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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 3 Registered: Apr-06 | Has anyone hooked up a 4806 to their PC for music playback? I know this is possible but I have yet to experiment. Any feedback would be appreciated.. David Navadel |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1024 Registered: Oct-04 | What kind of connection are you interested in? Just a regular 2 ch analog connection works for most playback, if you want to get serious you can buy better audio cards for the pc that can output digital toslink, coax and even HDMI. Also investing in a better audio card will minimize the computer noise transmitted through the connection. |
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Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 4208 Registered: Mar-05 | A great soundcard for 2-channel music (not recommended for gaming or multichannel DVD) is the Chaintech AV-710, available at newegg.com (read the +200 mostly glowing reviews!) or zipzoomfly.com for around $25-30 shipped. It has the same chip as the much more expensive M-Audio cards costing 4-8 times as much. It does have an optical output which is recommended for maximum SQ. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2981 Registered: Dec-04 | Good one, Ed, thanks. I am trying to determine the best digital storage format and tools for MAX SQ, but I get conflicting info. Lossless, etc. is bogging me down. What is THE hifi 2ch format? |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 4 Registered: Apr-06 | Thanks for the replies guys, I was under the impression that you could connect the PC through the Ethernet port on the 4806 and use it as a controller? I guess I should say I was hoping it would work that way..LOL.. |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1026 Registered: Oct-04 | "A great soundcard for 2-channel music (not recommended for gaming or multichannel DVD) is the Chaintech AV-710, available at newegg.com (read the +200 mostly glowing reviews!) or zipzoomfly.com for around $25-30 shipped. " I bought one of these on-line for $26CAN, the reviews consistantly put it ahead of the Audigy series for music playback, which was exactly what I was looking for. I'll report back when I receive it. |
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Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 4214 Registered: Mar-05 | Nuck, I'm not much of an expert on computer music formats either, but if I had to venture a guess maybe it'd be lossless WMA? Have been very happy with my Chaintech so far, it was definitely a huge improvement over my old Creative external USB soundcard. |
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Gold Member Username: ChitownPost Number: 1083 Registered: Apr-05 | David you raised my interest with your question about the Ethernet port on the back of that unit. There is surprisingly little documentation on this anywhere even in the owners manual. It mentions it as an external controller only in the same vain as the RS232 port which is to be used for software upgrades for its board. Its pretty amazing to me that it mentions nothing in its manual about using this to connect to your home network and letting it see external PC's as a source for music. It makes no sense. Essentially it seems to be a RJ45 jack with no networking capabilities. http://usa.denon.com/AVR-4806_DFU_no_XM_Mic.pdf |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 5 Registered: Apr-06 | Stof I did some searching around and found a product upgrade for the network function on the 4806. As soon I get everything setup (running all new Kef speakers xq5's front, q10c center, ci3-80qt surrounds and rears and new monster wire. I have to open the wall and get up into the attic so it will take a little while before I am up and running) I will try hooking up the PC through the Ethernet port. If you have any luck in the mean time let me know .... I will post any success I have. Here is the link with instructions: http://usa.denon.com/AVR-4806-5805-OM_NetworkUpgrade.pdf Thanks Dave |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 6 Registered: Apr-06 | Stof This update is suposed to be available may/june 2006 but I have yet to find it available for download yet?? We are at their mercy... Owner's Manual For Upcoming Mark II May/June 2006 SPK-554 Ethernet Upgrade Through Denon Service (595KB) (4/21/2006) |
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Gold Member Username: ChitownPost Number: 1086 Registered: Apr-05 | Pfew that makes a lot more sense and is certainly good news for you. It seemed odd to put a jack in there and not give it the capabilities it should have. I don't have the unit myself, but the diagram in that pdf certainly draws everything out for you. Just hook it up to your router and get and IP address and you should be good to go. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2997 Registered: Dec-04 | Man, ya just gotta love new stuff!! |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 7 Registered: Apr-06 | Ya it sure sound straight forward!! I just hope its that easy... More to come. |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1027 Registered: Oct-04 | I have an Xbox 360 hooked up to the PC with the ethernet connecion, using Windows Media Connect (Which you can get free from Xbox.com) you can stream music directly off the PC. However, while the playback is ok for in-game background music, I've found the sound quality to be inferior to playing through an analog connection straight from the PC to the receiver. If this is due to the DACs in the 360 or the ethernet connection is the question. When I receive the Chaintech card I will post further comparisons between the analog connection of my current card vs the Chaintech, also how the optical connection of the Chaintech compares to all including playing MP3 files burnt on a CD and played on a Denon 2910. If you do get the 4806 hooked up post how the sound quality compares. |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 8 Registered: Apr-06 | You bet Kano, I will get it hooked up, It may be trying or easy but I will get it running it is just going to take some time to get my room wired and set. I am still waiting on the KEF CI3-80QT's to arrive.(aproxx 2 weeks) I need all the schematics for the 12 volt system before I cut holes in my ceiling. I have been back and forth on weather or not to bi-wire the front and center speakers? The 4806 does not have 2 sets of terminals so other than providing a heavier gauge wire I cant see the benefits especially being that I am using Monster 12 gauge UL CL3 Rated THX wire. If you guys can shed any positive light on this subject I would appreciate it, if not I think I will just leave the links in place and wire them traditionally. As soon as I can her up and running I will get some feedback for you guys.. Thanks for all the feedback |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1028 Registered: Oct-04 | As far as bi-wiring it depends on the speaker IMO, on my Polks the cheap plate between the binding posts was sub-par to using speaker wire. In the very least you can simply connect the plate with speaker wire. I fully bi-wired with 2 12 gauge cables. I used Tek-flex to wrap the 2 cables together and it looks wicked. It was a few months back so it is hard to describe the improvements but they were there. |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 9 Registered: Apr-06 | 10-4 Kano,, I tell you what, I think I will wire them in place, just run the cables across the floor to test before I run them through the attic. If I get noticeable results I will bi-wire them. How about wall plates? Would it be better to run the cable directly to the speaker or can I use wall plates with good quality binding post to the connect to the speakers? I like to keep things looking neat but no need to sacrifice sound quality at this point. Dave |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1029 Registered: Oct-04 | An alternative to running two sets of wires is to simply connect the two sets of binding posts on the speakers with a 3 inch length of speaker wire, I'm not sure if you caught that above. As far as wall plates, definitely a good long term solution, but what's neater than having the wire come out of the wall directly behind the speakers? |
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New member Username: SnasserPost Number: 3 Registered: May-06 | Hi Nobody knows if the new keys for sat criuser are already on thanks |
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New member Username: Mikemv1977Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Canada Post Number: 9 Registered: Feb-06 | If u want to run digital audio from your comp to ur receiver, just get a sound card with coax and digital output. then run a nice length of RG6 Coax cable with a couple of RCA connections connected to it. Soldering ability may be required. I did this same method with my computer. I have coax cable running to my Denon 3803 in the living room and optical audio running to my Onkyo TX-SR303 in my bedroom where my comp is. My house has never rocked so much from so little effort. and if u make ur own cables, u can save a lot of coin, just be sure that the cable u buy is from Belden or some other decent coax cable maker. Make sure it also has a 75ohm impedence so u get a decent signal transfer. I did a 40ft coax connection to the living room and have no loss of sound at all. Hope u figure it out, let me know. |
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Gold Member Username: ChitownPost Number: 1087 Registered: Apr-05 | Still Kano raises a good question on whether or not an Xbox can have decent DAC's. My impression would be that they would not since they don't really care what people do with analog audio. Most games are digital and that's really why you buy an Xbox. I don't think there is a loss of sound in the transmission itself since it is going on ethernet. I have heard a Mcintosh audio music server, and it was just magnificant. Of course at $4500 it'd better be. |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1031 Registered: Oct-04 | Holy crapola, I received the Chaintech card by Purolator in 2 DAYS! This is unheard of living where I do, last on-line order took 6 weeks to get here. I've got this baby installed and have listened for a couple of minutes. First thing noticed was the computer noise is now completely gone, the audio quality is noticably better, but I will post back more conclusively, especially after I A/B the digital vs. analog connection through the receiver. |
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New member Username: NavadelPost Number: 10 Registered: Apr-06 | Well I had disappointing call to Denon today inquiring about the upgrade for the Ethernet port. According to Denon "IF we decide to implement the upgrade" it wont be for at least 2 months and then it will require the owners to send in the amp to New Jersey (there will be a waiting list) as well as to pay for the "expensive upgrade". All I can say is bummer.. I guess I will have to work another magic.. I hear good things about the HP Media Center but it is an expensive unit... Hmmmm decisions decisions... On a good not my XQ5's arrived today!!! they are pretty in maple,, cant wait to hear them... Dave |
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Gold Member Username: ChitownPost Number: 1092 Registered: Apr-05 | Did you ask them why they made you essentially pay for a port with no usage? This is really bringing Denon down on my list. |
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Bronze Member Username: NavadelPost Number: 12 Registered: Apr-06 | Their claim is that the Ethernet port is beneficial for downloading upgrades. I am not to happy with this either being that this was one of the reasons I decided on this AVR, however it still has quite a few good attributes. Like I said in a earlier post I am at their mercy and that's not very comfortable. I will contact them again in letter form with the feedback I have received from this and other forums and invite them to read what their consumers are saying about their decision, probably just a waist of time but there is nothing to loose... |
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Gold Member Username: ChitownPost Number: 1093 Registered: Apr-05 | Upgrades are why receivers put in an RS232 port. There is no reason to put both in there. |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1036 Registered: Oct-04 | Chaintech AV710 - Great card with a lot of good features. Comparing it to on-board sound is no comparison, the Chaintech's output is better in every regard whether through the optical or line out connection. Unfortunately the card does not have 2ch analog output, so while it sounds good through the single RCA line out, the optical output is clearer with better channel separation. The card has the ability to change the output between 48 and 96 KHz, still not sure which is better. Also after reading on AVSFORUM I discovered it is possible to have "bitt perfect" playback, which basically refers to bypassing Windows' KMixer to output the audio without any processing. If this has tangible benefits for MP3 playback or just CD I'm not sure. You must use either Foobar or WinAmp for the player and use either a Kernel or Asio plug-in. Also you must have a certain driver and possibly flash the BIOS with some Prodigy BIOS which is meant for another card. If anyone can shed some light on whether it is all worth the trouble I would appreciate it. |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1037 Registered: Oct-04 | SUCCESS! Edster may be the only one interested but I managed to get output without resampling with the Chaintech card and I didn't have to flash the card's BIOS or anything complicated. Get version 3.10a of the audio deck and install it after uninstalling the current version and rebooting. Download ASIO4ALL and install that. In the preferences max out the buffer size, and the kernel buffers, leave everything else unchecked. Now in the Audio deck settings, first change the channel output to anything but high res, then change the optical output to PCM, and check auto under sample rate. Then go back to the optical page and select AC3/PCM, this tricks the sound driver to output the native sample rate, which ASIO4ALL receives and bipasses the Windows KMixer. Bit Perfect stream if I'm not mistaken. The difference is better bass definition, and elimination of the high frequency hiss in some recordings which makes sense since some guy at AVSFORUM explained the Kmixer manages to roll off some high and low end during the multiple resamplings. |
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Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 4229 Registered: Mar-05 | Thanks Kano, when I have a chance I may try what you've done. Right now am plenty happy with the SQ I'm getting through my 2.1 Logitech office setup though. The "flash" option described in your first post struck me as way too complicated, so your alternative option looks much more doable. My only significant gripe is that the Chaintech doesn't work after my PC goes into hibernation, have to restart completely. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3081 Registered: Dec-04 | I'm listening too, Kano. |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1039 Registered: Oct-04 | I'm really happy with the music playback on the PC now. Not only is the audio quality from the Chaintech card great, I've now configured everything for great background music. First I switched to WinAmp for the player, the amount of skins and plug-ins is very extensive, I have a wicked graphic spectrum analyzer, and the song information displayed bottem right at all times. Then I found a plug-in for ATI's remote wonder which I had lying around (Came with a TV tuner card I no longer use). Now I can skip songs and control the player from the couch. I like having all the media I have on the PC shuffling, this is a perfect set-up for me. Only complaint is the remote wonder controller uses radio freq. instead of infared, so I can't control the PC with my Logitech Universal. |
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Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 4232 Registered: Mar-05 | Cool. Have you figured out any solution to the hibernation problem? |
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Gold Member Username: KanoBC Canada Post Number: 1040 Registered: Oct-04 | No plug-in will fix that, if the newest Envy driver has the card deactivate in hibernation, there's nothing you can do but request a driver update from VIA. Only other option is to switch to another driver like the Prodigy, which may fix the problem. My computer's set to always on in Power Mgmt., so it's not an issue for me. I just leave it on constant shuffle, Winamp never crashes like Windows Media Player would, the CPU usage is only like 4% |