I really need help...
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 1 Registered: Jul-08 | So I've been coming to this website and reading all your posts for quite some time now. I finally got approval from the wife on a budget and I need your help. I have 3 JL 10w6 subs in a sealed box in an 04 Suburban and it's not working out. They are getting power from a Pheonix gold 1200 watt amp and backup from an AlumaPro 5 farad cap. I worked two of them to death and (obviously) I need more. I want the loudest SQ subs I can. Box size is not necessarily an issue, but I must keep the third row in the truck and I've decided to go ported (7db gain, right?). I was thinking 2 JL13w7 with 2 1000.1 amps, Focal all around for components, the JL 4 channel and a 1 channel for a 10w0 for midbass up front in the factory installed location. I have approval for $6k total. Here's my delimna: I have been to three shops and all are recommending different things. One says RE XXX or the 13w7, one says RF, and one says Boston Acoustics (?). I thought the 13w7 was THE speaker. So I open it up to all of you... you're way more in touch with this stuff than I am. I need: A LOT of bass for both hard rock (punchy, accurate) and rap (as low and loud as possible to annoy the wife), components, 4 amps, and $1k left over for alternator, battery, and some flashy (but not overtly) custom install. I'm hoping you can help. So far the shops are under budget but I am not confident in any of them. Your advice? Thanks in advance for your opinions and how's that for a long winded first post? I really need help... |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 2 Registered: Jul-08 | bump |
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Gold Member Username: MgbcsMaple Grove, Minnesota Post Number: 2590 Registered: Dec-06 | Wow, all I can say is I hope I have a wife that gives "approval" for a $6K install. Alright, so basically you want a SQ/SQL system from the ground up on a $6K budget? You will have tons of options if that is the case, and you probably won't be buying JL. Do you have a headunit you'll be using already? |
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Silver Member Username: SilvermoparNebraska Post Number: 129 Registered: Aug-06 | Wow 6k! And I though my $800 Kicker System was cool. |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 764 Registered: May-07 | h.o. alt 2-15 RE xxx 8cu.ft @33 hz 2- aq2200 2-3 bat's dont skimp on frontstage... Focal FTW! Too expensive for me. sound deadner I Love the SQ of the XXX's. and 2 should be all you need.. They are fu(kin' loud as well! just an option |
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Platinum Member Username: Rovin1 15 = 149.5 DBsTrinidad & T... Post Number: 14031 Registered: Jul-05 | even 1 XXX is plenty but get 2 & u wont want anything more in a hurry ..... |
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Bronze Member Username: Beamerboy46350LaPorte, IN United States Post Number: 85 Registered: Jun-08 | Im trying to get 600 out of my wife !! |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 3 Registered: Jul-08 | BCS - I have a Pioneer AVIC D1. I hate it but a new one would take away a big chunk of my budget. And yes, SQ wins over SPL but I want it loud. Mark - will 15s be punchy enough for both rap and hard rock (Korn, Tool, etc.) and I know I can get 8cu. ft. back there (50"w x 25"d x 16"h) Sound deadners - I don't want to sound like a bag of aluminum cans being tossed down the street. I agree. Why did one shop say Boston Acoustics? They weren't even on my radar! |
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Platinum Member Username: Nyyfan1315 Mag USA Post Number: 10064 Registered: Jul-06 | The shop said Boston Acoustics because that is they carry and want to sell. I'm guessing they suggested the G5 which is a great sounding sub. As for the size of subs, the only difference is the size of sub and how much air it moves. A quality 18" will keep up fine with rock music. So 2 15"s will be fine. If I were about to buy sound deadener, and I am, I would buy Second Skin or Raammat http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/conclusion/ |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 767 Registered: May-07 | Boston Acoustic's G5 is a good SQ sub but not even close to the XXX's IMO. He is just trying to make a sale as Yank's stated. $1000 + should be spent on electrical upgrades... It's a MUST if you want to run that kind of power.. good luck |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 4 Registered: Jul-08 | Here's my current setup:    |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 775 Registered: May-07 | nice starting point for sure! |
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Platinum Member Username: WingmanaliveA pic is worth 1000 posts!! Post Number: 17521 Registered: Jun-06 | Wow. Can't say I've seen a sub buried behind the dash b4. How did that work for you? |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 776 Registered: May-07 | also look at the IDMAX's also.. another great and loud SQ sub. |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 5 Registered: Jul-08 | Mark, thanks for all your help in this. I am leaning more toward the xxx because I've heard it from you, the shop, and reviews online. The 15 seems so extreme but I've only ever had 10's so I think I might take you up on that. I got a quote of $750 each on the JL13w7 - how does the 15 xxx compare? I don't trust any of these guys at the shop and I'm really out of the loop anymore. Side note: do I need that many batteries? I planned on 1 additional under the hood and an alternator plus my cap and I was hoping that would do it. My concern is that 3 or 4 batteries would have to be put somewhere in the truck and I don't want that. This is the family station wagon too! Paul, the suburban came with a factory installed sub there (I think an 8"). So we took it out and put in a 10w0 because of mounting depth issues. One shop says it makes no difference, the other says it wasn't tuned correctly, and one says it may actually cancel out some of the sound from the back. That's why I'm here - unbiased advice from the guys who I think know this stuff best. |
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Gold Member Username: Mike11202RE MT 15 VFL 200.1 , Sewell, NJ US Post Number: 1814 Registered: Nov-06 | I say get 2 15" Audiopulse Revo's and a 3kw amp. I've used the JBL w12gti, JL 12w7, JL 13w6, Soundsplinter RL-s 12", Lighting Audio storm v1 12", Stereo Integrity BM 12", Digital Designs 9515g, RE MT 15, Fi Q 15, Alpine Type R 10" and probably more that i forgot. The TC Sounds platform is my favorite for SQ that gets pretty loud. It was found in my Soundplinter RL-S and Lightning audio storm they are both my favorite subs I've owned and ever heard. They have the best low-end of any sub mentioned, it has definition to it unlike most subs. Go for the Audiopulse Revo's |
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Gold Member Username: CtmikeCt. Post Number: 6367 Registered: Feb-06 | i say 4 of these: http://www.diycable.com/main/product_info.php?cPath=24_93&products_id=653 ,ran off a pair of alpine pdx1000.1s'. |
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Gold Member Username: JakeyplaysbassSt. Louis, MO / ASU Post Number: 3171 Registered: Jul-05 | If your willing to drop 3-3.5k on the frontstage/substage i can get you an amazing deal on hertz audio stuff. It would be 2 15s and a 2 way (or 2) or 3 way. That would leave you 1.5-2k on amps and electrical and 500-1000 on install. It would blow your mind. PM me if you want to talk or my AIM is jakeyplaysbass26. |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 795 Registered: May-07 | RE XXX > JL13w7 IMO "Side note: do I need that many batteries? I planned on 1 additional under the hood and an alternator plus my cap and I was hoping that would do it" no you dont need that many batteries. But 2 is the minimum.. Both need to be a good Audio series drycell batts if you are only running 2.. Kenetic, SVR, Optima, BatCap, Oddessy just to name a few. side note to your side note..... DITCH THE CAPACITOR.... NOT NEEDED! lol |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 7934 Registered: Jul-06 | XXX > all And bigger systems than that have been run on one battery. 2 is not a minimum. |
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Silver Member Username: RidinspinnasWindsor, Ontario Canada Post Number: 312 Registered: May-06 | yeah go with the xxx, and post some vids when u get the system going |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 803 Registered: May-07 | two would be the minimum for me... |
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Gold Member Username: FrkkevinTeam DLSSuperNatural... Post Number: 5316 Registered: Nov-05 | I run a single XXX 15" in my SQ install.. keeps up great.. but don't buy the new one.. you'll have to source out two used 04/05 XXX models.. looking at around $700 shipped for a pair in good shape if you go buying used.. you'd looking at over $1g a sub for the new XXXs, they are not worth it. the old ones are the ones to get you could always go with 3 of the new SI Mag 12"s.. the used xbl^2 tech so they should sound as good as the old XXXs hertz would be a good choice for components, i don't suggest focal since the highs are way too bright. another option for for components i'd recommend is DLS, Dynaudio, Morel, Rainbow, ect two 04/05 XXX 15"s on 3000rms would probably be loud enough for you to want to turn it down yet sound so good all the way up  |
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Silver Member Username: RidinspinnasWindsor, Ontario Canada Post Number: 320 Registered: May-06 | any final decisions dude? |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 6 Registered: Jul-08 | Update: Work has been pretty crazy so I wasn't really able to focus on this but I think I've made a decision and thank you for all your help. Please let me know if I'm wrong in my thinking but here goes: The shop said to go with MX for SQ and I told him about what you guys said and he said the XXX is like the MX on steroids. So it's unanimous - I'm going with 2 15" XXX subs. We talked with RE and they recommended 2 AX 2000 US Amps (same manufacturer right? - so of course they did) but I think they will have plenty of power. I was quoted 2 sets of Focal 6.5" components and a pair of 4" for the rear. I had some room left in the budget so I asked about the K2 and Utopia lines but the price went up crazy fast. I asked if there was anything in between the PolyGlass and the K2 and he recommended Hertz. Of course, Hertz was recommended here so I took him up on it. 2 sets of the Mille MLK 165 and Hertz for the 4" in my rear pillars. The JL up front has to go and be replaced with RE and the SL isn't out yet so I think we're going with the RE SR (sealed) in the dash. We're putting a Kinetik HC1800 under the hood and I have to replace my alternator before installation (any help or thoughts on that one?) And finally, for the install. I came up with this one, so tell me if I'm retarded. A plexiglass front to see inside the box. Black slot ports. I can't do fiberglass for the box because it wouldn't be strong enough but I like the look so they will be sending the box out to have the inside painted to match the exterior white paint. They are going to try to fiberglass the edges of the inside to give it a curved, fiberglass look. Blue LED lights for night time affect. Amps flush mounted on top with vinyl and carpet stitching cover and a rounded edge on all the wood for appearance. I feel like A Night at the Roxbury... "Make the inside look like the outside". But I'm White/Black/Chrome outside, right? So the only thing left to do... send the amps out to be chromed. Budget: The shop quoted me $6,500 for parts and labor. $300 for paint and upholstery. That leaves me $1,200 for an alternator and chrome on the amps. I've committed to giving them 8 days to dial it in. Thank you so much for your help and Chris, of course I will post pics and video when it's ready. You guys helped so much on this. Let me know if I'm off in any of my thinking - I will commit next week to this and (maybe) this will be the last system ever for me. If not, I have to find another forum to save me from a wife that wants to kill me! |
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Gold Member Username: CtmikeCt. Post Number: 6421 Registered: Feb-06 | for alts., you could try ohio gen. and mean green, those are the two i always hear as the best (but you'll pay for it). also powermaster i've read is good, and a few others but can't think of them atm. and mechman to. oh, and what are you doing with that xenon amp now that you're getting new ones? |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 7 Registered: Jul-08 | Ctmike - I'm looking up those alternators now. As far as the amp, I have no idea. It was good to me - it's the subs that broke down and it's a lot newer than they are. Do you want it? I don't know what info you want on it but let me know and you can have it for a steal. |
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Gold Member Username: Kpa2727Old Bridge, NJ USA ! Post Number: 1415 Registered: May-07 | if u want really really spot on advice be on the look out for chad lee, hes seen it all , heard it all, owned it all and can prob answer even more questions. |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 884 Registered: May-07 | I am glad you decided on the XXX's.. They are an amazing SQL sub! Did you consider the sound deadner... That ride of your is gonna flex like crazy and likely expose some rattles that your 10's couldn't.As for your decription for the enclosure.. Well it sounds like a nice setup, but be sure you really trust the builder/ installer to get the specs correct as well as tuning to get the most outta those subs. If done improperly you will not get everything outta those subs( and likely not be aware of it) So yes, they can sound THAT GOOD! Execpt nothing less. lol Especially if they are charging you top dollar for the build/install.It doesn't hurt to ask questions about how they are coming up with tuning,ect.. of the enclosure. As for the Bat(s), In our 1999 suburban install on the drivers side battery tray we were only able to fit the HC1400 on its side as_s end first w/o the bat tie down.. We tried the next size up and could not get it to fit. Make sure the fusing and wiring is done correctly also. Make sure the "big 3" is done when adding H.O. Alt. You would be suprised about how many local installers that dont't even know what the big 3 is.. Again, don't be afraid to ask them questions, whether or not you know the answers to them or not.. I test them w/o them knowing even knowing it. lol please keep us posted. |
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Gold Member Username: CtmikeCt. Post Number: 6423 Registered: Feb-06 | james, i was just curious as to if you're going to keep the amp or sell it. if you do sell how much you want for it? i mean, with all that high end stuff you just bought, you should sell that crap amp dirt cheap (maybe to me), it's not worth much |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 8 Registered: Jul-08 | Mark - I did insist on a sound deadner. It rattles a bit now - I know it will be worse. As far as the install, I really don't have any idea. There was a Lamborghini in their bay today so I can only assume they know what they're doing and they picked the same equipment as everybody here. From what I understand about the port I intend to make sure that they tune it lower than the frequency of the sub but I don't know too much more. I will honestly ask as many questions as possible before turning over my truck to them. Batteries - I was planning on keeping the stock and adding the Kinetic. Should I replace the stock battery as well? What's the big 3? |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 9 Registered: Jul-08 | ctmike - it's yours if you want it. I will take pictures, but is there anything else you want to know about it? Trust me, I know what I spent but I know that used car stereo is a crap shoot.. I was serious when I said a steal. It's not worth anything to me sitting in a box like my old system. Besides - pay it forward, right? |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 885 Registered: May-07 | James.. You got mail. |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 886 Registered: May-07 | Oops Forgot.. I would recommend the XXX's enclosure be tuned to 32- 33 hz. Ge6t other opinions if you would like. |
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Gold Member Username: CtmikeCt. Post Number: 6424 Registered: Feb-06 | james, let me know if you really want to get rid of the amp. and remember, i got dibs! |
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Diamond Member Username: BestmankindPost Number: 22051 Registered: Oct-05 | nice james. got the pm. but looks like you got it all figured out. in that car with the money you have to invest, i would of done 4 jl 13w7 with 4 jl 1000/1. let the bashing begin. |
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Diamond Member Username: BestmankindPost Number: 22052 Registered: Oct-05 | front stage: dls nobelium 3 way front stage amp: jl 450/4 and jl 300/2 so you can run the comp set active. for processor i would of got alpine rux-c701 and alpine pxa-h701. now if you were to get a compatible indash for the pxa-h701 then you wouldn't need the rux-c701. |
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Platinum Member Username: Nyyfan1315 Mag USA Post Number: 10129 Registered: Jul-06 | ^^noob...... JK Chad. |
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New member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 10 Registered: Jul-08 | I need help (again). I have a 105 amp alternator. GM makes a 145 amp that I can find and that auto shops will put in. They said if I went bigger than factory, they won't warranty the work if other fuses pop. No stereo store that I went to offered alternators or installed them (they all have "a guy"). Is a 145 amp alternator enough or should I go to Jose working out of his house? |
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Gold Member Username: CtmikeCt. Post Number: 6429 Registered: Feb-06 | 145a alt. is no where near enough. find someone that'll install it for you. most shops should do it. if i was you, have the big 3 done before having the ho alt. installed, unless the shop you find to do the alt. also knows about this (most around me don't). shouldn't cost much for the install, just whatever there hourly rate is. unless something needs modded. and whenever you decide to trash that pg amp, let me know. |
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Silver Member Username: Hittin1Lake Charles, La. United States Post Number: 892 Registered: May-07 | If you want to get the full 4000 Wrms. You will likely need at least 220 amp alt. I would recommend a 300 amp alternator. I was running a factory 132 amp alt with 4000 wrms and the voltage drop was terrible.. Which was expected. hope this helps. |
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Gold Member Username: Kingandsons07Lincoln, NE TEAM RD U.S.A Post Number: 1098 Registered: Feb-07 | Big 3= run 1/0 wire from the + of ur batt to the + of the alt. then u run 1/0 from ur batt - to ur chaise clen the chaise good too for a good grand!! now run 1/0 from ur alt i just hook on were it bolts down to the frame then run it to the chaise clen it too and thats the big 3 it helps out alot |
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Bronze Member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 11 Registered: Jul-08 | The car gets dropped off tomorrow. I went with a 250 amp alternator that got installed today. I still saw voltage drop on my current setup at idle. We'll see what the second battery does. I have no idea where the new battery will go and the wife is freaking out about the size of the box. This could get ugly. Keep you posted. |
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Bronze Member Username: JamesdoeTustin, CA USA Post Number: 12 Registered: Jul-08 | Picked up the car today and one of the AX 2000 US Amps caught fire before we played anything. And I am not s***ing. Thanks to the plexi front on the new ones, we could actually see it was glowing red! Now my car smells like burned plastic. The tech was going to cut the power line - he was pretty freaked. The shop needs to install the ring on the xxx because we can hear air escaping... so it's back to the shop for round 2 and some fine tuning. On another note - the Pioneer AVIC D1 sucks a55! My calibration is off and I don't know how to fix it. I can't find the menu anywhere and there's not really any help online. All I know is that I have to do something like hold down 12 buttons at a time and do a backflip to get into the setup menu. Any suggestions? |
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