LK I would like to thank you so much for your Expert Advice. It took me few days to read/understand. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU DO FOR A LIVING. But you are LK which stands for LOTS OF KNOWLEDGE. I couldn't respond in the same thread because it was filed away. In any case you gave my procedures in how to use the DTV oval dish with 3 LNB to get 82, 91, 110, 119. I will be adding these extra LNBs.
I also got another question: I have another 10 year old 33" DTV Oval Dish that I like to Doctor with (2 unknown LNB). It was pointing to 97W since it was installed in 1996. I can get 75% good signal but unable to load any channels. So SHOULD I REPLACE IT WITH ONE OR TWO LINEAR LNB TO GET INTEL SAT 5 97W? Can I do anything better with this dish. I like to Doctor with anything challenging!!! Difficult will not stop me.
A dish is just a hunk of metal that reflects signals to the LNB's...so use that dish and use whatever LNB's U want depending on which sats U want..check out www.lyngsat.com
I know about lyngsat. What I was asking is it correct to use linear LNB for 97W? can linear receive other SATs? I can't find information at lyngsat regaurding LNB.
What's the difference? Answer: About -3dB or half the signal level.
Now take your sunglasses off. Notice how bright it is in here? The difference in brightness is an example of using the wrong lnb type.
Circular and Linear polarization refer to the characteristics of the radio wave that is transmitted by the satellite towards your dish/LNB. Below are links to visual comparisons of Circular (Left or Right-hand) and Linear (Vertical or Horizontal) polarization. http://www.lyngsat.com/echo3.html Nimiq 2 @82.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/nimiq2.html Nimiq 1/3 @91.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/nimiq1.html EchoStar 6/8 @110.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/110west.html EchoStar 7 @119.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/echo7.html EchoStar 1/2 @148.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/148west.html
How do I know they are circularly polarized? If you click on any one of the links for the satellites above you will notice that under the first column labeled as "Freq. Tp" you will find one of the following single letter designations:
So what about linear polarization? Linear polarization refers to a wave of radio signal rotating in a single plane. Think of an approaching helicopter as the helicopter's main rotor is moving towards you. It is rotating in a single, horizontal plane. The same approaching helicopter's smaller rear rotor is rotating in a single, vertical plane. In our satellite case it can be either in the "H"orizontal or "V"ertical plane.
The following example satellites (visable in N.America) are transmitting with a linear polarized signal:
SBS 6 @74.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/sbs6.html AMC 5 @79.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/amc5.html AMC 9 @85.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/amc9.html IA 6 @93.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/ia6.html IA 5 @97.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/ia5.html AMC 1 @103.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/amc1.html AMC 2 at 105.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/amc2.html EchoStar 9 @121.0°W http://www.lyngsat.com/echo9ia13.html
Again, under the first column labeled as "Freq. Tp" you will find one of the following single letter designations:
Now that you understand the difference between the two satellite polarization types please put your polarizing sunglasses back on.
Hmmm, a little harder to read this right? Well, that's what happens to your receiver when you try to use a linear polarized LNB to receive a circular polarized satellite signal and vis-a-versa. About a 50% loss of signal!
Armed with the invaluable information you now possess, by using this link http://www.lyngsat.com/america.html you can determine for yourself what type of LNB you will need for each satellite.
If you need a circular polarized LNB look for words describing it as "DSS" or "DBS" or "circular" or a combination of these terms.
If you need a linear polarized LNB look for words describing it as "FSS" or "FTA" or "linear" or a combination of these terms (FYI: All Universal LNB's are linear LNB's).
There are also LNB subtypes such as dual output or quad output. I won't go into that here because there are several discusions on this forum as well as a FAQ dealing with those subtypes. I suggest you use the excellent search feature as well as spend some time reading the all important "Sticky" threads.
You can take your sunglasses off now. _________________
LK or anyone else What about Ku Band C Band? When Do I know I need large or small dish? Can I get anything else beyond what is visible in America with a larger dish?
King Tape..I have No idea WHICH DTV dish and LNB's U are using but if it happens to be a 3 LNB DTV dish then read this...
The Phase III oval dish (FAQ)...this will work for FTA, but is NOT easy to align..in fact, I don't recommend it because of the alignment and what U really can get (2 sats, 1 Bev and 1 Dishnet) ...unless U add more LNB's..its much easier to makes a Poormans dish from a single LNB DTV dish or get a Dish 500..
All about the Phase 3 dish (made for DTV, has 3 LNBs in same enclosure and built in multiswitch.) YES, you CAN use this for your FTA setup to get 91 and 110 !
Advantages 1. You can add 2 LNBs and get 82 and 119 too on same dish. 2. Cheap or free from your DTV system. 3. Use only one wire and get 2 sats. 4. If u add 82 and 119, you'll use 3 ports on your diseq switch.. perfect to hook up an additonal bigger dish and a linear LNB and get birds like Intelsat 5 (T5) on your diseq empty port.
Connection 1. You need only 1 coax cable per receiver connected to the Phaze 3 dish, which is an advantage. 2. It doesnt matter which of the 4 ports you connect to. All 4 are the same in functionality. Your receiver will use the built in multiswitch to select one of the 3 sats. It does that via voltage change and 22khz tone signalling.
What this dish is for and how it was meant to work 1. This dish is for DirectTV. Was made to get the 101, 110 and 119 DTV sats. 2. Looking from behind the dish, the LNB are used like so: .......left lnb = 119 sat ..middle lnb = 110 sat .....right lnb = 101 sat 3. The multiswitch inside uses 22khz tone that is sent by your receiver to switch between 2 sats (just like any other 22khz switch). You'll have to set that up in your Pansat receiver. 4. 2 sats?? Yes! The multiswitch inside also serves as a combiner to combine signal from 110 and 119. So the 22khz will switch between the signal of 110 and 119 combined and the signal of 101
How the built in combiner works 1. The combiner takes TPs 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 28, 30 and 32 from the middle LNB (110) and all the rest of the 32 TPs of the left LNB (119). You cannot change what TPs are combined... Covering middle LNB with foil wont work, cutting traces on the pcb wont work. 2. This is OK for DTV because DTV only has 3 TP's on DTV's 110 (28, 30 and 32) and they are different from the TPs on DTV's 119. (a tp is a frequency band on which up to 14 channels are transmitted). So combining different frequencies on the same wire, works fine. But it will affect your FTA setup.
How the built in combiner affects your FTA setup 1. You can use the Phaze 3 dish to get the 91 (bev) and the 110 (dn) satellites. 2. For that you point the dish to 101 (middle lnb), and adjust the skew. Now the left LNB picks up 110 (looking from behind the dish) and the right LNB picks up 91. 3. The combiner will combine TPs 2,4,6,8,10,12 and 14 from the 101 DTV sat with the rest of the TPs of the 110 DN sat. This means you will not be able to get TPs 2,4,6,8,10,12 and 14 from the 110 sat. but read on to see what your're missing.
What channels will i be missing on my FTA 1. You will be missing only some local channels. (ABC,CBS..etc..), which may or may not be local to you. Thats it ! 2. To see what is missing you go to lyngsat and check to see whats on TP 2,4,6,8,10,12 and 14 on DN's 110 sat. 4. You will see that ALL but 2 of these TPs are of BEAM type... which means you wouldnt have been able to get them ANYWAYS, Unless you are in the area indicated for that particular beam. 5. The 2 conus (available nationwide) tps that you'll be missing are TP 12 and TP 14. Whats on it? Only locals from Lexington, Knoxville, Jackson and Denver.
What you should be pointing it to, to get 91 and 110 FTA setup: Assuming you will point this dish to 101 (middle LNB to 101), you will be able to get 91 and 110 on the 2 outside LNBs WITH proper SKEW, and thats what u want do to if you gonna use it with your Pansat. The middle LNB is useless for FTA setups on Phase 3 dish as it will be pointed to DTV's 101 sat. Also covering this lnb with anything won't help to give u back those locals that you'll be missing. To get the azimuth and elevation for your dish, calculate it for the 101 sat. For skew see below.
DTV setup If you set the dish like above, it will not work for DTV. If you want it to work for DTV you point it to 110 (middle lnb gets 110) and the outer will get 101 and 119. To get the azimuth and elevation for your dish, calculate it for the 110 sat. For skew see below. Or you can use your DTV receiver, enter your zip code and it will give you all settings.
U can't use the Phase 3 dish for DTV and FTA at the same time because you're pointing to different sats.
How to calculate and use Skew: Skew= vertical offset (twist) in degrees from the vertical (from the 90 degrees mark on your dish) 1. Go to Satellite Nut page 2. Enter your location info. 3. Calculate skew for the 2 outter satellites on your dish (for the pansat setup on Phaze3 that would be 91 and 119) 4. Add them toghether and divide by 2 5. U get the skew number. (Disregard the minus sign if its negative)
To use SKEW: You must ensure that the top of the mast is perfectly plum. Best thing is to use an eye round level (home depot,tools section - $3) that u put right on top of the mast. You do that BEFORE you even put the dish on the mast.
If you are on the EAST coast, skew = counter-clockwise rotation in degrees from the 90 deg mark on your phaze 3 dish. Set your dish to 90 minus the skew number If you are on the WEST coast, skew = clockwise rotation in degrees from the 90 deg mark on your phaze 3 dish. Set dish to 90 plus the skew number
Receiver setup No diseq switch is needed, only one wire needs to be connected to the Phase 3 91: 22khz OFF, Diseq - OFF (or ON - doesnt matter) 110: 22khz ON, Diseq - OFF (or ON - doesnt matter)
Can i also get 119 on this dish? Yes, if you have an additional DTV or DN (circular) LNB laying around, you can strap it to the LEFT of the 3 existing LNBs (looking from behind the dish). You will now have to use a DiseqC switch to switch between the wire from the Phaze 3 and the wire from the strapped LNB. Receiver setup with the strapped on 119 LNB Assuming u put the wire from the Phaze 3 in port #1 and the wire from the strapped LNB in port #2, your setup will be: 91: 22 khz OFF, Diseq #1 110: 22khz ON, Diseq #1 119: 22khz OFF (or ON - doesnt matter), Diseq #2
Can i also get 82 on this dish? Yes, if you have an additional DTV or DN (circular) LNB laying around, you can strap it to the RIGHT of the 3 existing LNBs (looking from behind the dish). You will now have to use a DiseqC switch to switch between the wire from the Phaze 3 and the wire from the strapped LNB. Receiver setup with the strapped on 82 LNB Assuming u put the wire from the Phaze 3 in port #1 and the wire from the strapped LNB in port #3, your setup will be: 91: 22 khz OFF, Diseq #1 110: 22khz ON, Diseq #1 82: 22khz OFF (or ON - doesnt matter), Diseq #3
King...that is the hard way...there are many simpler ways..just align 3 LNB's (use 2 dishes..1 with DP with Twin LNB..other with Dual DP LNB), run cables to a disque switch, scan the sats, upload the latest bin,configure the antenna receiver settings, wait for keys to autoroll, reset the receiver in back switch...watch TV
LOL! My god LK... when king asked u about this, u C/P'd that whole f-ing artice to fix his, NOW, u come back when someone else is trying to help someone by knocking YOUR OWN C/P!! WHY, WHY LK would u have not just told the poor guy this in the first place??? LOL,, LOL
C/P from LK
King...that is the hard way...there are many simpler ways..just align 3 LNB's (use 2 dishes..1 with DP with Twin LNB..other with Dual DP LNB), run cables to a disque switch, scan the sats, upload the latest bin,configure the antenna receiver settings, wait for keys to autoroll, reset the receiver in back switch...watch TV
Guys grow up!!! Mr. Copy Cat I don't know your real name or user name to go by but you ain't funny. The Original question was how to make good use for a DTV dish with 3 phase LNB currently pointed to 110. LK sugested if you move it to 101 you can optimized it better. If you did some or any reading LK did not recommend it BUT IT IS ONE DISH. So if you have something useful let's share it. ANY ONE ELSE GOT A BETTER WAY TO GET MULTIPLE SATS FROM ONE DISH? If you don't we'll simply ignore it.
Regarding multiple sat reception, i got an 18 x 24 with a 3 lnb holder witch i use to get 119 and 110, also i have a round 25 inch dish with one circular lnb that ive tried to get bev with, i get a false quality of 75%, and i say "false" cause when i scan for channels i dont get bev i get echostar 8,10 with no info on channels, i am thinking that is probably a damaged lnb, any other idea??
If you scan and get echostar 8 & 10, what is happening is that the dish is not aimed to Bev that is the 91°, you have to move your dish a little bit to the left if you stand behind your dish...If you are getting any sat that means your LNB is working....
This is Correct Even if 82 or 91 SATs got signal level before you scan channels you are not aiming to the center of the beam for 91. So if you move your dish by about 10 degrees twards East. You'll get the right signal.
