agree the difference was subtle but I trust my eyes more than any test disc and, believe, me the diffence was there. So why am I taking the 841 back? There's a problem with the DVD-Audio playback. I'm not a digital engineer but I think it's some kind of clock/sync error. Basically if a track gltches or skips the unit loses sense of where it is. It may play to the end of the track (or it may not) but after that, although it will show the consequent track number it will output no sound and the display will continue to count as if it's still playing the previous track. The unit runs very hot and the problem gets worse the longer you use it, so maybe that's a factor. I returned the 841 for a replacement and noticed every stock item was an open box return (?) so had to go to another branch for a new one which demonstrates EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM! I guess it's asking a lot to have all this gubbins stuffed into a sub $200.00 box but Samsung claims it to work so it should work within reasonable parameters. Sorry but it just doesn't and this may be indicative of general reliabitly issues. So now I'm stuck. The 941 may show a better picture but it's still more myth than reality and I want to, at least, evaluate it now. The Bravo D2 seems to offer great video but no high-rez audio. Next up is the Marantz 6400 which I'm confident will perform it's audio tasks with aplomb. It's component output has similarly been praised but it doesn't have DVI and that sharpness is seductive. Or do I bite the bullet and (let visa) shell out $1500+ on an Arcam Diva which has all the tricks and will probably perform them faultlessly till way beyond my time on earth? My experience with anything mid-to-high end that I promised myself I could never afford (H/K AVR 7200 amp, Breitling wristwatch etc.) is that, at the end of the day, they just WORK! Yes, there's always further levels but you reach a point where you can buy something , forget about it and just get down to the business of enjoying the thing. Given that most of you have spent thousands on your displays why not get something that will drive them to the limits and give you stelllar soundtrack and audio performance as well. It may hurt for now but you'll get over it. I welcome your comments. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 66 Registered: Jul-04 | Personally, I like Denon players, but then again, you're 'talking' to a guy that's running a $70 Philips DVP642 on his GWIII. I'm perfectly happy with it, for now, until I can test drive a 941... Still, you might want to check the Denon line out: Denon Introduces New Line of High-Performance DVD Players FOR 2004 They make Sammy players look like toys... |
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JonD Unregistered guest | Thanks for that tip VinDSL. The Denon 2910 looks like the perfect player for me. It's offering all the features of the 941 (and then some) and I'll bet it will be several notches up the reliability scale. Yea it's twice the price of the 941 but I'm willing to pay to save the hassle of getting behind my equipment rack, unplugging 10 cables and driving to Best Buy once a week. And unlike the Arcam I won't need to mortgage my dog. I think I'm sold. |
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Bronze Member Username: JrestSt. Louis, Missouri USA Post Number: 66 Registered: Jun-04 | The Denon doesn't come with the HDMI cable does it? I know the samsung 841 came with the dvi cable, because my friend bought one and the picture quality was phenomenal. |
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Bronze Member Username: JrestSt. Louis, Missouri USA Post Number: 67 Registered: Jun-04 | The Denon 1910 doesn't come with the HDMI cable does it? I know the samsung 841 came with the dvi cable, because my friend bought one and the picture quality was phenomenal. |
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Bronze Member Username: VindslPost Number: 67 Registered: Jul-04 | Cables are cheap, as long as you don't get them at places like Best Buy, Circuit City, CompUSA, et cetera. They are high markup, high profit items at these stores, and you really get taken to the cleaners if you buy them there! For instance, you can pick up a 3-meter HDMI cable at Pacific Custom Cable for 34 bones... DVI cables are even cheaper... |
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Kevin Wolfe Unregistered guest | Not sure how good they are on quality (mine are on order, will get here in a few days), but SVideo.com has some fantastic prices on cables. $17 for a 10' HDMI/DVI cable, $7.50 for optical cables... Oh, and free shipping Hate to sound like their marketing rep, but yea, good deals. |
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Bronze Member Username: Jbagel2Orem, UT USA Post Number: 55 Registered: Jun-04 | you should try Cablestogo.com as well great prices lots of choices |
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Bronze Member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 14 Registered: Jul-04 | I agree with Vin on not getting soaked for DVI cables. Ram Electronics 2M cable is working fine for me. I understand that runs over 15 FT can start to benefit from higher grade cables. |
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JonD Unregistered guest | Don't get ripped off on cables. There are plenty of small electronic componenet stores offering off-brand quality cables for 40-60% cheaper than the big guys. MarVac in Southern California is one example but there's a host of others. Parts Express is a great mail order place for components, I use them a lot. There is a benefit to using quality cable with analog connections but this is all relative. Anyone paying $400.00 for a one meter RCA cable (they do exist) needs their head examined. You might try buying some Belden cable off the roll and soldering the plugs on yourself. This is how I make my analog hook-ups. In this way you can make cables to exact specification (shortest length is always the best) and have a bit of old-school fun on the way. It's not that hard once you try it plus it's satisfying to know you've done the work. Regarding DVI cables you can probably use a standard DVI (running under 20 bucks) for anything up to 4 metres (13 feet). There may be some signal loss in longer lenghts which could be offset with a higher grade cord but even then we are talking minimal degrees. Remember that a digital link is carrying nothing but numbers, bytes of digital information for the end-user (in this case your TV) to decode. It's either there or it ain't. I read an article about a bunch of "experts" comparing toslink and coaxial digital hook ups in a blind test. A digital engineer claimed they were deluding themselves and put his theory to the test. After much deliberation (not to mention wasting a perfectly good Saturday afternoon) they all concluded that one cable offered vastly superior performance to the rest. Was it the "hand woven by Afghan nubiles" Meta-cord? Nope it was the one that came in the box with a 90 dollar DVD player ;-) Don't forget that, because profit margins on domestic appliances are so small these days, your Best Buy or Circuit City salesperson is making their commission by selling you expensive cables and extented warranties. You can't blame them for wanting to make a buck but forewarned is forearmed. I'm glad Jamie's friend got a great picture with his 841. I never wanted to suggest that the 841 wasn't a great DVD player. For the money it is a nice, DVI enabled, unit but then so is the Bravo D2 and, no doubt, Denon's $250.00 model 1910 will be too. However I'm an audio fan too so I wanted a universal player that could handle DVD-Audio and SACD as well. In theory the Samsung does this but in practice it keeps failing to perform. Two units suffering the same problem is one unit too many for me. |
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Unregistered guest | Has anyone picked up a new 941? If so how is the color (black crush) with the DVI. Does the 941 come with a DVI cable? |
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New member Username: RuthenryWoodhaven, New York USA Post Number: 10 Registered: Sep-04 | Hello everybody: Is it better or NOT to use "Digital Audio Coaxial Cables" for connect (5.1) DVD player to A/V receiver... Any Suggestion?. Thanks. Ruth. |
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Kevin Wolfe Unregistered guest | Better to use Dig. Coax cables as opposed to what? In general (i.e. cable lengths <= 10'), if you are dealing with digital signals, any cable will work, so long as you aren't trying to plug a round cable into a square jack (figuratively and litterally). |
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Bronze Member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 15 Registered: Jul-04 | I believe there is a definite difference between using a cable designed for digital transmission verses an analog interconnect cable. On the other hand I would not go crazy on spending a lot of money on a digital Coax cable. I find the Monster low end brand does a passable job especially for DVD Movies. I also prefer Digital Coax to toslink optical connections. |
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A Non E Muss Unregistered guest | While I haven't tried out the cables myself, I'm fairly certain a "10001010" over a dig coax cable is the same as a "10001010" over an analog RCA cable. If you want to get technical, there is no such thing as digital as both are just carrying analog voltages representing a digital signal. I'm not sure if counts for anything, but I also did just graduate w/ an electrical engineering degree. |
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Bronze Member Username: RuthenryWoodhaven, New York USA Post Number: 11 Registered: Sep-04 | TO All Of You Thank you very much... Ruth |
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By Nair Ee Unregistered guest | 138 by any other name is still 138 |
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Robert Harley Unregistered guest | Ruth, to connect 5.1 audio from your dvd player to your receiver you can use a coaxial cable which is in electrical form or a TosLink cable which is in pulses of light. Despite the apparent "high-tech" nature of TosLink connection, it is sonically inferior to the coaxial electrical connection. |
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JonD Unregistered guest | Hope I didn't cause any uneccessary confusion here. The test I referred to above was a test of various cables both toslink (optical) and coaxial designed to transmit digital information. The engineer contendted that, barring physical breakdown or mis-manufacture, they should all produce identical results. The outcome seems to support this. To answer Ruth. Yes (in 98% of cases)you will need to use EITHER a toslink or a coaxial cable to transfer the digital soundtrack from your DVD to your 5.1 reciever or amplifier (your equipment may allow the use of either or both types). DVD-Audio and SACD are however (again in 98% of cases, denon link and firewire excepted with DVD-Audio) decoded in the player and will need to be transferred by a series of six analog cables (five channels plus subwoofer) to a suitably equipped amplifier, which most are these days. Analog cables are more sensitive to construction issues and, depending on your sensitivity to these things, can make a small or vast difference in the quality of information they transmit. The smallest diffence is our aim so that what comes out of one end of the cord is as near as possible what went in the other. Here's a simple analogy (no pun intended). If you live over the road from me and I email you a picture from my digital camera, when you open the file your computer reconstructs the data and presents a pretty much identical image to the one I'm seeing. If however I get a super powerful light projector and point it through your window at your wall, the image you see will still be the picture but will be degraded by having to pass through the lens, pollution in the atmosphere between our houses, reflection from your glass and other factors. That (plesae don't shot me boffins and Phd's) is the difference between digital and analog transmission. I think (and not without experience) that there is an optimum point to be reached when buying analog cables beyond which you are deluding yourself. Bear in mind that the recording studio that made the music you're listening to probably used pro-grade but reasonably priced hook ups and that as that is the ultimate source (I'm a record producer) you cannot improve on their performance. It is an inherent factor (or flaw)in the source material. The best you can hope to do is faithfully replicate it and I don't know one recording engineer who would spend more that $30.00 tops for an RCA patch cord bearing in mind they probably need to use about 200 of them. |
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Bronze Member Username: TimclarkPost Number: 16 Registered: Jul-04 | Jon I don't think there was any confusion, I just felt the initial response to Ruth's question was a bit terse. (not from you but from Kevin Wolfe). I totally advocate not spending a bundle on cables as like all things there is a point of diminishing returns. My personal experience with digital audio has taugh me that using a cheap RCA terminated cable for digital even at short distances is not a good idea. Using a $200 RCA terminated cable for a short distance is an equally bad idea. For digital, unlike data comm, if you miss a few bits the music doesn't stop, it just doesn't sound right. |
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Unregistered guest | Has anyone had problems retaining the settings on their HD841? I'm not talking about the "do you want to keep these settings" "10-second" procedure; I go through this process and am able to watch on both DVI and 780p for days with no problems. The issue is that occasionally (randomly but averaging once every week or so) all the custom settings (speaker setup for analog output, DVI, P/I-scan settings, parental controls, etc) seem to get blown away and reset to default settings - disabling DVI and creating other annoyances. I'm OK with reprogramming occasionally (annoyed but OK). But I can't handle the frantic calls at work from my wife when this has happens while an army of neighborhood kids are demanding to watch Nemo and the video is inoperative. FYI, i am running all AV components thru an unswitched monsterpower source, so the unit always has power. |
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Bronze Member Username: Mr_lynchSeattle, WA Post Number: 33 Registered: Sep-04 | I had to many issues with my Samsung 841 so I returned it for the Toshiba SD-5970. It upscales and has an HDMI output and also included the cable. I've had a great expirience with it so far. None of the issues I had with the Sammy. With the Sammy I had disc read errors often enough to want to throw it out the window. The DVI output was not as good as it should have been and my setting kept returning to "default" about once a week. When I returned the unit, there were 6 other "open box" 841s on the shelves. I guess I'm not the only one disappointed with the Sammy player. |
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Unregistered guest | Just picked up my Denon DVD 2910. I have to say it is all I could ever want in a source component. Picture quality (even at 480p component) is stunning and sound output from all sources digital/analog, CD, SACD an DVD-Audio is several classes above the Samsung. If you can afford the price hike over the Samsung units I can wholeheartedly reccomend this unit without reservation. Buy it and forget about about. |
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Dazed & Confused Unregistered guest | Hi guys, I have a Monster HDMI Cable for sale if anybody is intersted. Monster is selling it for $149.95 & the cheapest I've seen elsewhere was over $100. I'm selling mine for only $90.00 with no shipping charges/taxes. This item is brand new in original box & packaging. The length is 4 meter or 13.12 feet. Please email me if you are intersted: michaelr@pcmall.com By the way, the HD941 is crap. We were supposed to get them in over 2 months ago but still no word from Samsung??? I am tired of waiting & am not willing to invest in the HD841 because of all the complaits on that unit. What I would recommend for all you guys is the LG LST-3510A. It is a DVD player that upconverts the picture to almost HD picture. The connection is DVI-D & Component. PLUS!!! it has a built in HD tuner. It's like a freaking dream come true!!!! You can watch almost HD quality DVD movies AND also watch HD channels. DID I MENTION IT HAS A HD TUNER BUILT-IN??? The only drawback is that you cannot play SACD or DVD-Audio. We don't carry it here @ PC Mall so I'm stuck paying full price. So far the price is the same everywhere: $399.00 Best Buy has it @ that price....you can save on shipping if you have one close by. I'm going to pick mine up around November 15th & will post back here my reactions. Let me know about the cable if anybody is interested. Thanks. |
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Unregistered guest | Alright, I picked up the LG-LST3510A from BestBuy for $360 (had a 10% off coupon) last week. Right away I was very impressed with the HD signals that I was getting with a cheap $20 antenna. I never realized how beautiful HD signals were. Then I played the DVD player....WOW! The picture quality was almost the same as the HD channels. The one thing that stood out the most for this DVD player was the brightness of the colors...you can say they were much more vivid (especially compared to my previous DVD player: Samsung P341). Last night I watched Chronicles of Riddick....you really have to experience the quality of the picture because I don't have any words to describe it. IT WAS THAT GOOD!!! Right now I am using some JVC component cables. I already placed an order for a DVI-D cable from Monster. I'm hoping that the picture quality will be even better once I hook it up via DVI-D. I will let you guys know. By the way, I also placed an order for another Monster product: Reference PowerCenter HTS 3500 MKII with Clean Power Stage 3 v2.0 I've heard great things about this item so I'm going to see if there is any truth to the hype. I will post my reactions once I get a chance to check it out. If any of you guys have this unit then please give me your feedback. Feel free to contact me also if any of you have questions: michaelr@pcmall.com Michael out..... |
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Unregistered guest | Guys - thanks for an interesting forum! I'm in the UK have a Themescene H56 projector with DVI, without HDCP. Thought I'd like to try a cheapy DVD with DVI or HDMI if only could override the HDCP. In the UK Samsung sold an HD935 which I think was the equivalent of the US HD931? Anyhow, there was a published hack that turned OFF the HDCP encoding! http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-bin/displayreview.php?reviewid=4025 See the practical tips box lower left. Anyhow, they've been unavailable since shortly after the review. Waited for the UK HD945 (aka US HD941?) to see if the same hack worked. Just taken delivery but trouble to get anything out the DVI (via HDMI convertor). Have 941 deliveries started in the US? Any views on the pic quality? Anyone aware the 931/935 HDCP hack? Anyone found one for the 941/945? |
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New member Username: BeardawgPost Number: 1 Registered: Feb-05 | I have a DishNetwork 811 receiver and I am having the same problem with my 60PW9363. I am in the process of writing a serious letter to Philips voicing my "opinion" on their lack of knowledge of THEIR products... They can't tell me what will or won't work this this monitor... Don't they have a Testing and Validation group?!? |
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Unregistered guest | I just have a simple quick question. Will the HD841 support the 720p, 768p, and 1080i Upconversion over a Component Output to a Projection HDTV Widescreen? My Panasonic Widescreen HDTV does support up to 1080i HDTV and only has component inputs. Will the HD841 upsample over this?? I had a tech a both CC and BB tell me that it would but for some reason I'm just not sure. I have it hooked up with quality Monster Component cables but when I hit the botton to change the HD resolutions I do not see a difference. Thanks in advance for any answer you can provide. |
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Bronze Member Username: Jbagel2Orem, UT USA Post Number: 61 Registered: Jun-04 | no it doesn't do the upconversion out the component only the dvi.... what panisonic do you have... most panisonics will not do 720p or 768p only 1080i.???? |
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Anonymous | seems to me everyone is in OVERKILL. everyone is spending way too much money on all these lcd, plasma and hdtv products to get the PERFECT picture and it seems that everyone has some sort of problem, i just hooked up my dvd841 player to my tv and its terrible. picture is crystal clear but it suffers from "black crush" BIGTIME . picture seems better with component cables making this dvd player a WASTE OF MY MONEY. very simply a 40" sony xbr tube television and a good progressive scan dvd player coupled with digital cable or directv sattelite works beautiful. and saves thousands of dollars to put towards something else in life. are we all fooled by the words HIGH DEFINITION? maybe its better, but is it worth $5000 more? seems all the electronic companies have brainwashed us into giving them thousands and thousands of dollars.HENCE THEY GET RICHER AND WE ARE ALL ON THESE SITES TRYING TO HELP EACH OTHER FIGURE OUT EACH OTHERS PROBLEMS. I MAKE GOOD ENUF MONEY TO PAY THOUSANDS IN CASH FOR MY ELECTRONICS AND IM STILL PISSED I WASTED SO MUCH MONEY ON THEM. my sony wega worked great and i was happy with its picture before i got "tricked" into "HDTV". my advice save your "mortgage payment" your spending each month to watch television with and use it what it was intended for......A GOOD PIECE OF REAL ESTATE!!!! |
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Silver Member Username: VindslPost Number: 145 Registered: Jul-04 | "...i just hooked up my dvd841 player to my tv and its terrible. picture is crystal clear but it suffers from "black crush" BIGTIME. picture seems better with component cables..." I know ppl don't have time to read through 240 posts, but I warned of this above, so let this be another reminder! Sammy 841's seem to work fine on Sammy TV's via DVI, but for everyone else, look elsewhere for your DVD solution. Either that, or be prepared to use component cables... |
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Unregistered guest | I just picked up the HD841 for about 120 bucks with shipping included. We own a Toshiba HDX 57" HDTV. I was running a Pioneer DVD player for about a year and a half. It was a thin silver one, can't remember the name. The progressive mode was a joke; all I'd see were scan lines every time an actor made a jerky movement. Audio quality seemed decent. When I run my own little tests, I usually pop in the THX Optimizer on Monsters Inc. and make some basic contrast and color adjustments. I set up the HD841 in about 10 minutes. Prog+DVI mode in Mode A for now. I did a frame freeze on a shadowy scene. There was a hair of a difference, literally, in the dark areas, where some kid's hair had a few more brown strands. And there was a little bit of noise in complex textures most likely due to the upconversion. But the pros far outweigh the cons. Much higher contrast, sharper lines. During a test of the opening Shire scene in the Fellowship of the Rings, I kept A>B'ing (much to the chagrin of my girlfriend), and I couldn't believe how much more vibrant the greens were in the grass. As for any complaints about the audio, I was going crazy and panicking at first because the DTS wasn't working. Well, for some stupid reason, DTS is turned off by default. Turn off the compression unless you need to keep your dynamic range down. Looks good to me. |
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Unregistered guest | I just got one of these 841s today. With the new firmware most of the problems seem to be corrected. BTB may not be 100%, but the DVI looks great on my HLN437W. I did the region-free hack with my Palm so now I can watch all my Region 2 and Region 3 discs. Before anyone decides NOT to get an 841, pick one up at Costco for $99 - I think BestBuy has it for $99 too, make sure you have the latest firmware (you should on any gotten now) and try it. |
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Silver Member Username: VindslPost Number: 178 Registered: Jul-04 | ...and make sure 'they' have a liberal return policy! |
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