Naim system with Audio Physic
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 87 Registered: Nov-07 | After reading Ed W. post, I am thinking of changing my speakers for something new... Here is my system: NAC102/NAP108/CD5i/Totem Sttafs. I've read a lot of positive comments on the Audio Physic speakers from Stu's posts. I want to try them on my system. What do you think of the Audio Physic Tempo with my system? Will they like each other? Thanks. |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 2880 Registered: May-05 | The only APs I've heard are the Yaras. I'm not too familiar with the Sttafs. I'd love to help you out, but that's the best I can do. FWIW, I think the Yaras would sound great on a Naim system. |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 121 Registered: Apr-08 | Ioc, Go to the Naim forum and do a search for Sttafs. Also search for "Staffs" as some dont know how to spell. There are many Naim kits with Totems at the end. It seems a reasonable combination. Keep in mind though that most Totem floorstanders might need a little more punch than a 180 can offer. They can tell you more. But I assume the response will be, "you at least need a 250" -Patrick |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 88 Registered: Nov-07 | The Sttafs sound great in my system. I don't think the 180 doesn't have enough power for the Sttafs. I've never turn the volume pass the 10 o'clock mark, too lound! I just want to get a little more "punch" although the Sttafs sound excellence on most music, they still a little "weak" on dance/trance music that I sometime listen to! I just want to try some different brand before I decide the Sttafs will stay or leave. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 89 Registered: Nov-07 | I prefer floor standing speakers as my wife "hates" bookshelf type! |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 10510 Registered: Dec-04 | Cheers to LOC's wife!!! |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 7260 Registered: Feb-05 | Most women hate the floorstanders, my ex actually didn't like standmounts either...she called them "lunch boxes on sticks"...oh my. My present wife, sensibly, likes (or dislikes) each equally. I'd love to help Loc however what you're looking to do with your speakers isn't anything I would do so I really haven't listened for that sound. I'll bet those big Revels would do that music justice! |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 90 Registered: Nov-07 | One time I heard the Snell type E (?) speakers at a place and they sound very good with the Rotel system. Anyone has experience with Snell? |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 7262 Registered: Feb-05 | I've heard Snell but it's been so long now that I can't accurately remember my impressions...I think I liked them but why??? |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 2882 Registered: May-05 | The Revel Concerta towers are a pretty good suggestion. I liked them a lot. Very dynamic, huge/quick/tight bass. I'm not too sure about synergy. Only one way to find out. Not sure about what they require to be driven properly either. The POS dealer that demoed them for me said my 60 watt B60 wouldn't have any problems. The guy's an ashole, but he's probably right. |
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Gold Member Username: Mike3Wylie, Tx USA Post Number: 1358 Registered: May-06 | Snell's look kicks butt, not the same for their presentation however IMO. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 91 Registered: Nov-07 | Stu, what didn't you like about Revel Concerta that you heard? Mike, why don't you like Snell? The pair that I heard sound very good to me. They are old model, huge and heavy, with an extra tweeter in the back. Art, I just wonder if the new models sound as good as the big ones that I heard. Snell is not popular as other brands so hard to find reviews. |
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Platinum Member Username: NuckPost Number: 10515 Registered: Dec-04 | Weren't Snell and Castle sharing models for a while? Or do I need coffee? |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 7268 Registered: Feb-05 | Loc, it looked like Stu DID like the Revels. |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 2886 Registered: May-05 | If I was looking to buy towers, the Revels would be on my VERY short list. I didn't buy them because there's no way they'd work in my small room. A quick review... You're going to need a good amount of room. They've got two 8" woofers, and a 5.25" mid. They'll easily over power a small room. The room I heard them in is what I consider to be medium sized. They'd probably be at their best in a large or open living room. The cabinets are massive as well. Very tall, wide, and deep. Other than the Focal Utopia towers and a few non-traditional speakers, I can't think of a bigger tower speaker than these. For all those drivers, the sound is extremely cohesive. Nothing sounded disconnected or seperated from the rest of the music. Great bass. It was tuneful, quick, and tight. It'll hit you in the stomach like a sledghammer with the right music. They're laid back. The soundstage doesn't come out much further than the front plane of the speakers. I like a forward presentation, but could have lived with it I had too. The dealer showed me a trick to bring the soundstage more forward - he reversed the (-) and (+) wires on the speakers while leaving the connections on the amp unchanged. Its basically like flipping a phase reverse switch on a pre-amp. It definitely sounded more forward and aggressive, but to my ears the speaker sounded better overall the other way. Imaging and soundstage size are pretty respectable. Not their strongest asset, yet not a liability in any way. They're not Totems or Audio Physics by any means in this regard. Sonically, they do disappear surprisingly well. They're warm and smooth, and not the most detailed speaker I've ever heard. I prefer a more aggressive sound. They're definitely worth checking out. They're easily the best $1500 tower I've ever heard. I heard them side by side with B&W 683s. No contest at all. If the dealer told me the Revels were twice the price of the 683s, I wouldn't have been surprised at all. I heard them connected to a Mac MA6500 integrated amp, which has to be responsible for some its warmth, smoothness, and laid-back nature. That integrated amp is rated at 120 watts/8 ohms and 200/4 ohms. Your gear is no slouch, but it doesn't have the raw power Mac has either. I don't think it'll be an issue, but you never know. I definitely wouldn't buy them without hearing them hooked up to your gear. I'm not saying it'll be a bad match sonically, but I'm not certain it'll be a great match either. I can honestly see it going either way. http://www.revelspeakers.com/products/product.asp?product=19 |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 2887 Registered: May-05 | To sum up what I didn't like - a little too laid back, smooth, and warm. Hooked up to different gear may solve that. They're also too big for my room from a driver size and number standpoint. I'd definitely track down a pair of Audio Physics if available before making a final decision, but the APs are probably going to cost about twice as much. Completely different presentations between them. If my Yaras are indicitive of the rest of AP's line, its a forward, leaner, faster, and more detailed speaker. The better presentation is up to the listener. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 92 Registered: Nov-07 | Thanks Stu for the long and good review. I think I am going to pass these speakers because they are too big for my room (12X30). No wonder Harman company own Revel, the drivers look like the ones in Infinity and JBL. Anyone has experienced with Triangle speakers? I heard they are good with tube amps, just wonder how they match with Naim? |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 3071 Registered: Sep-04 | Loc, In my opinion, the weakest link in your system is the CD player (sorry). You have two options here. 1. Buy the new Naim HiLine interconnect. This will open things up enormously, giving you extra pace, slam and drive. 2. Upgrade to a CD5X or 2nd hand CDX or CDX2. The 5X is more cultured than the others but has better depth than the 5i. The CDX is a bit wilder than the rest. The CDX2 is like a CDX but with better control, particularly in the treble region. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 93 Registered: Nov-07 | Frank, I know that my CDP is the weakest link in my system. I didn't think that upgrading the CDP will open things more that upgrading speakers. I am still looking for a s/h CD5X, the CDX2 is out of my range! The s/h CDX is in my range but I am afraid the transporter or laser will die soon due to age! Should I get the hiline first or upgrade the CDP first in your opinion? |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 124 Registered: Apr-08 | Ioc, You are in the dark lord's terrain now.... source first my friend. |
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Gold Member Username: Mike3Wylie, Tx USA Post Number: 1359 Registered: May-06 | loc, Its been a couple of years since I heard the Snell's but I still remember how sweet they looked on their stands. I thought they were generally OK, but had some coloration to the sound, a little too warm, and lacked (dare I say it) PRAT. I do not remember the entire set up they were in, sorry. I was left with the impression of wanting more for their price point. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 3074 Registered: Sep-04 | loc, It's difficult to say actually. Let me explain: The HiLine introduces loads more resolution and grip, but the 102 is a little bright so can show up a bit. The way to get around the 102's brightness best is to put in a NAPSC (or NAPSC2) which clears a layer of hash in the treble. Both of those are cheaper than the CD5X of course. The 5X is more cultured than the 5i, it has better resolution and grip, so pace is better maintained too. I appreciate what you said about the CDX. This would be my opinion too. Even Naim have limited supplies and in some cases can only offer reconditioned mechs. The HiLine would offer a lot, but I recommend a NAPSC to tame the 102. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 96 Registered: Nov-07 | Frank, I already have the NAPSC, sorry that I didn't list it above. I haven't tried the 102 without it so I don't know how it sound without it. What do you think of the Focal 816V or 826V with my current speakers (Totem Sttaf)? I just want to try new sound from what I have. I will upgrade the CDP in the future, but for now, I'd like to try new speakers. Thanks Loc |
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Silver Member Username: Scorpio1PA USA Post Number: 191 Registered: Nov-07 | Depending on the size of the room the 816V may be a better choice. I'm just now sure the 826V is worth the extra money for the increase in bass response. I first had the 807V and checked into the 816V & 826V before I settled on the 907 Be. YMMV. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 97 Registered: Nov-07 | Ed, can you tell me what did you find on the 816v, 817v, and the 907 be? Thanks. |
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Silver Member Username: Scorpio1PA USA Post Number: 192 Registered: Nov-07 | I had the 807V with my Adcom/Denon gear. Coming from the Klipsch's, I was accustomed bass and (horn tweeters) treble. Sometimes the bass would come across as overexaggerated. The 807V's provided a cleaner sound with better balance. The midrange and treble was much smoother thant the Klipsch, but they could never produce the bass I was looking for. The 816V gave a fuller soundstage over the 807V and also dipped lower in the bass region. Much better soundstage. Very nice on the end of my Naim kit. The 907Be's were then used with my Naim kit and they gather every ounce of detail in the music. Detail, imaging and sounstage were taken to higher levels, but they still lacked the low end I was after. Extremely accurate. Good recording sound great and bad recordings will be revealed as such. Depending on the size of your room, the 816V can be a good fit. I found several reviews about the 816V coming into its own with Naim amps. As everyone here will tell you, a home demo will provide the answers we can not give. Good luck with your seaerch. Ed |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 150 Registered: Apr-08 | Ioc, I have to say it.... s/h Arivas So mofo-ing good. -patrick |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 98 Registered: Nov-07 | Thanks Ed! I will look into that. Patrick, I'd love to get the Arivas but my wife doesn't like the look of them so I have to find others. Loc |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 154 Registered: Apr-08 | Really? Strange. It is a handsome speaker. The Cherry is gorgeous. Is it the "sloped" front? Too modern? Otherwise it is fairly straight-forward. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 3076 Registered: Sep-04 | 'Handsome' is about as nice as one can be about the Ariva's looks. loc, the 800V series is a bit too strong in the bass for some people's taste. That said, they have far more and better resolution and clarity than the Sttaf. The 800Vs are also a bit more room-dependant than many speakers. I have heard them completely overblown in some rooms and quite nicely balanced, if a bit rich for my taste, in others. If you end up not liking the 800V (whichever) because of their rather rich presentation, also consider the 700V range which is a bit lighter in the bass area, giving a more homogenous result. The Focals are certainly different to the Totems. That said, you can get 'diferent' within the Totem range itself actually. If you have the opportunity, have a listen to Totem Model 1 Signatures or Forests. Both of these are really very different to the Sttafs. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 99 Registered: Nov-07 | I know that the Ariva is "handsome", but my wife prefers "pretty" as the Sttafs! . Frank, do you think my 180 has enough juice to drive the Forests? I have to pass the Model 1 because they are bookshelf speakers. |
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Bronze Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 100 Registered: Nov-07 | One more brand of speaker just came up on my mind, pretty Sonus Faber. What do you think? |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 7312 Registered: Feb-05 | Warm and inviting...with Naim, not so much. Not for me, completely different way of looking at music. I like Sonus (I say that far too often...however I really do like different approaches) they are that rare combination that audiophiles often say they are looking for, warm and detailed. PRaT...ummmm, I don't really think so. Others may have different opinions...look forward to reading those. |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 156 Registered: Apr-08 | IMO, unless it is some freaky Gallo or Vandersteen, they all look basically the same. I suppose I am easy to please. |
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Silver Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 101 Registered: Nov-07 | A lot of Naim users on Naim forum like and use SF. I'd like to hear more information from users beside Naim users here. |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 2908 Registered: May-05 | Sonus Faber pairs up very well with McIntosh. The completely opposite approach that Naim takes, yet equally musical IMO. I don't think SF and Naim will mix well. But like evrything in this hobby, there's only one way to find out. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 3080 Registered: Sep-04 | loc I don't think the 180 has enough for the Forests, but it should have enough for the Hawks which are miles miles miles better than Sttafs. Also consider Sonus Faber. Although older SF speakers were warm and smooth and laid back, modern SF speakers have a bit more get up and go and may suit you. There are quite a few Naim owners with SF speakers. |
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Silver Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 102 Registered: Nov-07 | Thanks! I will try to listen to the Hawks and some SF at my local dealer. Loc |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 162 Registered: Apr-08 | The SFs are certainly jaw droppingly gorgeous. The wife should like them. But fairly spendy..... |
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Silver Member Username: PcstocktonPost Number: 163 Registered: Apr-08 | Also, I think it is a little counter-intuitive, But I thought I read something about the Hawks actually being easier to drive than the Sttafs? |
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Silver Member Username: LamcamOrange County, CA USA Post Number: 103 Registered: Nov-07 | Patrick, per specs, the Sttafs are easier to drive than the Hawks. 8 ohms with 6 ohms with 88 dB. |
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Gold Member Username: Mike3Wylie, Tx USA Post Number: 1371 Registered: May-06 | "unless it is some freaky Gallo or Vandersteen," Probably why they work so well in my room.  |
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