Loud efficient SQ subs
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3732 Registered: Jul-06 | Looking for suggestions on subs for my next system......... going for SQ but loud. So I'm pretty much looking for 12" SQ based subs with low Fs (I want it to have real good low end) and high SPL efficiency. So far I've come up with: Fi Q IDMax Now the IDMax is mad expensive, $500, and the 12" Q only has a 85 db spl rating. So I want something similar to those subs but more efficient and reasonable price. Or does that not exist?  |
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Gold Member Username: Nyyfan13Fi SSD USA Post Number: 6878 Registered: Jul-06 | Icon Havoc RL-s Revo when they come out Mag i know im overlooking some more.... |
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Gold Member Username: CenusOhio Post Number: 3808 Registered: Jan-05 | IMHO i look into an AA avlanche motor, low end monster with great sq and will get loud. "the 12" Q only has a 85 db spl rating." wow i figured you of all peole MS would know that sensitivity means pretty much jackshit in car audio, that specs means is uselesss as far as im concerned. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3734 Registered: Jul-06 | Useless...... hardly. While that rating is not everything it is an indicator or the sub's efficiency. A sub with a 93 db efficiency will be louder than one with 85 db rating on the same power. (Assuming both are in their optimum enclosures) Yanks, thank you for the suggestions |
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Gold Member Username: CenusOhio Post Number: 3810 Registered: Jan-05 | "A sub with a 93 db efficiency will be louder than one with 85 db rating on the same power.: wow, sensitivty and efficiency are too very different specs. the 1w/1m is sensitivty not efficiency ehich is a useless spec imo. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3736 Registered: Jul-06 | Getting back on topic: any other suggestions? |
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Gold Member Username: BasssquaredKansas Post Number: 1448 Registered: Nov-06 | did i just see M.S. get PWNED???? nice try on trying to change the subject. |
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Silver Member Username: MmaudioconceptsMurray, KY Post Number: 304 Registered: Jan-07 | in theory MS is right |
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Gold Member Username: Tremor1127Fi Post Number: 2386 Registered: Aug-06 | i would try to find something along the lines of soundsplinter and tc sounds. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3737 Registered: Jul-06 | ^^^^^ thank you........ And change the subject? Try getting back on the subject of the thread. |
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Gold Member Username: Tremor1127Fi Post Number: 2387 Registered: Aug-06 | theres some avalanche 12s on CA.com right now i think. and an 18" avalanche that is MINT for 250 shipped... how much power do you have? |
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Gold Member Username: 420alldaylongPost Number: 2879 Registered: Sep-06 | OZ Audio Eclipse Diamond Infinity KAPPA PERFECT MMAT P3.0 JBL W12GTi |
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Silver Member Username: SkiesCourtenay, British Colu... Canada Post Number: 827 Registered: Aug-05 | .... Sensitivity: the amplitude of the waves created by a subwoofer, usually given in 1w/1m, measured in decibals? Efficiency: Input/output comparison. ex. 1w in = **dB at 1m distance? Or am I way off? |
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Silver Member Username: SkiesCourtenay, British Colu... Canada Post Number: 829 Registered: Aug-05 | But anyways... Agreeing with Tremor, Soundsplinter and TC Sounds sound like they're right up your alley... Infinity Perfects are very nice, and also check out eclipse aluminum. |
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Gold Member Username: Tremor1127Fi Post Number: 2388 Registered: Aug-06 | "Agreeing with Tremor, Soundsplinter and TC Sounds sound like they're right up your alley..." any of those subs are nice for real sql. linear voice coils arent punks... my soon to be home theater sub... http://www.soundsplinter.com/images/rlp18-side-angle-sm.jpg |
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Gold Member Username: Denali_on_22sYou can call me Scroog... Post Number: 3045 Registered: Feb-06 | Hertz audio Mille ML3000 |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3741 Registered: Jul-06 | " how much power do you have? " 3000 watts. I forgot to say in the first post, I'm lookin to do 4 12"s here, so subs about 800-1000 watts each. So far I haven't found any SQ subs more efficient than the Fi Q for similar price, that handle that power. |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5633 Registered: Jul-06 | M.S.,make sure you have that car sound deadened to the max or you'll lose the SQ of your nice sounding subs but I'm sure you know that. |
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Gold Member Username: AdddisorderPalm Beach, Florida Post Number: 5442 Registered: Jan-06 | havoc maybe. just wondering whats the point of going for SQ with 4 12s? |
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Silver Member Username: Santa_fePost Number: 318 Registered: Jul-07 | q-power makes some great SQ subs, thats what i bump and i love em.....the high end stuff is pretty good for the price....anyhitng past the silver series really |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3749 Registered: Jul-06 | Mat dope: The goal here is to create a very loud SQ system. The most cone area I can fit is 4 12" subs. Rob: Don't have any sound deadener, and I don't think it would really do a whole lot for my old Blazer. These trucks are known for having almost eveything on them rattle. Rear window latch, overhead console, door panels, just about every interior piece. Not much can be done about it. |
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Gold Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 7020 Registered: Jun-04 | yeah my buddies old blazer is hittin 140.6 db at idle with four 12's and he rattles and comes close to leaks at the tailgate area too I think |
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Gold Member Username: CenusOhio Post Number: 3818 Registered: Jan-05 | back to topic, read this MS you might learn something. But there are other factors contributing to the overall system efficiency and resulting output levels in a car. The speaker enclosure adds several SPL components, especially using a ported system. The vehicle has what's called "cabin gain," or the many resonances set up as the closed vehicle functions as a resonance chamber similar to what happens inside a loudspeaker enclosure. These items might increase the system sensitivity value by as much as 6db or even more, and increase the overall system efficiency from the lowly speaker averages of 1 or 2% to 50 or 60% or more. So a simple calculation beginning with the speaker's sensitivity rating and working up by adding 3db for every doubling of input power will only tell you part of the story. (BTW, the raw SPL difference between 1 watt and 1000 watts is +30db.) It only indicates what the speaker would do in a free air anechoic test chamber at 1 meter away. A better method is to test the system after installation and determine the overall system sensitivity. Then a calculation to determine required wattage to achieve a particular db SPL value will have much more meaning. Also realize that SPL decreases with distance at a rate of -6db for each doubling of distance. So if the output is 87 db at one meter, at 2 meters the output will be 81 db. It is critical to know where the test mic will be positioned in relation to the speakers to calculate a predicted output level. By the way, loudspeaker efficiency is a measure of how much incoming electrical energy is converted into acoustic energy. Often speaker manufacturers will not give you this value, but for good quality loudspeakers a typical value might be between 0.2 % and 2 % and means that only 2% of the amplifier signal is actually being converted into sound, the rest is being wasted as heat. Some high efficiency subwoofers might get as high as 10% or 15%, but high efficiency speakers like compression drivers designed for pro audio can be almost 100% efficient (100% efficiency is 112db/watt-meter.) You can convert the listed sensitivity number into an efficiency using this formula: Efficiency = 10E(Sensitivity in dB - 112)/10 |
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Gold Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 7030 Registered: Jun-04 | "Also realize that SPL decreases with distance at a rate of -6db for each doubling of distance." shouldn't that read 3 db not 6db |
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Gold Member Username: CenusOhio Post Number: 3822 Registered: Jan-05 | im pretty sure its -6db when you double the distance, if not well im sorry. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3752 Registered: Jul-06 | Dustin I doubt you even understood all of what you just posted, or you wouldn't have said "read this MS you might learn something". " a simple calculation beginning with the speaker's sensitivity rating and working up by adding 3db for every doubling of input power will only tell you part of the story. " As I have already said, the SPL 1w/1m spec is not an exact measurement of how loud the sub will be. It IS useful for estimating one subs potential to be louder than another. " But there are other factors contributing to the overall system efficiency and resulting output levels in a car. The speaker enclosure adds several SPL components, especially using a ported system. " No sh!t. Thats why I said "assuming both subs are on their optimal enclosures". Now I don't want to hear any more about this in this thread. If anyone has any other sub choices, or knows where to get any of these subs for around $250 or so I'd like to hear that. Thanks. |
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Gold Member Username: CenusOhio Post Number: 3826 Registered: Jan-05 | one last thing then i'll let it die, did you even read the last paragraph? You can convert the listed sensitivity number into an efficiency using this formula: Efficiency = 10E(Sensitivity in dB - 112)/10 |
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Gold Member Username: LoudonPost Number: 1924 Registered: Jun-04 | rd sonance |
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Gold Member Username: JkidderGunshine , State Flawda Post Number: 2517 Registered: Nov-05 | icons all the way |
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Gold Member Username: Mike11202DD9515G VFL 200.1 = : , Sewell, NJ US Post Number: 1073 Registered: Nov-06 | 4 Image Dynamics IDQ v3 10" on 2000rms |
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Gold Member Username: FrkkevinResonant Engineering..., Fort Worth... Email Post Number: 4053 Registered: Nov-05 | not once was the 04/05 RE XXX brought up  i'd vote a 12" Mag or 12" XXX also a MKI or MKII Adire Brahma |
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Gold Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 7122 Registered: Jun-04 | four idq 12's are $80 each somewhere on the net plus shipping but I cant find the old post |
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Gold Member Username: Nyyfan13Fi SSD USA Post Number: 6943 Registered: Jul-06 | "not once was the 04/05 RE XXX brought up " only reason i didnt mention it is cause it would be difficult to find 4 of them.....it would just take more time to find them |
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Gold Member Username: InsearchofbassPost Number: 7123 Registered: Jun-04 | those idq 12's were new and it was posted within the last 2 months it was a post about sq I think |
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Gold Member Username: Mike11202DD9515G VFL 200.1 = : , Sewell, NJ US Post Number: 1074 Registered: Nov-06 | the IDQ V3 12's are supposed to come out sometime this month.. |
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Gold Member Username: Tremor1127Fi Post Number: 2407 Registered: Aug-06 | ""not once was the 04/05 RE XXX brought up " only reason i didnt mention it is cause it would be difficult to find 4 of them.....it would just take more time to find them" x2 |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3890 Registered: Jul-06 | " not once was the 04/05 RE XXX brought up " Kevin that's the first sub I thought of when planning for this system. In fact my favorite system that I've ever heard was two XXX 18s. The thing is, I want the subs new. |
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Gold Member Username: FrkkevinResonant Engineering..., Fort Worth... Email Post Number: 4054 Registered: Nov-05 | there was 4 18"s that sold on CA.com .. i think theres actually two of the 15" XXXs on there now.. and why do they have to be new? as long as you buy from a trusted person with a good rep, see all defects shown in the pics you request and know the sub was not abused.. your fine.. sounds like a lot but its really not.. ive bought nearly all my current setup used and saved a ton of cash doing so.. given i have no warranty but whats that matter? if you have good equipment and it is installed properly you don't need warranty I'm in love with my XXX .. running it still in my port wars box lmao.. did a 142.2dB @ 48hz in a sealed box 1.4cu.ft before displacement.. I was suprised ... but what really gets me is how damn good it sounds |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5706 Registered: Jul-06 | In all honesty I think you should stick with your DD M.S. .You wouldn't be able to take advantage of the SQ subs output because you'd be hearing all the rattles which doesn't sound good.This is the reason I decided not to run 4 15'' Mags back in the day.I recommend that you tear apart your vehicle and sound deaden the entire thing and then put your DD back in there.You might be surprised what you hear. |
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Silver Member Username: DenimWww.TeamSSAudio.com, MD Post Number: 492 Registered: Nov-06 | Havoc 12D2 Fs: 30.9 ICON 12D2 Fs: 29.9 RL-p 12D2 Fs: 23.4 RL-s 12 Fs: 30.9 |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3910 Registered: Jul-06 | I appreciate the input Rob, but it's not just the SQ factor that I'm going for....... I really want something with better low end, which SQ subs are good for. DDs tend not to like anything below about 35-38 hz. I figure if I replace my one 9515 with four 12" subs on the same power, it will probably even gain SPL in addition to low end. |
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Platinum Member Username: Bestmankind-apem Post Number: 15677 Registered: Oct-05 | you should go with 4 sound splinter rl-p 12s. |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3918 Registered: Jul-06 | Chad I may just do that....... those subs look badass. Right now it's between those and Fi Q |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5715 Registered: Jul-06 | Will you be selling your 9515 M.S. ?Also what series is it if you are? |
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Gold Member Username: Nd4spd18Northwest PA Post Number: 3920 Registered: Jul-06 | Yes I will most likely be selling it come summer time when I do this new setup. It has an F series. Dave (drivingreckless) has offered $325 for it but when I comes time to sell I'll see if anybody wants to beat that |
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Platinum Member Username: Bestmankind-apem Post Number: 15680 Registered: Oct-05 | i am thinking of switching my subs to the rl-ps. the rl-s are real heavy and require a large box. it takes up my whole trunk space. lol. but i just can't seem to part with my rl-s's. they sound sooooo damn nice. lol. i even started a for sale thread a couple of minutes ago only to delete it right after. lol. hahahaha rob you collecting dd subs now or something? lol. your sub should be arriving there this week. forgot to mention there is a little chip on the magnet. i really did forget so if you don't want it i'll understand and fully refund your money. not only that, i'll send the ups guy out there to pick it up so you don't have to ship it. oh and the chip on the magnet doesn't affect the performance at all. |
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Gold Member Username: Th3pwn3rPost Number:... Post Number: 5718 Registered: Jul-06 | "forgot to mention there is a little chip on the magnet." You guys need to lift weights or something so you don't drop any more precious,heavy subs.It was either you or Charlie who did it!Shame on one of you guys.  |
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Platinum Member Username: Bestmankind-apem Post Number: 15681 Registered: Oct-05 | it was charlie man. come on. lol do you think i would drop a sub? lol. naw charlie bought it like that. |
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Gold Member Username: BasssquaredKansas Post Number: 1461 Registered: Nov-06 | LMFAO at Chad hahahaha oh yeah well i forgot to tell you i dented in the front end of the car but dont worry it dont affect the performance at all lmfao hahahaha just playing Chad |
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